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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:26 pm Post subject: Giving up on leaking rear axle seal |
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I don't want to, but unless someone can talk me out of it, I'm planning to drive my Bug to the Bugformance shop to get the rear-left axle leak stopped.
I've put in new inner and outer spacers, but the weep hole just keeps weeping tranny oil - I've tried 4 times, with new o-rings, gasket and seals each time. The axle nut and 4 14mm nuts are torqued to spec, if not over spec, for the axle nut.
I did the right side as well, and it does not leak. The only difference between the left and right, that I can tell is the outer diameter of the axle itself. I had to use a little force with a punch and ball peen hammer to get the bearing on the right side axle, but the left side just slips on. But the smaller o-ring should take care of that, right?
I'm sure it leaked for some of the POs as well, except the weep hole was clogged and the inside of the brake drum and backing plate were just a big mess of old oil and shoe dust.
HELP ME IF YOU CAN!! _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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lucille66 Samba Member
Joined: June 29, 2008 Posts: 633 Location: ORANGE COUNTY
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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Have you tried replacing the axle seal itself? |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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lucille66 wrote: |
Have you tried replacing the axle seal itself? |
Not sure what you mean - I've replaced everything except for the axle and axle tube. If you mean the boot, yes. _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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berliner Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2006 Posts: 440 Location: west coast canada
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:10 pm Post subject: leak |
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Does it have the same seal housing as the other side?If it's been leaking since before you got it,maybe the housing got replaced in the past.I think there's three different types.I found this out the hard way.If possible compare it to the other side. _________________ I'm part of the problem. |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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Do you mean the bearing housing, that is attached with the 4 14mm bolts, or the seal inside that housing? If not, please tell me which number it is in the exploded view in the Bently. _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Anyone have an idea the difference between the 3 seal / bearing housings? _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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thomas. Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2010 Posts: 1288 Location: South West (Pa.)
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berliner Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2006 Posts: 440 Location: west coast canada
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Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:22 pm Post subject: leak |
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It's the housing,the part that the four bolts hold in place. _________________ I'm part of the problem. |
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bill may Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2003 Posts: 14160 Location: san diego,ca
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Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:25 am Post subject: |
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GregKnod wrote: |
Anyone have an idea the difference between the 3 seal / bearing housings? |
depth of bore for bearing to seat in.
if you are installing the thin washer that the small o-ring gets sandwich's between it and spacer,please throw it in the trash. it is incorrect thickness and bends causing torn o-ring which causes leak.
if you have 66 (short axle short spline) and older use xxx xxx 311 4bolt bearing retainer. if 1967 (long axle short spline) only use xxx xxx 311A retainer and if you have 68 long axle and long spline check on 68 and newer forum cause i forget. _________________ Admin note: Bill Passed away - July, 2017
1965 panel bus-Kermit
"Camping is cheaper than therapy"
www.sv2s.com
www.steeringboxscrapers.net
SBS #100
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=453617 |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:10 am Post subject: |
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bill may wrote: |
GregKnod wrote: |
Anyone have an idea the difference between the 3 seal / bearing housings? |
depth of bore for bearing to seat in.
if you are installing the thin washer that the small o-ring gets sandwich's between it and spacer,please throw it in the trash. it is incorrect thickness and bends causing torn o-ring which causes leak.
if you have 66 (short axle short spline) and older use xxx xxx 311 4bolt bearing retainer. if 1967 (long axle short spline) only use xxx xxx 311A retainer and if you have 68 long axle and long spline check on 68 and newer forum cause i forget. |
In regards to "66 (short axle short spline) and older use xxx xxx 311 4bolt bearing retainer. if 1967 (long axle short spline) only use xxx xxx 311A" what are the dimensions of the splines, so I can measure mine? _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:30 pm Post subject: About to give up fixing rear axle leak |
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I took both rear brake drums off today to see if the P/Ns are correct and if they are the same.
The P/N is 311501311 on both, however there is a stamped 2 digit number that is not the same: Driver's side is "29" and passengers side is "19".
Driver's side is leaking.
I currently do have the thin washer / spacer on the axel just outside the the bearing.
