Author |
Message |
Mr. Motorhead Mad Scientist
Joined: January 06, 2004 Posts: 717 Location: Practitioner of 36hp alchemy
|
Posted: Tue May 11, 2010 9:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
mightymouse wrote: |
any reason to NOT counterweight? |
The most obvious reason would be that it costs more.........this crank costs about $450 shipped, counterweights add about another $100. The other reason is that this engine will not be an all out race machine, just a driver. As mentioned in other threads these are neither high horse power or high RPM engines because of the limitations of the cylinder heads ( 5000 rpm valve float? ) The extra rotating mass is good for some applications, but not this one since a full weight flywheel is to be used. Low end torque will be greatly improved and that's what we're looking for. _________________ 30 years experience in the sales of new and used auto parts!
36 horsepower parts for sale at http://www.aircooledresearch.com/
Or the new site at http://www.bugparts.com
Check out the Bonneville project:
http://aircooledresearch.com/docs/thebonnevilleproject.html#
"All limitations are self imposed."
Some Chinese guy |
|
Back to top |
|
|
grueni Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2008 Posts: 582 Location: Germany
|
Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:09 am Post subject: |
|
|
now when i reach peak hp passibly over 6000RPM and i plan on the "big one" for next...what is the different in lubrication between the possible crankshafts and what is the best way to go?
stock
porsche 356 50mm mains
later porsche 356
okrasa
stock crank just has 1 drill per main to the rods
porsche 50mm main has two per journal and the rod journals are drilled across the journal and the bore from the mains meet at the middle....two bores per journal and 1 bore to connect main and rodjournal
how are the other cranks designed?
i know there are some porsche 356/912 that can rev over 8000RPM without lubrication problems...
i would love to go with porsche 356 50mm mains but is that crankdesign good for huge hp and rpm?
what about 1,5-2mm gap's in the main bearings to improve lubification to the rods?
some input? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
gimmesomeshelter Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2004 Posts: 1466 Location: San Carlos, CA
|
Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hello-
Duane Spencer argues that the C and SC cranks can support much higher RPMs because they're cross drilled and have thinker mains (55mm). The downside is that you must use $400 Porsche bearings, and machine oil groves and slots for the bearing tangs to your case.
Even with a 356 C/SC crank, I have no idea the oiling system can handle the required volume of oil.
Paul
PS. Mr. Spencer's book is back in print. http://www.amazon.com/Porsche-Performance-Guide-Du...amp;sr=1-3 _________________ "I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned."
Richard Feynman |
|
Back to top |
|
|
grueni Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2008 Posts: 582 Location: Germany
|
Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 11:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
thanks, thats the awnser...if one of the crank types is cross drilled.
for sure the bigger mains can do alot, but the price of porsche mains is stupid.
how about the okrasa cranks...are these cross drilled?can dpr cross drill the 36er stroked cranks?
i think a good full flow, bigger pump, bigger maingalley and opened oil bores can improve the lubification if needed.
i still like the idea of gap's on the main bearing so it have 360° and all time under pressure..that pressure should help a non cross drilled cranks to push oil to the rods on high rpm's right. and i could machine these gaps at my own... does somebody did that? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
gimmesomeshelter Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2004 Posts: 1466 Location: San Carlos, CA
|
Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 8:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hello-
You might want to consider consulting with Jake Raby. I believe that a basic consultation costs ~ 250 USD. I would bet that he would either give you some very good suggestions, or tell you why you should consider another project.
Paul _________________ "I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned."
Richard Feynman |
|
Back to top |
|
|
grueni Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2008 Posts: 582 Location: Germany
|
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 12:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
to pay for a consultation that is not my spirit. for sure he would give good suggestions but it is "just" the lubification of bearings and i only want to know how all these cranks are drilled for lubication the mains and rod bearings. and maybe other ways to improve that.
open is..how are the okrasa cranks drilled? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
nsracing Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2003 Posts: 9481 Location: NOVA
|
Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 3:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
Man, it was laborious reading through all this stuff.
I am very much interested on an all-out 36HP. I got my 4 complete cores from a friend of mine. I tore one and I think there is plenty of improvement that can be done to it.
The parts are small enough one can make everything from billet materials. The camshaft is so tiny you can make one out of tool steel.
Is there a particular car body you have to use also for the competition? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
36hplandspeedracer Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 847 Location: Ivins, Utah
|
Posted: Wed May 26, 2010 5:47 am Post subject: nsracing |
|
|
Below I have copied the body guidelines for the 36hp Challenge found at www.burlyb.com . The main thing is to have fun in whatever category you choose and to set your own personal best 36hp record and then continue to try and improve on the speed you have posted.
