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Karzapart55 Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2004 Posts: 640 Location: Old Bridge NJ
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:00 pm Post subject: Progressive carb gasket |
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Putting my 1.7 back together, i misplaced the intake manifold gaskets. i have ith blocks. 2 questions, Are the gaskets made of alum. and if so i have 4 that will fit on the studs. can i use them? |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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If we're discussing the manifold to head gaskets you're better off with the metal gaskets and no phenolic blocks for a Prog installation.
Single aluminum gaskets = carb/carbs
Phenolic insulator block = fuel injection _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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Слава Україні! |
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Karzapart55 Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2004 Posts: 640 Location: Old Bridge NJ
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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Not sure what phenolic is. Im not sure if i explained it right, i have 4-2 hole gaskets instead of 2-4hole gaskets. If i can use them that would be great. Just wasnt sure the alum. would be gas tight |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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Phenolic is the black or brown plastic spacer that goes between the intake runner and head on FI buses, usually with a red paper gasket glued to each side.
Use the 4 aluminum gaskets, spend some time with a hammer, file and sandpaper on a sheet of glass getting the flanges on the ends of those EMPI intake runners really flat, they're thin and bend easily from overtorquing and won't seal if they aren't flat. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
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Karzapart55 Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2004 Posts: 640 Location: Old Bridge NJ
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Busdaddy! |
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moncton_vw Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2011 Posts: 88 Location: New Brunswick
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:00 am Post subject: |
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I have a dual proggressive weber carb set up on my 79. Looks like the bus was FI at one time and they left the paper gasket and from what is described above the Phenolic insulator block.
I ordered the proper metal gaskets and have a couple questions :
- what orientation do I put the gaskets in? Rounded part facing the intake manifold or away from the manifold?
- should I use a gasket sealer?
- I should take the Phenolic Insulator block off
- what is the proper torque
- The intake runners would be the end of the 4 pipes that bolt onto the engine correct
Thanks a bunch for your help the search function answered some of my questions but just wanted to confirm a few things _________________ ---------------------------
79 Westfalia, Koni's, Fiamma F45i, Jamie Rivers Hitch and many hours of love and upgrades
12 Subaru Impreza 2.0i
04 Land Rover Discovery, 3" Terrafirma Lift, 33" Grabber AT2's, Tom Woods Driveshaft (SOLD) |
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Chris_914 Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2011 Posts: 344 Location: Las Vegas
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:10 am Post subject: |
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Better to get aftermarket fiber gaskets. The metal ones are for the OE dual carb setup with nice thick aluminum manifolds. The thin flanges on the progressive setup warp easy and the fiber gaskets are more forgiving.
2724, 2725 listed on CB performance.
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=515
I've also seen Bugpack and EMPI sell them as well. _________________ '75 Westfalia Camper FI 1.8L
'75 914 2.0L |
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moncton_vw Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2011 Posts: 88 Location: New Brunswick
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Chris_914 for your prompt reply, I'll definately look into that but I need help to install the ones I got today.
I've promissed my Girlfriend that I'd have the bus running by Saturday and I've been spending virtually all my spare time fixing the bus up and will be in deep sh*t if it is not ready for Saturday _________________ ---------------------------
79 Westfalia, Koni's, Fiamma F45i, Jamie Rivers Hitch and many hours of love and upgrades
12 Subaru Impreza 2.0i
04 Land Rover Discovery, 3" Terrafirma Lift, 33" Grabber AT2's, Tom Woods Driveshaft (SOLD) |
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Chris_914 Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2011 Posts: 344 Location: Las Vegas
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:42 am Post subject: |
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moncton_vw wrote: |
Thanks Chris_914 for your prompt reply, I'll definately look into that but I need help to install the ones I got today.
