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targis58 Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2006 Posts: 539 Location: sunnyvale,ca
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 12:52 pm Post subject: westy stove mod: double the flame size! |
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So.. I finally put my hands on my slow stove and have come up with double sized flame. A few members have mentioned about this mod but no visual result.
So here it is...
The left side is stock and the right side is the mod
What do you suggest to get rid of the red flame on top of the flame?
I drilled two 1/4 " holes on the side of the intake tube but it didn't do much
_________________ 90 westy 2wd w/ TBD |
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markz2004 Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2007 Posts: 944 Location: Portland, OR
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:20 pm Post subject: Re: westy stove mod: double the flame size! |
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targis58 wrote: |
So.. I finally put my hands on my slow stove and have come up with double sized flame. A few members have mentioned about this mod but no visual result.
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Is there a linky to the thread to which you speak? _________________ 87 Westy, 250k GW 2.4 - 2.0 , 16" wheels |
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targis58 Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2006 Posts: 539 Location: sunnyvale,ca
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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no thread that I know of...
my mod is based on few posts from here and there.
The mod is basically making the orifice a bit larger. I doubled the size of the orifice from 1/64" to 1/32".
used a carbide bur that I have (1/32") and just used my fingers to rotate the bur to drill the hole
_________________ 90 westy 2wd w/ TBD |
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lloydy Samba Member
Joined: September 15, 2010 Posts: 715 Location: cheam surrey
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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So, you increased the gas jet by 100%? That burner is designed to run with the correct size nozzle, so the air/gas mix is correct. You have upset that balance, trying to increase the air intake wont really work and it will always be wrong.
You will, as you've seen, now have a bad flame picture. The gas rate on that appliance will now be really high, and it will be producing a lot of CO.
I'm a gas engineer, and would never do what you've done, make sure you cook with the windows open.
Good luck! |
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pioneer1 Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2008 Posts: 2068 Location: Ontario Canada
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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I think if you switch to natural gas that modification will work perfect _________________ "Always waiting for tomorrow ruined everything"
'85 Porsche 911 Targa
'76 Westfalia project |
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targis58 Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2006 Posts: 539 Location: sunnyvale,ca
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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lloydy wrote: |
So, you increased the gas jet by 100%? That burner is designed to run with the correct size nozzle, so the air/gas mix is correct. You have upset that balance, trying to increase the air intake wont really work and it will always be wrong.
You will, as you've seen, now have a bad flame picture. The gas rate on that appliance will now be really high, and it will be producing a lot of CO.
I'm a gas engineer, and would never do what you've done, make sure you cook with the windows open.
Good luck! |
Thanks for the warning.
That's why I only modified one burner.
I always leave my windows open when using the stove.
I just have to have my water boil faster than stock. And I always stay next to the stove when using it... _________________ 90 westy 2wd w/ TBD |
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danfromsyr Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004 Posts: 15129 Location: Syracuse, NY
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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and Tardis58 you are obligated to inform the next owner/operator of the change of design as well.
to fix the flame you'll need to enlarge the combustion airflow alot more than the current supply tube can.
drilling 2 1/4" holes into the side of an already open tube really nets zero gain in airflow. the tube is already exposed to all the air it can flow at the open 'atmosphere" end.
you'd need a larger diam tube to provide more air, not more holes in the existing one.
targis58 wrote: |
lloydy wrote: |
So, you increased the gas jet by 100%? That burner is designed to run with the correct size nozzle, so the air/gas mix is correct. You have upset that balance, trying to increase the air intake wont really work and it will always be wrong.
You will, as you've seen, now have a bad flame picture. The gas rate on that appliance will now be really high, and it will be producing a lot of CO.
I'm a gas engineer, and would never do what you've done, make sure you cook with the windows open.
Good luck! |
Thanks for the warning.
That's why I only modified one burner.
I always leave my windows open when using the stove.
I just have to have my water boil faster than stock. And I always stay next to the stove when using it... |
_________________
Abscate wrote: |
These are the reasons we have words like “wanker” |
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SCM Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011 Posts: 3102 Location: Bozeman MT
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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lloydy wrote: |
I just have to have my water boil faster than stock. . |
I'll be interested to hear if this is the result of your modification. Although the flame is now bigger, red flames are cooler then blue flames. I'm not certain the net change of a bigger cooler flame will result in a faster boiling time. _________________ '91 Westfalia GL Automatic (GTA "Turbo" Rebuild w/Peloquin) and 2.3L GoWesty Engine |
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lloydy Samba Member
Joined: September 15, 2010 Posts: 715 Location: cheam surrey
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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Oi! i didnt say that
best bet would be one of those rapidboil stoves |
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7892 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:43 pm Post subject: Re: westy stove mod: double the flame size! |
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targis58 wrote: |
The left side is stock and the right side is the mod
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Maybe my van is a black sheep around here, maybe not: My fridge fires up on propane the first time, every time; and, on "high", my stove's flames (size-wise) looks like the one on the right in your photo. To my knowledge, no modifications have ever been done to my van's kitchen appliances. So, all of those stoves with low-lying flames when turned to "high": Might something else be going on with them (need cleaning out, etc.)? _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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speedygeorge Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009 Posts: 235 Location: Victoria, BC
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: westy stove mod: double the flame size! |
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My stove also fires up easily and has a flame like the one on right side side of the picture |
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dhaavers Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010 Posts: 7733 Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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More trouble: yellow flames = dirty pots (soot).