BODY/VEHICLE-Any year Type 111/113/133 stock Volkswagen Beetle, Super Beetle or Cal Look sedan body with stock VW bumpers(NOTE: Convertible and sliding cloth sunroof bodies require added safety equipment-(i.e. bolt-in 4 point roll bar available from EMPI suppliers- part #3116 ). Type 1 Karmann Ghia and pre-67 Type 2 bodied cars will compete in separate body style only ( one Ghia, one pre-67 Type 2 ) categories and will not be eligible for recognition beyond 36hp Challenge record listings or be eligible for top speed 36hp Beetle records. All metal body and fenders with all lights, VW bumpers(full width-note “ T Bar” or Cal-Look style bumpers are not allowed), and running boards in place and functioning. Wiper blades & arms, antenna, outside mirrors and license plates may be removed during competition but must be in place prior to and through technical inspection. Interior must include two front seats, rear seat back(bottom portion of rear seat may be left out), headliner and door panels. Deck lid standoffs are not allowed!
NOTE: All VW’s not fitting within the described body and axle beam guidelines will be eligible for “1” Club recognition.
NOTE: All 36hp Lakesters, Formula Vees, Streamliners, Dragsters, Chopped or Sectioned VW’s, Buggies, Baja Bugs, Kit Cars, Trikes or other “race” cars that pass their respective sanctioning bodies safety inspection procedures will be eligible for “1” Club recognition.
For cars going for unlimited top 36hp speeds, the "1" Club guidelines can be found at:
http://www.ultimateaircooled.com/landspeed.html
If you have any other questions, please PM me or contact me though the email address at www.burlyb.com .
May the Speed be with you.............
Burly |
|
Back to top |
|
|
tommy-turtle Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 165 Location: roseville
|
Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 10:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
TomSimon wrote: |
tommy-turtle wrote: |
Any one machined a set rocker stand off a 36head and fit a set of custom made shafts? After the machining and shorting down a set of 1600 shafts you could have a wide range of arms and ratios available... |
I saw a set last Friday, aftermarket T1 ratio rockers on modified T1 shafts, on modified 36hp pedestols, all custom machined to function like T1. Not cheap to do, very time consuming
tommy-turtle wrote: |
Also any one ever done the jaguar valve spring trick that was... |
I am not familiar with that trick.... what is it Tommy? |
sorry it took a wile for me tO find the info.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9...;start=320
the page it came from cam from this link
http://www.oldspeed.ch/pages/souping/press-souping32.htm
any plart place or repair store that deals with worldpac can get them. Their part # is c7136/7
Dont have the spring pressure but at least I can get you some guidance. _________________ 5 lbs into 3 lbs bag every day
Nitrous its what my dentist uses |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Roadcow Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2003 Posts: 1012 Location: Stockton, Ca. area
|
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have 2 spare 175 70 15 tires which are H rated if anyone needs them. Please let me know by Tuesday if you want me to bring them back. _________________ 71 Westy Roadcow
67 Panel
63 Bug
66 Ghia Bonneville 2014
74 Ghia Vert
69 Bonneville Ghia 150 in Chico
69 Bonneville Ghia in Ireland
80 Cabby 2.1 16v
98 Passat |
|
Back to top |
|
|
splitpile Samba's Worst Speller
Joined: May 03, 2000 Posts: 5927 Location: back to living where hell meets the suface
|
Posted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I heard that BRAND NEW 36 hp cams might be available soon, that's all I know now. With the success of the WW Okrassa kits more and more interest in performance 36 hp engines, companies seem to be coming on board with lots of much need new parts.
Aluminum valve covers and deep sumps would be really nice _________________ Stocking distributor of "The Funky Green Panels"
www.BUSTORATION.com metal and more for your bus
"no more hacking my sig line" |
|
Back to top |
|
|
FRK Samba Member
Joined: December 09, 2002 Posts: 2652 Location: Orange county, CA
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Roadcow Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2003 Posts: 1012 Location: Stockton, Ca. area
|
Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 12:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm having a guy build the 36 Hp Aluminum Valve covers. I asked him to make the casting extra thick on the rocker side in case we need room for high lift Rockers. They should be ready in a couple of weeks. They will have OKRASA name on them or can be milled or acid etched for custom names.
