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BoxsterGT Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2010 Posts: 80 Location: Stow, MA
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:44 pm Post subject: Permanent Fix for Vanagon Fuel Tank Vents |
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I have been looking at the new Gas Tank I purchased for my DOKA and trying to decide how to fix this grommet issue once and for all.
I have lots of experience with Porsche fuel & oil systems where I work, so this cannot be too hard to do.
I am having some fittings made up to take a Banjo & the correct multi-fuel hose secured by proper clamps or a crimp sleeve.
They will be secured to the tank with Copper Crush washers and absolutely will not leak.
Once this is done I will try to do something with the filler neck.
Will post info & photos soon.
Len
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purplepeopleeater Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2005 Posts: 3117 Location: E. Washington
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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I always thought welding some nipples to the tank in place of the plastic fittings and rubber grommets. |
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GrindGarage Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2008 Posts: 710 Location: Ocean City, NJ
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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I havn't had the pleasure of dropping my tank yet but anyway to get bulkhead fittings in there? can your arm reach the other side? _________________ -cliff
91 Vanagon AUTO
97 Single Port EJ22 all smallcar.com |
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rubbachicken Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2004 Posts: 3058 Location: socal
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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i've had to replace fuel tanks on both my previous vanagons due to the breather rotting out, when i re install the tank i use a hermatite red petrol sealer and press in the grommets, neither have leaked
i hope i don't have to do the same to lucy, the spending list is getting longer by the day |
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chojinchef Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2011 Posts: 1539 Location: Central Massachusetts
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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purplepeopleeater wrote: |
I always thought welding some nipples to the tank in place of the plastic fittings and rubber grommets. |
Thought of that as well, but would want to start with a new tank. I sealed up mine a month or so ago, so I figure I have at least a year to find a solution.
Anyone have experience with aftermarket tanks currently available? They thin walled pieces of crap?
LP _________________ Its a mistress; an expensive, whiney, needy bitch of a mistress. She is a chunky, dirty girl with bad skin, little motivation and yet she always makes me smile. She sure has been around before shacking up with me. She has a direct line to my wallet, plays with my emotions, is consistantly jovial yet with a sarcastic and sardonic side, is consistant in her inconsistancy, and every once in a while gives me a great ride and a fantastic memory. |
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randywebb Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2005 Posts: 3815 Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
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jimeg Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007 Posts: 510 Location: PNW
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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I used the GW kit. The grommets they included did not work with my original cross over tube. The grommet ID was slightly larger and did not seal the original fittings. I had to use the GW cross over tube.
I'd pay for an improved sealing system. _________________ 1986 Root Beer Syncro Tin Top....so many plans.
Here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=578490
Last edited by jimeg on Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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r39o Samba Polizei
Joined: May 18, 2005 Posts: 9800 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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I am thinking welding to a new unused tank would be easy enough. Unless the Chinese steel is to stressed and it starts to crack.
Next time mine leaks...... _________________ "Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!
1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....
Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently) |
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SL1 Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2010 Posts: 251 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 6:21 am Post subject: |
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when I took my tank down this spring, it was in excellent condition, and just needed a coat of bedliner to make itlook like brand new, so I was lucky on that one. My van has never seen a salted winter road.
I did buy and install the GW kit, c/w the cross-over tube. the install was easy with no issues, I got a post off somebody here who had an excellent write up on his own website, with great pics to use on the way - I just can't find it now, but had 'kayack' in his name.
no isues with grommet sizing or anything else, and I can fill it with no spashback, I did put a slight smear of Vaseline as reported on all the grommets, and the grommets were easy to install, sealed up perfectly. maybe I was lucky, but don't think so. _________________ Steve
1985 GL Westy - 'Bullwinkle'
1978 Super Beetle - 'Rocky' |
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 6:24 am Post subject: |
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New rubber grommets and sealing them with Loctite 518 has proven itself for over 8 years and still going strong...no smell or leaks at full fillup. |
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r39o Samba Polizei
Joined: May 18, 2005 Posts: 9800 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 10:46 am Post subject: |
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It is not just the grommets, though. The plastic breaks too. Just did it to my Multivan. Thankfully we still had some used plastics to use (for now.)
A good stock repair with new factory parts seems (or used to) last a good decade or more. Now it is anybodies guess based on new fuels and the materials used and so on.
A non elastomeric solution would make me more happy. _________________ "Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!
1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....
Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently) |
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danfromsyr Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004 Posts: 15144 Location: Syracuse, NY
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 10:53 am Post subject: |
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How about adding a set of the Valve Cover breather vents?
you should be able to reach the inside via the gas gauge sender hole and a long handled wrench.. (pending the tank is out)
this would work on an old or new tank. and if used a VITON O-ring should be a mostly Perm fix.
to add a small barb to the upper tanks (we've eliminated them to no ill effect in my brother's van FWIW) you can add a 2nd T-fitting just after the tank vent fitting.
_________________
Abscate wrote: |
These are the reasons we have words like “wanker” |
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connorsvw2 Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2008 Posts: 347 Location: Denver, CO
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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My grommets seem to last about 1 yr-already getting that fuel smell with fill ups after replacing all of them last year. I think the E10 we get here in CO must be incompatible.
OTOH, I'm getting very good at a tank drop and reseal _________________ '85 Westy Wolfsburg camper/2002 2.5 Subaru since 2003.
'85 GTI 1.8L 1-owner 8v-gave up on 9A 2.0L 16v transplant. Keeping her stock!
'99 Passat 1.8T Variant-AKA "The Money Pit". Still limping along...
