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GrindGarage
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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 Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:25 pm Post subject: My "vanny" thread w/ PICS Small Car Suby Swap |
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Been around this forum since I first bought my 91 in the summer of 2008. Definitely the best tool in my box for figuring out whats up with these vans. I was able to purchase my van for $750 with a little over 200,000mi on it due to constantly overheating and some shop telling the PO that it needed a new motor. Since then I have replaced the entire cooling system and everything has been good until:
IT GETS COLD OUT!
Meaning once the temps outside get around 40 and below and its time to use the heat the coolant temp gauge drops and then spikes! When this happened I felt both sides of rad and it was cool. Well no more using the heat. And FYI the system is all new and tight!
Here is what I am thinking. When I run at 30mph + speeds the coolant gauge reads between cold and the led light (in any weather even 90deg days with AC on). Mb I have too cold a thermostat installed? I bought the tstat and housing from a van parts only store here in NJ.
Other thing is that I have totally removed rear heater and tranny cooler from the cooling system. Mb to much bypass in the system?
If I let the van idle the gauge will come up to led and stay there night and day in any weather cooling fan will cycle when needed but gauge doesn't move. And the right side is hotter then the bleeder side.
I am suspecting the tstat. My MPG is around 15 when doing 60 on highway and don't like where the coolant temp reads. I do have a replacement tstat and will post a pic to see if you guys think it is correct. Right now I am putting about 500mi a week on her and don't have the time to change right away but will get to it. Also going to post pics of cooling system.
Will get img asap just gotta use my cell to upload since I'm in a hospital.[/img]
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com
Last edited by GrindGarage on Wed Dec 29, 2010 2:47 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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Vanny
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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GrindGarage
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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thermostat housing
Big hose goes right to rad pipe and smaller hose goes to front heater core without tees etc.
Hoses over trans
spare t-stat ANYONE know if this is factory temp?
coolant temp in warm weather
runs lower when outside temps are below 40
coolant temp idle
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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78BayDriver
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Joined: September 27, 2007
Posts: 247
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| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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looks almost perfect...
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1987 Vanagon GL 2.1 Flat Stanley (present)
1991 Golf GTi Forest Green
1981 Vanagon L 1.6 Diesel
1978 BayWindow Bus
1974 Bus
1990 Jetta
1979 Dasher Wagon
1972 Beetle |
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presslab
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Joined: September 29, 2008
Posts: 1730
Location: Sonoma County
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| Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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So where does the gauge sit when the heater is on? Some movement is ok, cheaper thermostats have more swing and aren't as stable. I'd recommend a thermostat from the dealer if it's a big deal.
Cool looking van, I like the style. 
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1986 Vanagon Westfalia EJ25
1988 Subaru GL-10 EJ20G --- 2000 Honda XR650L
2010 Titus El Guapo --- 2011 On-One 456 Ti |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:37 am Post subject: |
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when the outside temp drops the gauge will swing lower, and then spike. Thats why i'm thinking thermostat. When this happens the radiator is cold. Anyone know if the t-stat pictured is the factory temp, and or of good manufacture?
_________________
-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:39 am Post subject: |
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Just put on my thinking cap and checked van-cafe website:
Thermostat - 87 degree (stock) temperature
025.121.113F
The part # matches the one on the box some I'm gonna assume its the same part.
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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presslab
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Joined: September 29, 2008
Posts: 1730
Location: Sonoma County
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 7:33 am Post subject: |
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| GrindGarage wrote: |
| when the outside temp drops the gauge will swing lower, and then spike. Thats why i'm thinking thermostat. When this happens the radiator is cold. Anyone know if the t-stat pictured is the factory temp, and or of good manufacture? |
Swing lower to where on the gauge? And then spike up to where?
A handy tool is an IR thermometer, you can measure the temperature of the engine when all this is going on, removing the dash gauge from the equasion.
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1986 Vanagon Westfalia EJ25
1988 Subaru GL-10 EJ20G --- 2000 Honda XR650L
2010 Titus El Guapo --- 2011 On-One 456 Ti |
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HeftySmurf
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Joined: June 15, 2008
Posts: 879
Location: Washington, USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:12 am Post subject: |
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Did it come like this?
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-Lorenzo
90 GL w/ Bostig |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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Heftysmurf
If u mean the brush guard it came off a pathfinder and I bolted and welded some square tubing through the metal bumper behind the fiberglass pretty strong unit.
Presslab
In the pic at highway speed the temp gauge would read much lower when outside temps get below 40. If I turn on the heat under these conditions the gauge would drop even lower then spike. When I stoopped I checked the rad it was cold and when I spit on the heads it would boil.