I have been informed that Joe Ruis has the rights to the Okrasa name so I will "NOT" be adding this to the Valve Covers in fairness to Joe. _________________ 71 Westy Roadcow
67 Panel
63 Bug
66 Ghia Bonneville 2014
74 Ghia Vert
69 Bonneville Ghia 150 in Chico
69 Bonneville Ghia in Ireland
80 Cabby 2.1 16v
98 Passat |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Julio Iniguez Samba Member
Joined: April 19, 2004 Posts: 130
|
Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 3:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Wow Frank, great shots! What kind of set up do you use? I'm suprised you got them so clear since I was going by you so fast, I think it was about 101mph in the 1/8 mile Yeah right, the best I ran that day was a 10.89@61.? Got a few mods for the off season so we'll see.
I posted something in the Drag Day thread in Shows and events aimed at you Ed and Tim, check it out. THANKS again for everthing!!!!!!!!! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
tommy-turtle Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 165 Location: roseville
|
Posted: Mon May 16, 2011 10:15 pm Post subject: Re: Souping the Volkswagen |
|
|
Paul
Thank You again I use this a lot when at work and there is slow time.
Also I know most can just go out and buy WW heads and make ther car look cool. But what about the rest of the people . The economy might suck and it might take 6 months to due what you could have done in a month a few years ago. But nothing since 2010 Shame on me .
Still working on the daily driver with a 36hp, not the fastest car but it will move
_________________ 5 lbs into 3 lbs bag every day
Nitrous its what my dentist uses |
|
Back to top |
|
|
tommy-turtle Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 165 Location: roseville
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 12:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Cross Post in case no one in here is not watching the the Wolfsbergs West Okrasa head post
After what seemed forever they are done.
That is Okrasa head with either Solex 40p11 or Weber carburetor.
Thank You Ray for putting up with all the complaining, griping, the internet keyboard fighters for all the CRAP that people CLAIM is theirs. You put up the money and the time to get it done and for that I thank you.
Thank you for the manifolds, exhaust, the pulley, rockers and when the supercharger comes out I will be in line for that also. Besides a few other companies out there making stuff for 36hp thank you. Thank you for making the stuff in the USA (even though the cars are from Germany)
(RAY when the web sight comes up with all the stuff, you better be ready to ship it all around the world. ) _________________ 5 lbs into 3 lbs bag every day
Nitrous its what my dentist uses |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Julio Iniguez Samba Member
Joined: April 19, 2004 Posts: 130
|
Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:55 am Post subject: Bug-In T-6 class |
|
|
Just wondering if there is anyone planning on racing the 36hp T-6 class at the Bug-In? 2 cars so far, can we get more? How about the Nor-Cal boy's, Ray,Larry,Chris? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
AirCooledClassics Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2004 Posts: 294 Location: Saskatoon, Sk Canada
|
Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 11:17 am Post subject: did I just set a new record? |
|
|
We ran the new 1623cc engine at the track this sun. I just realized My 1/8th mile time is 10.558 at 61.76 mph . Is this recognised as a Best time. The engine is running legal for the WW challenge. Does anyone know how to apply for this challenge. I know land speed records are recognized. Never the less we are pretty happy. _________________ 2010 Bonneville record holder Type 2, 36hp
NHRA Divisional Sports Compact Champion
My You-tube video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJoq3MtsPmc
My National Dragster article
http://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCStory.asp?ID=231552 |
|
Back to top |
|
|
esde Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007 Posts: 5969 Location: central rust belt
|
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:02 am Post subject: Re: Drag Racing and a 36hp unlimited class |
|
|
Please pardon me while I exhume this from the grave..
Just read through all 25 pages, and wow there is a lot of great info! On page 23, bvilletom has some insight on porting 36hp heads, and offered to share the info. Has anyone been in touch with him? I see he hasn't logged on since 2015, and a PM went unreturned.
SD _________________ modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
36hplandspeedracer Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 847 Location: Ivins, Utah
|
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: Drag Racing and a 36hp unlimited class |
|
|
esde wrote: |
Please pardon me while I exhume this from the grave..
Just read through all 25 pages, and wow there is a lot of great info! On page 23, bvilletom has some insight on porting 36hp heads, and offered to share the info. Has anyone been in touch with him? I see he hasn't logged on since 2015, and a PM went unreturned.
SD |
Esde, Tom has fulfilled his VW land speed dreams and has returned to making his 1000cc turbocharged 3 cylinder Geo Metro go even faster (135 mph plus). And enjoying some wintertime gold panning in Arizona. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|