I've promissed my Girlfriend that I'd have the bus running by Saturday and I've been spending virtually all my spare time fixing the bus up and will be in deep sh*t if it is not ready for Saturday |
My 914 had a progressive on it when I got it. Not knowing any better in my younger days, I've used the metal ones, phenolic blocks, and then finally discovered the fibers ones. When you get a chance get a set of the fiber ones coming. For now fill just the little groove in the metal ones with silicone and let it set up. Think of it as making o-rings, use it sparingly. You only get one shot with these so torque them down evenly and make certian the cooling tin is not in the way. Don't forget to position the center carb mount piece before installing the second side. _________________ '75 Westfalia Camper FI 1.8L
'75 914 2.0L |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50260
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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You can just bolts the manifold on without any gasket, just using a judicious amount of silicone. |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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Gas eats silicone, Permatex #2 or Curil would be better in that application, your FLAPS sells gasket material by the sheet or roll, you've got patterns and likely have a knife or scissors, make your own
Dual progressives huh?, are they on cast manifolds of some sort? _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50260
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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busdaddy wrote: |
Gas eats silicone, Permatex #2 or Curil would be better in that application, your FLAPS sells gasket material by the sheet or roll, you've got patterns and likely have a knife or scissors, make your own
Dual progressives huh?, are they on cast manifolds of some sort? |
Gas may slowly soften silicone, but I would bet in this application if the piece fit well to start with, the silicone would last for a decade or more. One should let it harden off well before exposing it to the gasoline though.
Years ago some a$$ that borrowed my pickup and having dumped a bunch of water and dirt laced old gas in the tank decided that he should tear into my carb to abate his errors, but instead of fixing things he then used silicone on the gaskets when putting it back together. If silicone dissolved all that readily or even lost its adhesion, I would not have been getting clogged ports and jets from time to time over the next 5 years. Silicone may soften a bit in the presence of gas, but it doesn't go away. |
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moncton_vw Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2011 Posts: 88 Location: New Brunswick
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for your help
Busdaddy Wrote:
Quote: |
Dual progressives huh?, are they on cast manifolds of some sort? |
My bad, it's a single progressive... I bought some gasket maker (red copper or something, said it was good up to 371 degrees) at my local FLAPS and added a small bead to the aluminium gaskets I had. I'm thinking of going to dual carbs so I'll probably have to redo this job later this summer anyway
Spent most of my night re-assembling the engine tin I painted, almost done _________________ ---------------------------
79 Westfalia, Koni's, Fiamma F45i, Jamie Rivers Hitch and many hours of love and upgrades
12 Subaru Impreza 2.0i
04 Land Rover Discovery, 3" Terrafirma Lift, 33" Grabber AT2's, Tom Woods Driveshaft (SOLD) |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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Permatex #2 or the 600F version used to be best but it is alcohol base so I don't know what alcohol today in the fuel does. My experience has been that if you need gasket sealer to make it seal when it comes to manifolds where gasoline is flowing past it, your surfaces aren't flat enough yet. On a late car where the injectors are in the head, the manifold is upstream of the fuel so it doesn't matter as much. Can you use it as Wildthings said - yes. Should you use it as BusDaddy said - no. Make your own? That may be your best bet if you plan to cruise Saturday. Nothing like a long walk home or tinkering with the bus all day on the cruise to piss a girlfriend off. Trust me. I had one so pissed off at me cause I tinkered with a car one night in 1982 instead of spending all my time with her that we are just now starting to speak civilly to one another. I take full blame in case she reads this. Really. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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moncton_vw Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2011 Posts: 88 Location: New Brunswick
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Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:53 am Post subject: |
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Thanks again for the input on this. I will definately re-do the work I did last night in the very short future. Haven't test drove yet but confident that it will hold up for the weekend, both the Phenolic insulator blocks were cracked and the paper gaskets were dry and cracked to sh*ts.
I replaced alot of things in the past month on the bus and kept the wife nagging factor down by rebuilding the back yard deck and landscaping... I do 3 hours of back yard work, I get 3 hours of bus work... works like a charm, just costs more in beer _________________ ---------------------------
79 Westfalia, Koni's, Fiamma F45i, Jamie Rivers Hitch and many hours of love and upgrades
12 Subaru Impreza 2.0i
04 Land Rover Discovery, 3" Terrafirma Lift, 33" Grabber AT2's, Tom Woods Driveshaft (SOLD) |
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