I waited for it to cool and topped off the overflow and pressure tanks and bleed off. Since then no problems. The heater core doesn't leak and the van uses no antifreeze. Radiator and all cooling components are no more then 1 year old and I use premixed 50/50 only.
I either figured to cool a thermostat that was unable to regulate temps at speed or too much coolant bypass to heater core and it was doing job of rad or a combo of both. Guess I'll start with using t-stat that I have and see what happens.
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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wcdennis
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Joined: July 20, 2004
Posts: 955
Location: Winston-Salem NC
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| If your spit is boiling on the heads, they are way hot. First question: have you ever had heat? My guess (which may be a long shot) is that there is still a bunch of air trapped in the heater circuit. When you open the valve enough gets pulled into the main system to cause an airlock. I might try carefully (with bucket and rags handy) pulling the top hose off your heater core to see if there is coolant in there. |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
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Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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had great heat. never a problem. done bled the thing couple times after any cooling system work.
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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Vanaman
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Joined: August 11, 2010
Posts: 131
Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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| wcdennis wrote: |
| If your spit is boiling on the heads, they are way hot. First question: have you ever had heat? My guess (which may be a long shot) is that there is still a bunch of air trapped in the heater circuit. When you open the valve enough gets pulled into the main system to cause an airlock. I might try carefully (with bucket and rags handy) pulling the top hose off your heater core to see if there is coolant in there. |
This is what I was thinking, might try bleeding it again. It also looks like your getting low on fuel.
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tencentlife
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Joined: May 02, 2006
Posts: 10075
Location: Abiquiu, NM, USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| GrindGarage wrote: |
thermostat housing
Big hose goes right to rad pipe and smaller hose goes to front heater core without tees etc. |
What do you mean by that, the smaller hose goes to the heater? Which smaller hose? Do you mean to the transmission oil cooler?
The medium-diameter hose exiting top-right of the pic above should cross over above the bellhousing and join the coolant manifold just forward of the right head, fastened to the front of the bulkhead.
If you've plumbed that hose to the heater loop, or stranger yet to the "front heater core without tees", you are going to get crazy things going on. This isn't what you did, is it? I must be misreading you.
If I could see these pics it would help answer my questions. From what I can make out it doesn't look normal.
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Experience is kryptonite to doctrine. |
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GrindGarage
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Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:46 am Post subject: |
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I did word that wrong. All the hoses go to the stock location except that I have removed tranny cooler for small car unit and did away with the hose with the tee. Also removed rear heater and its tees in the system but all hoses are where the factory put them. The heater core hose is under the rad hose. right hose goes over trans. and 2 smaller hoses join up to bleeder manifold around engine bay. Man when I got this thing I almost took it into the woods to leave it where it died. Never spent so many hrs replacing manifolds and hoses on any other car, I think it was a 12hr day that thermostat housing and its lousy hardware drove me nutz.
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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tencentlife
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Location: Abiquiu, NM, USA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Then it sounds like the t-stat is stuck open.
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wcdennis
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Joined: July 20, 2004
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Location: Winston-Salem NC
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm still skeptical that a bad thermostat would cause lack of heat AND a spike in the engine temp. Does the heat work at idle? |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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heat works all the time. Today was warm out and when at idle temp stays on led and rad fan cycles on and off. I think I may have installed cool t-stat because when at speeds over 40mph it is below the led. Anyway will install the t-stat that I have and trust its good since its from vancafe and of good quality in hand, compared to any stant that I have ever worked with.
Today I drove from Copper Hospital in Camden, to wharton state park. Did some single track mtn biking with my daughter in her burley solo. Then got the itch to do a 20mi drive through the trails. Nice outing and great park. Trying to get my hands on a canoe. Lots of still waters back there. Heres a quick pic of vanny in the woods:
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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| wcdennis wrote: |
| I'm still skeptical that a bad thermostat would cause lack of heat AND a spike in the engine temp. Does the heat work at idle? |
Only spikes at speed over 40mph. Tired of it happing so quit touching heat controls. Will change t-stat soon I hope been logging around 250mi a week right now.
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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GrindGarage
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 710
Location: Ocean City, NJ
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| Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:38 am Post subject: |
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Man I gotta do some wrenching on my van. On my way to Camden yesterday I was doing 60 on the highway And hit an expansion joint and the engine cut out for a solid 3 seconds as I started to head for the shoulder she backfired and I was back on my way.
Read through some previous threads and I am gonna check the following:
Grounds
Battery connections
Relay ecu and fuel pump
Ignition switch
Fuel pump connection
Hall sensor wires to dizzy
Anything I'm missing?
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-cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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