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Joel
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Joined: September 04, 2006
Posts: 11099
Location: NSW Australia
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 Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| donbarnes wrote: |
Joel, you did say "9"x20, not a typo? That's not much bigger than some heater cores  . When you use these small radiators, some of them I've looked at seem to take smaller hose diameters than the Suby inlet pipes, are there adapters you can get, or just have to get close enough to stretch them on the motor side if needed?
Edit- Google says that Honda radiator has 1.12 inch inlets, and the Suby motor has 1.5 inch inlets- So how would you match them, will a 1.12 hose stretch to 1.5? |
Nope not a typo, that's it on the left compared to my original Mazda 323 radiator I was using.
It's double row which allows it to be more compact, I know of 3 others using the same radiator and 2 of them are 200+hp WRX conversions
You can just use reducers of some sort for the hoses, my radiator is 1.25" and my piping is 1.5" So I just made up some stainless steel reducers but you can get silicone hoses as you found out.
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Quick little bug, you got a Porsche motor in that?
1974 Germanlook 1303 2.5 Suba-Beetle |
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JeffRobenolt
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Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 1513
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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here is the radiator I'm got for my bug
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DUAL-CORE-2-ROW-RACING-COO...mp;vxp=mtr
About the same dimensions as what Joel is using. A little bigger at 12x26
Jeff
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| jfats808 wrote: |
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Vinnems
Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2008
Posts: 1183
Location: Simi Valley, CA
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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| I always get mad jealous when seeing Subaru conversions. I hope when the new VW engine I built dies, prices will have come down on certain conversion bits (like the transmission stuff) |
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donbarnes
Samba Member
Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:42 am Post subject: |
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I'm a packrat and have this compulsion to have a spare of everything  , so I picked up two Honda Civic radiators with their fans at the pnp today, neat looking little radiator with a fan housing that almost looks like an old style shroud, should fit right in the center of my existing rear cage. Next I need to search some old pics on here of cage mounted rads and see if people think I can leave the fan mounted on the engine side, mounting would be a lot easier that way, but not sure what the air flow would be like...
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donbarnes
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Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, guess I'm not very imaginative at search terms, found very few pics of rear cage mounted radiators... On the Honda radiator the fan is on the engine side, so I assume it has to be "pull" type, since it is "pulling" air in through the radiator going down the road, but if mounted the same way in a rear cage, it would still be pulling air in toward the engine, but the moving air going down the road would be fighting it? So I'm thinking it would need to be mounted on the backside of the radiator...I know there are tons of aftermarket fan options out there, but my goal is to use as many factory parts as possible...
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donbarnes
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Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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That little Honda radiator looks like it was made to fit in the middle section of my rear cage, I took one of them back to the pnp because it only had a 5/8 wide core, and am going to mount the other one that has a 1" core. For $225 on Ebag I can get a 2+ inch Koyo high performance all welded aluminum rad that is supposed to bolt right in the same spot. These Honda radiators don't look as convenient to mount the fan to as the radiators that have mounting rails down the side, but i think I see how to make u-shaped brackets that will transfer the fan to the back side of it so I can retain the factory Honda fan and shroud..
I looked up that black box from smallcar.com, but it looks like for a build with no emissions, check engine lights, or codes I can narrow the wiring going to the fuel tank down to just the black/red wire coming from the fuel pump relay and the ground wire and use them to power an external pump? On some Suby forums they say the fuel temp gauge in the tank doesn't effect running, just used by the ecu for running self diagnostics on the evap system..It seems to be running fine right now with everything except those two wires running to the tank disconnected..
I've got to pull up those diagrams Dan sent me and see if they show anything for oil pressure and water temp senders. Toward the front of the block behind the left rear of the alternator is what looks like an old school water or oil sender with a single green/white wire on it- doesn't show on my diagrams at all...
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Joel
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Joined: September 04, 2006
Posts: 11099
Location: NSW Australia
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| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| donbarnes wrote: |
Toward the front of the block behind the left rear of the alternator is what looks like an old school water or oil sender with a single green/white wire on it- doesn't show on my diagrams at all... |
That's your oil pressure warning light sender.
Nearly all fans work far more effectiently as pullers on the back of the rad.