Like Mom always said...
Please clean, but don't modify your orfice.
PS - Old gas can give a cold, low flame.
Treat your system to a purge & a fresh batch.
Ask at your propane/RV center... _________________ 86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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candyman Samba Trout Slayer
Joined: December 20, 2003 Posts: 2694 Location: Missoula MT
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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dhaavers wrote: |
Like Mom always said...
Please clean, but don't modify your orfice. |
Thats some funny shit right there! |
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Vanagonner Samba Member
Joined: September 15, 2009 Posts: 506 Location: Broomfield Colorado
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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I like the idea of making the flame a bit bigger.
I'm concerned that doubling the diameter way more than doubles the area of the hole- I'm guessing over 3x bigger. _________________ Sage
'82 Westy 1.6 D
the mighty n/a |
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targis58 Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2006 Posts: 539 Location: sunnyvale,ca
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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night view
I did some test if this bigger flame actually boils water faster.
I used 6" diameter kettle and put exactly 24 oz of water in it and timed how long it takes to get to the full boil.
bigger flame took almost 3 min 50 sec. to get there and 8 min 10 sec. for the stock flame.
bigger flame spread more than 6" wide that there was wasted flame. It could have been shorter than 3"50sec if I had used a bigger pod.
stock flame spread 4" wide under the 6" diameter kettle.
Over all, I really like the result of this mod _________________ 90 westy 2wd w/ TBD |
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lloydy Samba Member
Joined: September 15, 2010 Posts: 715 Location: cheam surrey
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Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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Have you had the regulator checked out (the one on the LPG tank) could be faulty, by that I mean not letting enough pressure through.
I was checking someone's set up the other day, the complaint was that the heater was running constantly but producing tiny amount of heat. Tested the gas pressure with the appliances running, and it only had 2mbr! You could have a similar problem.
I got to say though, I know it's your van and you can do what you like to it. But if you bought it to me to issue a gas safety cert, I couldn't pass it with a flame picture like that.
Also, as mentioned above, doubling the size of the hole way more than doubles the volume (3/4" copper pipe carries roughly 3 times as much water as a 1/2" copper pipe.) |
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PDXWesty Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2006 Posts: 6235 Location: Portland OR
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Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:28 am Post subject: |
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Seeing that you can regulate the flame down with the stove knob, it doesn't seem like a problem to me. The left burner looks like every Westy stove I have ever seen. Props on the new flame! _________________ 89 Westy 2.1 Auto |
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SWbySWesty Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2010 Posts: 327 Location: Adventureville, CA
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Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:36 am Post subject: |
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Dang, over 8 minutes? My unmodified stove boils water faster than that...even at high altitude with COLD water from streams! _________________ 1986 Westy - Billie Jean
A Westy with a Jeep heart (Pura Vida)
www.theadventurebrigade.blogspot.com - Latest update: Johnson Valley - Nov 22, 2011 |
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SCM Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011 Posts: 3102 Location: Bozeman MT
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Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:47 am Post subject: |
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SWbySWesty wrote: |
...even at high altitude with COLD water from streams! |
Just 'cause I'm a science geek - water actually boils at a lower temperature at higher elevations. In fact, at 8k feet and above, boiling water isn't a 100% effective way to kill giardia and other nasties unless you use a pressure cooker. _________________ '91 Westfalia GL Automatic (GTA "Turbo" Rebuild w/Peloquin) and 2.3L GoWesty Engine |
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SWbySWesty Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2010 Posts: 327 Location: Adventureville, CA
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Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:26 am Post subject: |
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SCM wrote: |
Just 'cause I'm a science geek - water actually boils at a lower temperature at higher elevations. In fact, at 8k feet and above, boiling water isn't a 100% effective way to kill giardia and other nasties unless you use a pressure cooker. |
I always wondered why it was so effective up there! Thanks! _________________ 1986 Westy - Billie Jean
A Westy with a Jeep heart (Pura Vida)
www.theadventurebrigade.blogspot.com - Latest update: Johnson Valley - Nov 22, 2011 |
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