'09 Subaru Outback XT 5-speed, 245 hp rocket (wife's car) |
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r39o Samba Polizei
Joined: May 18, 2005 Posts: 9800 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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danfromsyr wrote: |
How about adding a set of the Valve Cover breather vents?
you should be able to reach the inside via the gas gauge sender hole and a long handled wrench.. (pending the tank is out)
this would work on an old or new tank. and if used a VITON O-ring should be a mostly Perm fix.
to add a small barb to the upper tanks (we've eliminated them to no ill effect in my brother's van FWIW) you can add a 2nd T-fitting just after the tank vent fitting.
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My buddy Todd, Mr Middie, has his old tank out and handy. I am going to look at it over the weekend.....I suspect my other van will start to leak as it has been a good 5 years since we put all new factory crossovers in. _________________ "Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!
1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....
Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently) |
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chojinchef Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2011 Posts: 1539 Location: Central Massachusetts
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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connorsvw2 wrote: |
My grommets seem to last about 1 yr-already getting that fuel smell with fill ups after replacing all of them last year. I think the E10 we get here in CO must be incompatible.
OTOH, I'm getting very good at a tank drop and reseal |
Sad when you need to plan ahead to drop it again. New bolts, chasing the threads, plenty of never seize, waterproof grease and knowing full well you will be dropping that tank again.
Seems rather peculiar in this forum that prefers permanent fixes.
Was thinking of braising on a couple steel nipples so standard Oetinger clamps, a couple brass T's and hi end ethanol resistant hose would be perfectly adequate while losing the grommets that will undoubtedly fail. _________________ Its a mistress; an expensive, whiney, needy bitch of a mistress. She is a chunky, dirty girl with bad skin, little motivation and yet she always makes me smile. She sure has been around before shacking up with me. She has a direct line to my wallet, plays with my emotions, is consistantly jovial yet with a sarcastic and sardonic side, is consistant in her inconsistancy, and every once in a while gives me a great ride and a fantastic memory. |
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 5:47 am Post subject: |
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connorsvw2 wrote: |
My grommets seem to last about 1 yr-already getting that fuel smell with fill ups after replacing all of them last year. I think the E10 we get here in CO must be incompatible.
OTOH, I'm getting very good at a tank drop and reseal |
What did you use to seal the grommets? |
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purplepeopleeater Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2005 Posts: 3117 Location: E. Washington
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Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 7:23 am Post subject: |
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I didn't use any sealer on my grommets, just personal lubricant
I'm sure I'll learn to regret not using a sealent like some loctite 510. |
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boulderdrop Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2008 Posts: 481 Location: Seattle, WA
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Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 10:43 am Post subject: |
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Yo guys. I recently re-did my fuel-tank after the bostig install, gosh, 1.5 years ago. It looks super sweet and I now have a ton of knowledge on how to do it. Which, in my book, is the hard work that is also a great learning tool and confidence in my old van.
I used this guide:
http://www.kayakwesty.com/gastank.html
But like everyone else on this post, I get leaks. My leak happens at the top of the tank and if I fill-it-up, will result in a large puddle of fuel on the ground. Obviously, not good.
I think my leak is happening from the gasket at the fuel sender, but you know it's hard to say... as it's really hard to see where it's coming from, as it all just flows "down the saddle". I suppose that's an easy fix of the O-ring.
I used a full kit from VC:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_493_293/fuel_tank_reseal_kit_a.html
But, I guess it could also be from the "breather grommets" from the cross-over pipe. Has anyone else worked a solution like this?
I love the idea of using the valve-cover-breather-vents (or something like it) as DANFROMSYR noted:
danfromsyr wrote: |
How about adding a set of the Valve Cover breather vents? ...and if used a VITON O-ring should be a mostly Perm fix.
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_________________ == My Rides ==
1984 Westy, Bostig, 3rd:1.14, Locker-LSD, Newly Painted
1980 24' J-Boat
1979 Sears Freespirit Moped
1996 Chev S10 4x4 ZR2
2012 Toyota Camry Hybrid (Wife's)
== How I Pay the Bills ==
Windows FTP Server at http://www.bpftpserver.com (PM for a FREE one) |
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connorsvw2 Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2008 Posts: 347 Location: Denver, CO
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Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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I do not use any lubricant or sealer on rubber fittings as a general rule; however, if I do need a "lubricant" I use a small amount of liquid dish soap especially on non-petroleum rated rubber like window gaskets and the like.
Are you suggesting that sealing will prolong the lifespan? If so, I'll give it a try next time I drop the tank. I like the idea of some type of compression fitting to fit into the grommet holes and eliminate the problem. Odd issue is the big rubber gasket around the filler neck has NEVER leaked, while the small top ones always do...is there a materials difference? _________________ '85 Westy Wolfsburg camper/2002 2.5 Subaru since 2003.
'85 GTI 1.8L 1-owner 8v-gave up on 9A 2.0L 16v transplant. Keeping her stock!
'99 Passat 1.8T Variant-AKA "The Money Pit". Still limping along...
'09 Subaru Outback XT 5-speed, 245 hp rocket (wife's car) |
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BoxsterGT Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2010 Posts: 80 Location: Stow, MA
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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Here's what I have so far...........
Using Steel Banjos & Fittings with Copper crush washers as a proper seal with no rubber grommets or nylon fittings to age, dry out, fail prematurely or to crack & split.
Once proven I will offer these for anyone who wants them.
Also working on a fix for the fuel filler neck. Will update as progress is made.
Len
Last edited by BoxsterGT on Sat Oct 01, 2011 3:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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