engine case 0394066 (lots of pics)

[Matthew Tolbert]

I am wanting to build a 1500 to put into my notch to replace the 1835 that is in it now.

I have a set of singleport heads that a friend gave me with a 311 part # that i hope are correct for my build.

I dont know the differences in type 1 and 3 singleport heads yet.

I found this engine case over the weekend at the CYW show.

going by the technical section it is for an early 64 with possibly a November 63 build date.

im not certain about that because September to December of that year are marked unknown if correct.

it also does not have an R (high compression) or N (low compression) stamped on the opposite case half.

I noticed it does not take cam bearings if you look closely at the cam journals there is no place for the "tang"

here are a bunch of pictures i took earlier today of exactly how i found it grease, dead spiders and all other than cleaning the serial # up to be readable.

there are a few more pics in my gallery if interested but these pretty much cover it i think.

if you have any idea of what i have let me know.

serial #

top

under generator stand

3/4 side

rear

1/2 side

front

inside

casting # 1/2 side

casting # 3/4 side

bottom

strange hole added behind flywheel seal for extra oil drain back it looks like, hopefully its not an issue

oil pickup

1/2 side main and cam journals

3/4 side main and cam journals

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Matthew Tolbert
1958 ragtop
1961 doublecab
1965 Notchback S

[W1K1]

Looks the same as my OG 65 SP 1500 case that is a 1600cc now.
Why the step backwards in HP ? I am building a 1904 for mine with stock intake and OTT exhaust. Looks stock but it's not.
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http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/jim_martin_engine_build.php

1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap

[Slow 1200]

I would have it checked and then machined for cam bearings, when the cam journals are worn you lose tons of oil pressure

[Aaron M265]

Numbers punched in about 25th of March or there abouts.

Write down the 6 digit codes in the bell housing area and post them here if you can (one on each half). These are the casting dates.

So long as the case is not cracked, it will be okay to face it inside and out, machine for cam bearings, align bore it true and ikf you keep it stockish, it should be good and dandy.

Heli coil all the M6 threads while your there too as they are always naff after this long.

Best of luck.
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Aaron

http://1500notchback.blogspot.com/

Need to contact me? Email is faster than a PM - [email protected]

For T3 Panel Van information:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=389465

[Mike Fisher]

I have a case that is stamped 1 6 11 & 1 6 31 inside round circles in the bell housing. What does it mean? Are these probably matching case halves?
_________________
https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[Matthew Tolbert]

W1K1 the 1835 i have in it now is like you said with an OTT, stock carbs, a ZV JCU 4R3 dist and stock looking for the most part. it runs really well and i drive it everywhere. just got back from a show this weekend where i did around 500 miles round trip. it is burning a good bit of oil but just as long as i keep my eye on it, it will keep me going until i get something else.

now the reason for the "down grade" is "just because" i guess no other real reason. if it will cruise at 60-65 that is enough for me. now dont get me wrong i like the extra horsepower. i have a 2276 that was in an oval i traded for this notch that is very strong, and a lot of fun.


here is the picture with the casting dates.

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Matthew Tolbert
1958 ragtop
1961 doublecab
1965 Notchback S

[W1K1]

well i can tell you my experience with mine.
My case needed the first cut on the mains and the cam journals were actually still within spec so we ran with it.
we added a counterweighted crank, mildly ported flycut SP heads for 8.6 compression, w110 cam, SVDA distributor, OTT exhaust, 1.5 qt sump, 12lb flywheel, and stock PDSIT carbs. Everything was measured, checked, and rotating assembly balanced.
Ya, we figured we'd squeeze what we could out of it

My problem is it runs hot on the highway, oil pressure is 30 psi at 3000 rpm, but the head temps are 350-375 on a flat stretch and it climbs quickly if I hit a steep hill. I can drive all day long in town with oil temps at 180 and the head temps stay 325-350F.
it has be jetted up and down rich and lean but it still gets hot on the highway and is higher than normal head temps around town. The LM2 has had it's share of logging with this motor.
That's why I'm building a new motor with a late case, bigger oil passages and more capacity for the bump in HP.
_________________
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/jim_martin_engine_build.php

1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap

[Aaron M265]

Here we go chaps:

28-11-13 for the 1/2 side is 28th November 1963

9-12-13 for the 3/4 side is 9th December 1963

The '13' number refers to the shift that poured the magnesium from what I was told (could be wrong) but you will sometimes see '23' which might indicate the 2nd shift working that day and the '3' refers to the year so it would be possible to see these numbers on a 1973 case however other factors come into play.