Don't stress about the heat off the rad blowing over the motor, thats how all front engine cars are anyway, usually with the heatload of A/C condenser added in as well.
Just make sure the intake is getting nice cool fresh air away from it.
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Quick little bug, you got a Porsche motor in that?
1974 Germanlook 1303 2.5 Suba-Beetle |
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donbarnes
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Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Does the ecu monitor oil pressure or have any low pressure shutdown features in the 98 year model range? Haven't found a diagram yet of where the green wire from it runs to... If the ecu doesn't depend on the signal from that sender I can divert that wire to a gauge...
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Joel
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Joined: September 04, 2006
Posts: 11099
Location: NSW Australia
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| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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It just runs straight to the warning light same as the VW did.
Just a plain warning light feature.
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Quick little bug, you got a Porsche motor in that?
1974 Germanlook 1303 2.5 Suba-Beetle |
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donbarnes
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Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| jrobewesty wrote: |
My bug harness I am modifying it like it is going into a vanagon and I will add the radiator fan relay1 to the harness to control the rad fan.
Jeff |
Can you translate "fan relay 1" a little more, on the other posts I have bookmarked I don't see much discussion on how the fans are wired, just talk about how often they kick on and off. I plan on going from two fans to one, can I just leave all the "main fan/sub fan" relays and wiring in place and let the ecu control it with only one fan hooked up, or is there a simpler way? thanks..
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JeffRobenolt
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Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 1513
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 1:12 am Post subject: |
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It is just a basic relay, the ecm provides the ground for the relay when the temp get to about 203* and shuts back of at 196* or so.
I would think it would be easier to pull the harness out of the car and modify it. In the car seems like a lot of work.
It's a lot easier to say that now after doing a bunch though 
The smallcar box is to eliminate the check engine light coming on for things that you eliminate.
No matter what you are installing it in I would have a check engine light and obd2 port for a scan gauge. That is the bonus of the obd2.
Are you going to run a 2.5 or 2.2?
Most say a speed sensor is a must also
Green wire is oil pressure and purple is h2o temp gauge
Jeff
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| jfats808 wrote: |
| Most, some, few is not all. You can always learn something from everyone , even the fool. |
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dan macmillan
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Joined: October 19, 2003
Posts: 3110
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 5:52 am Post subject: |
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If I remember correctly they are dual speed fans.
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Licensed Automotive Service Technician
Licensed Truck and Coach Technician
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66 Modified Manx,68 Kyote,74 Thing,74 Beetle, 76 Transporter,75 self made Double Cab,65 Meyers Manx,78Westy,68 Ghia, 79 Bradley GT2
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Joel
Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2006
Posts: 11099
Location: NSW Australia
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| Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 5:59 am Post subject: |
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Only after 96ish, they're single speed prior to that.
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Quick little bug, you got a Porsche motor in that?
1974 Germanlook 1303 2.5 Suba-Beetle |
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donbarnes
Samba Member
Joined: February 28, 2011
Posts: 731
Location: Wilmington,NC
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| Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2012 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| jrobewesty wrote: |
I would think it would be easier to pull the harness out of the car and modify it. In the car seems like a lot of work.
It's a lot easier to say that now after doing a bunch though
Are you going to run a 2.5 or 2.2?
Jeff |
Its a 2.5, and its not really a car anymore  , all thats left is the firewall forward (all the dash and heat/ac stuff is gone), with the strut towers cut away and a big section of the firewall on each side also cut out- just enough metal left there to act as an engine cradle and hold up the fans and radiator. I've stripped away two five gallon buckets of wiring and sold them for $20 scrap value, the ecu wiring is looking a lot more compact now, I still have a handful of mostly heavy gauge wiring on the drivers side going into the factory fuse box and the relay box near the battery. Some of that wiring may eventually go away, but right now the I still have the ignition switch, fan relays, and alternator all still working and that is what the majority of that wiring is. The only fuses left in the fuse box are one that says "main fan", one that says "e/g ign srs airbag" that it won't start without, and one fan relay. It still starts and runs great, but I've probably gone about as far as I can for a while until I can afford the Kennedy kit, although I'm looking for a rear facing lower radiator hose housing that someone on another build thread posted a pic of...
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