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Gary
Person of Interest
Joined: November 01, 2002
Posts: 17069
Location: 127.0.0.1
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 Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 6:47 am Post subject: |
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| jmartin7 wrote: |
| Other than the Toyota thing, has anyone ever heard about major dbw failure? Also how do you think the aftermarket will support this system when VW moves on to somthing else? |
The aftermarket will never adapt to something like this. Just look at cars from the carburetor era, drum brakes, manual steering, 8-track stereos, etc.
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Culito
11010101
Joined: December 07, 2006
Posts: 5866
Location: Columbia Missourah
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:39 am Post subject: |
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| Eaallred wrote: |
| I thought I heard somewhere that all the Toyota stuff was found not to be the fault of any electronics, most were found to be driver error. Was just a case of everyone trying to jump on the bandwagon to pay for thier accident type of thing. Which makes sense, the only recall they did was for floor mats to be replaced. If there was a DBW issue, there would have been a massive recall, i'm sure someone here would have heard about it. |
I think most of the claims were BS, but I thought that the actual failure had to do with moisture in the pedal linkage / sender?
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josh
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Joined: July 13, 2003
Posts: 1773
Location: laid back in the tall grass
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Gary wrote: |
| jmartin7 wrote: |
| Other than the Toyota thing, has anyone ever heard about major dbw failure? Also how do you think the aftermarket will support this system when VW moves on to somthing else? |
The aftermarket will never adapt to something like this. Just look at cars from the carburetor era, drum brakes, manual steering, 8-track stereos, etc. |
Electronic stability control is mandatory on all 2012 and later cars. That pretty much means drive by wire is taking over the market right now. So no need to worry about manufacturers going away from drive by wire.
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Stoner A is cylinders #2/4 B is #1/3 The plugged bowl is the throttle, the bong is the manifold |
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Glenn A
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Joined: October 09, 2006
Posts: 986
Location: NY
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| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:35 am Post subject: |
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My 98 F-150 5spd. No issues you would never know it was DBW. 2003 Tahoe same thing perfect throttle response. However when the truck was still pretty new I had just given it a thorough wash including the engine. When I hopped in and took off it threw an engine light. The truck went into a safe mode and would only opperate at part throttle. I had OnStar on the truck at the time so I asked them to pull the code for me. The message said something along the line of throttle sensor something (I forgot it was a long time ago). Knowing I just wet the whole engine down I went out and pulled the connector off the throttle body and blew it out with air. Once it was dry I cycled the key a few times and the code reset. That problem never happened again after more than 90,000 miles and counting.
2010 tdi 6spd. has a few qwirks. Sometimes just at the crest of a hill I get a slight decel feeling with my foot steady on the pedel. It is not something I would consider dangerous. It is just enough to remind you that the car is DBW and the feedback at that moment is not 100%. Again this only happens once in a while.
The traction control on tdi 6spd sucks balls however. If you want to chug up a hill in 1st gear and hit a slight amout of gravel or a wet area and spin the tires your finished. It cuts the engine to the point where it is difficult to recover. The computer also cuts the engine around 700 rpm. These two issues are big dislikes for my wife who drives the car often. It tends to make you have to over slip the clutch when driving aggessively. I realize this last part of the rant is not so much a drive by wire issue but more of a to much computer interferance in general.
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roy63
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Joined: August 16, 2004
Posts: 1338
Location: Mechanicsville Va.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:17 am Post subject: |
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my 03 GMC HD has it and you wouldnt even know. it drives just like a cable, my wifes 05 Pilot has it and I cant tell, my 95 accord has a cable and you can drive any of them and there is no diffrence.
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chickengeorge
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Joined: August 18, 2004
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Location: Spokompton Warshington
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:36 am Post subject: |
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| Glenn A wrote: |
2010 tdi 6spd. has a few qwirks. Sometimes just at the crest of a hill I get a slight decel feeling with my foot steady on the pedel. It is not something I would consider dangerous. It is just enough to remind you that the car is DBW and the feedback at that moment is not 100%. Again this only happens once in a while.