Anyone have an idea what the 2-digit numbers mean on the housings? _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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Once I took the bearing housing off and started looking at the components, I saw that the thin spacer / washer had cut the small o-ring in half nearly all the way around. Take a look:
As billy may wrote "throw it out" - I'm doing just that! _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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bill may Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2003 Posts: 14160 Location: san diego,ca
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Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: About to give up fixing rear axle leak |
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GregKnod wrote: |
I took both rear brake drums off today to see if the P/Ns are correct and if they are the same.
The P/N is 311501311 on both, however there is a stamped 2 digit number that is not the same: Driver's side is "29" and passengers side is "19".
Driver's side is leaking.
I currently do have the thin washer / spacer on the axel just outside the the bearing.
Anyone have an idea what the 2-digit numbers mean on the housings? |
casting/form numbers. has no meaning outside of foundry. i figured that washer was your problem. original washers are long gone,as everyone figures "new is better".. you should be fine now. _________________ Admin note: Bill Passed away - July, 2017
1965 panel bus-Kermit
"Camping is cheaper than therapy"
www.sv2s.com
www.steeringboxscrapers.net
SBS #100
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=453617 |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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The overnight weep hole drip test will confirm this. _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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andk5591 Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2005 Posts: 16754 Location: State College, PA
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:23 am Post subject: |
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2 things - you are installing the bog O-ring OVER the bearing, correct? and it will leak unless the drum is torqued on. _________________ D-Dubya Manx clone - 63 Short pan,1914.
Rosie 65 bug - My mostly stock daily driver.
Woodie 69 VW woodie (Hot VWs 7/12).
"John's car" 64 VW woodie - The first ever
Maxine 61 Cal-look bug - Cindy's daily driver.
Max - 73 standard Beetle hearse project - For sale
66 bug project - Real patina & Suby conversion
There's more, but not keeping them... |
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GregKnod Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2005 Posts: 376 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:44 am Post subject: |
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It passed the overnight test - the brake backing plate has never been this dry and clean since I've owned her - now rust will probably set in! _________________ '73 Westy Weekender sharing the garage with a '66 Ocean Blue Beetle (daily drivers are out in the weather) |
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gerg a.k.a. 6volt65
Joined: April 25, 2003 Posts: 5454 Location: Monroe, LA
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:41 am Post subject: |
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As many times as I have heard Bill preach about that washer, finally someone says it worked! I always believed him, but SO much negativity would follow his comments.
I run OG washers in all of my VWs and have never had a leak - and Bill helped me get things straight probably 8 years ago when I was struggling with the same problem.
Kudos on the efforts! _________________ Gerg
. . . I got 99 problems and my bus ain't one . . .
'65 Sunroof Beetle
'65 Vert
'60 Singlecab |
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bill may Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2003 Posts: 14160 Location: san diego,ca
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 9:30 am Post subject: |
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gerg wrote: |
As many times as I have heard Bill preach about that washer, finally someone says it worked! I always believed him, but SO much negativity would follow his comments.
I run OG washers in all of my VWs and have never had a leak - and Bill helped me get things straight probably 8 years ago when I was struggling with the same problem.
Kudos on the efforts! |
thanks for the feed back guys. yeah i do get flak sometimes,but i always try to help. _________________ Admin note: Bill Passed away - July, 2017
1965 panel bus-Kermit
"Camping is cheaper than therapy"
www.sv2s.com
www.steeringboxscrapers.net
SBS #100
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=453617 |
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thedishking Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2007 Posts: 78
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Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 7:44 am Post subject: Axle nut related? |
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Hello,
I am running into the same issue.
Is it safe to say this could happen, even if the seal is 100% properly installed, until the axle nut is torqued to spec?
I just put a new transmission in my car yesterday, and threw the drums on but have not torqued the axle nuts down yet.
I found a few drips this morning on the driver side....
Thanks for your help!
Travis |
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gerg a.k.a. 6volt65
Joined: April 25, 2003 Posts: 5454 Location: Monroe, LA
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Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:55 am Post subject: |
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The axle nut needs to be torqued for the smaller O-ring to compress. So, yes. Happened to me same way. _________________ Gerg
. . . I got 99 problems and my bus ain't one . . .
'65 Sunroof Beetle
'65 Vert
'60 Singlecab |
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