This is definately a case cast at the end of 1963 and then machined and stamped in 1964.

Mike Fisher- without seeing your case, it could be:


1-6-31 & 1-6-11 - 1st of June 1961 (or 1971). Both halves made on the same day but I would bet that one half was made in the first shift and the 2nd half was made in the 3rd shift that day.

If it's a 1961 case, thats an old one!

Sounds reasonable?
_________________
Aaron

http://1500notchback.blogspot.com/

Need to contact me? Email is faster than a PM - [email protected]

For T3 Panel Van information:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=389465

[Mike Fisher]

It also has 46 VW 211 101 101 E AS41 2.0 liter bus case?
_________________
https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[Matthew Tolbert]

W1K1 i see what you are saying, but i am going to keep it a little closer to stock than you did just for the fun of it. it probably will not have dome pistons or anything unless i got real lucky to find some. this is sort of a long term when i come across parts kind of thing anyway. im not going out of my way to finish it soon just something i would like to do. i have a set of heads, an extra 4R3 distributor, and another set of carbs and singleport intakes. so i have a decent start on parts. i figure i will see what i can find for internals next. do you remember the specs for the cam journals so i can see how mine measure up? i remember your thread on the jetting issues you were having a while back. did you ever get the over rich problem sorted out?


Aaron thanks for the information that is cool to know. when i get a chance i will get it cleaned up and take some measurements to see where i stand. i wish it was a July of 65 case so it would match my car better, but you cant be too picky sometimes.


oh yeah what about the lack of an R or N stamp? did this come later or what type of engine do you think this started out as originally? is there any way to determine that? was it just a early 1500 with flat tops or could it have been an S engine with domed pistons?
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Matthew Tolbert
1958 ragtop
1961 doublecab
1965 Notchback S

[W1K1]

Mine was an early 65 N (aug/sept 64) my case was a 069xxxx and it has N's stamped all over the bell housing.

[Matthew Tolbert]

i will get it cleaned up to see if there are any other markings on it.

that would be great if you could scan that for me, it would really help. i wish i could find a manual for $2.

that 45 sounds like it is about right then if it doesnt protest while cruising. thats about where my afr is with 47.5 idles i got from john at aircooled.net. i would get a very slight surge with the 45s with a steady pedal that you had to be paying close attention to notice it. i am betting the over rich condition with the 50s is because they arent seating all the way into the bottom at the tip of the jet. mine was doing the exact same thing with the same jets as you are using. i have to retighten my idles every so often because it starts to have an erratic idle where it will try to go dead after the engine warms up. i only have to tighten them a tiny bit and it will idle perfectly again, and the afr will go back to normal.
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Matthew Tolbert
1958 ragtop
1961 doublecab
1965 Notchback S

[pedro sainz]

[Matthew Tolbert]

pedro i always find that to be so cool when things like this are still around that were made so close together and discovered. its especially cool when its complete cars and not just parts. and that also helps me date the case a lot better. thank you

p.s. would you send me a quote for a roof rack and a trunk rack for a notch? i want to get one or the other or possibly even both eventually and would like to know pricing. thanks
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Matthew Tolbert
1958 ragtop
1961 doublecab
1965 Notchback S

[W1K1]

4 pages of engine tolerances and wear limits

http://s165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/CDNBullyboy/SQUARE/1500%20shop%20manual/
_________________
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/jim_martin_engine_build.php

1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap

[Matthew Tolbert]