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Kind of the same thing on my Turdcoma. It's only turning 2100 at 70. If you floor it at 70, you can hear the tone of the engine change, but you feel nothing happen. It will SLOWLY start to bring up the speed, but it's real slow. I've always shifted down to 4th even up the slightest grades. I was recently on a trip and forgot to shift down and the truck went straight up the hill, held speed and I barely gave it any more throttle. It freaked me out. I started to experiment with it and found that up a hill, in 5th, the engine must be adjusting timing for torque. As long as you don't let off the throttle, it will stay at 2100 and 70mph. If you floor it, I think it actually slows down and if you let off the gas you can feel the engine free up. Once you get to the top of the hill, you get the same deceleration feeling that you're talking about. I get way better MPG by the way leaving it in 5th now. Strange stuff. Stupid thing is that I've owned the truck for 3 years and just figured this out.  |
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Erik G
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Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13280
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| chickengeorge wrote: |
| Glenn A wrote: |
2010 tdi 6spd. has a few qwirks. Sometimes just at the crest of a hill I get a slight decel feeling with my foot steady on the pedel. It is not something I would consider dangerous. It is just enough to remind you that the car is DBW and the feedback at that moment is not 100%. Again this only happens once in a while.
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Kind of the same thing on my Turdcoma. It's only turning 2100 at 70. If you floor it at 70, you can hear the tone of the engine change, but you feel nothing happen. It will SLOWLY start to bring up the speed, but it's real slow. I've always shifted down to 4th even up the slightest grades. I was recently on a trip and forgot to shift down and the truck went straight up the hill, held speed and I barely gave it any more throttle. It freaked me out. I started to experiment with it and found that up a hill, in 5th, the engine must be adjusting timing for torque. As long as you don't let off the throttle, it will stay at 2100 and 70mph. If you floor it, I think it actually slows down and if you let off the gas you can feel the engine free up. Once you get to the top of the hill, you get the same deceleration feeling that you're talking about. I get way better MPG by the way leaving it in 5th now. Strange stuff. Stupid thing is that I've owned the truck for 3 years and just figured this out. |
my truck -2004 GMC Sierra 1500 is DBW. No issues. Now it you really want some gas mileage, use the damn cruise control! even up hills, mine doesnt shift down, 2100 at 72mph, and about 20mpg as long as I'm cruising at 72mph or below. big rims don't help, but the dual exhaust, K&N, and superchips programmer set on 87 octane mileage saver and the tire size re-programmed do. Drove over 700 miles this weekend all up and down Texas, 700 the week before to South Padre and back, and 300ish the week before to Austin and back
But if I floor it at 70, you know. 70 to 90 time actually feels pretty good. anything over 100 is kinda scary.
I'm convinced that cars in Texas not only lack turn signals, they lack cruise control. What a bunch of Idiot's out on the road...
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chickengeorge
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Joined: August 18, 2004
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Location: Spokompton Warshington
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 11:59 am Post subject: |
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| Erik G wrote: |
| Now it you really want some gas mileage, use the damn cruise control! |
Would if I had it! I got the base 2WD -no cruise. Only option I need is air, cause I'm a fat ass. It's lowered with DJM 3-4 kit and 20's. I don't think it pushes as much air being lowered, but the wider tires are probably washing out any benefit.
I know what you mean though..I'm always aware of people without cruise. I can't stand it when they're not able to hold a steady speed. |
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Erik G
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Joined: October 16, 2002
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Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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my 305/40/22's definetly do not help my gas mileage.
Another fact. Cars in Texas do not come with mirrors. I'm convinced of this. I think it's shiney aluminum foil that looks like a mirror. I asked my friend, who replied, "we're Texans, who cares where we been, it's all about where we goin" 
I can't imagine not having cruise control. I guess I rely on it too much. I'd have a million speeding tickets without it
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nerfer
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Joined: July 09, 2010
Posts: 508
Location: Chicagoland
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| Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| chickengeorge wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
| Now it you really want some gas mileage, use the damn cruise control! |
Would if I had it! I got the base 2WD -no cruise. Only option I need is air, cause I'm a fat ass. It's lowered with DJM 3-4 kit and 20's. I don't think it pushes as much air being lowered, but the wider tires are probably washing out any benefit.
I know what you mean though..I'm always aware of people without cruise. I can't stand it when they're not able to hold a steady speed. |
Cruise control helps your mileage on flat roads, but not on hills. On hills you can anticipate things, pick up a little speed before climbing, letting it drop a couple mph as you reach the top, and that helps your mpgs quite a bit. Otherwise it will floor it trying to maintain a steady speed for the last 10% of a hill, and that's just not needed.
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LeviMan2001
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Joined: April 11, 2009
Posts: 3855
Location: Alaska
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| Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| josh wrote: |
| Gary wrote: |
| jmartin7 wrote: |
| Other than the Toyota thing, has anyone ever heard about major dbw failure? Also how do you think the aftermarket will support this system when VW moves on to somthing else? |
The aftermarket will never adapt to something like this. Just look at cars from the carburetor era, drum brakes, manual steering, 8-track stereos, etc. |
Electronic stability control is mandatory on all 2012 and later cars. That pretty much means drive by wire is taking over the market right now. So no need to worry about manufacturers going away from drive by wire. |
Great, another reason for people to pay less attention to driving.
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lawn ninja
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Joined: January 02, 2006
Posts: 1009
Location: Round Rock, TX
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| Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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When I chipped my BMW it removed the lag from the DBW system. Most cars can have the "lag" time messed with if you know how to. IT takes a laptop and the right program and connector for the car, but it can usually be removed. A ton of newer cars also use electric steering and you can increase and decrease the sensitivity of it. Audi's are like that for instance. Like Dr Scope said, if no one said anything you wouldn't know it was there.
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LeviMan2001
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Paul Windisch
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Location: Clinton Township, Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 10:52 am Post subject: |
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The "lag" most people feel is designed into it's operation, it isn't simply there because it's DBW. That lag allows transmission shifts to occur with less impact on the clutches, furthering the longevity of internal parts. It is also there to decrease the evidence of driveline lash, many of you may know this as driveline clunk. Drive by wire also makes it exponentially easier to control the engine in instances of traction and stability control intervention. "Back in the day", Cadillac used a stepper motor attached to the throttle linkage via a cable that would pull the throttle closed for these instances (which one could feel as the pedal would be forced up to some degree), so really DBW is much simpler and more integral, and much less noticeable to the consumer.
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chabanais
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Joined: July 27, 2002
Posts: 4866
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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Actually the Toyota sudden acceleration cases were all found to be either morons hitting the gas instead of the brake or idiots who used the wrong kind of floor mat and they jammed the gas pedals down.
So no... Toyota did nothing wrong.
| vw_hank wrote: |
| the Toyota recalls ring A bell? no brakes, gas pedal stuck,, No way in hell do I want A computer driving my car for me!! |
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vwluver74
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| Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 7:11 pm Post subject: |
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| i recently drove a newer c-class benz with DBW. absolutely hated it. you had to stomp on it to get it up to freeway speed and when leaving a light, the first 3/4 of the pedal did nearly nothing. |
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nerfer
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Joined: July 09, 2010
Posts: 508
Location: Chicagoland
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:45 am Post subject: |
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That looks pretty cool. I have a ScanGauge II to read engine temperature and other parameters from my modern car (anything after 1996 has the OBDII interface), but it won't mess with the software in the car.
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nerfer
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:48 am Post subject: |
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| vwluver74 wrote: |
| i recently drove a newer c-class benz with DBW. absolutely hated it. you had to stomp on it to get it up to freeway speed and when leaving a light, the first 3/4 of the pedal did nearly nothing. |
You sure that's from the DBW? It's possible, but might be how they set up the engine, or maybe the pedal sensor was having problems.
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MinamiKotaro
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:54 am Post subject: |
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| vw_hank wrote: |
You ever had the blue screen on your PC? think about your car doing that at 60mph  the Toyota recalls ring A bell? no brakes, gas pedal stuck,, No way in hell do I want A computer driving my car for me!! |
It wouldn't be any bigger deal than stuck mechanical throttle linkage. Put it in neutral, turn the hazards on, coast to the side, and stop. Unplug the battery for awhile to see if it resets the computer. If not, time to call for a tow.
Mom's VUE has drive-by-wire. I can't tell the difference between it and regular throttle.
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GBA 88West LA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:26 am Post subject: |
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my vanagon is dbw, and ive had no issues, couldnt even tell it is dbw if you werent aware
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