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1973 Bay window,1700cc and automatic transmission, with a/c
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:12 pm    Post subject: 1973 Bay window,1700cc and automatic transmission, with a/c Reply with quote

So here's my bus the evening I went to tow it home from Lodi, (pronounced LOW-dye)California.

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The other hubcap was laying inside. Rust areas are the windshield seal rib, a little bit of light surface rust under the driver's side floor mat and along the panel where the sliding door runs. I haven't dragged a weak magnet around looking for bondo yet. The M-plate reads White over Orient Blue (not the rattle can restoration you're currently viewing Shocked ) and it was imported through Los Angeles. It lived in Lodi for the last 16 years, but the owner (it was his dad's, since deceased) could not confirm its history before that. Per the M-Plate Decoder website, the window and door arrangement is correct, and the engine letter code is correct to match its automatic transmission. All the seats were there, spare tire and cover and we drove it around a little. The engine is suffering from at least a serious vacuum leak where the rubber connecting boots have failed where they join the intake air tubes at the throttle body/carburetor.


Last edited by Wasted youth on Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:30 pm; edited 5 times in total
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some interior pictures of that day:

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The rubber floor mat seems good for its age, but certainly not show quality. The seats are there and complete, but held down with scrap metal, wire and other crap. Weirdly enough, back in 1997 when I had started dialing in my 1971 bus (since sold Crying or Very sad ) I had saved a soup can full of those special seat clamps and T bolts. I had them for sale at two or three yard sales, but they never sold. Since 1997, I've moved six times, and I found the bolts right away in one of my piles of crap. They were never meant to be sold, right?!
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Score one for the Pack Rat! Nice ya kept the bits n pieces.

Congrats!
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is either cosmic confirmation or you horde so much stuff that eventually "A" would HAVE to go with "B". I am in the later category myself and always delighted when I have a part I need! Nice looking Bus, love that huge automatic shifter.
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are a few from the engine compartment:

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Here is where I'd like to hear more commentary about defects or interesting observations by you gearheads. First, I'm pretty sure this was built with dual carbs. This engine features an air condtioning compressor (refrigerant lines disconnected), and the engine compartment is missing the cabin heater blower assembly. The engine foam seal is long gone, and I bet some tin pieces are, too. The intake air tubes have slightly cracked/decomposed rubber boots greatly contributing to a vacuum leak. The cooling fan screen is missing, and I see various brackets, holes and such where it looks like things are missing. For the geek in me, the VW Test Plug is still there. I hope to one day set up a rolling test instrument rack and actually use the plug. Cool

I bought a spare, complete, and totally stock dual-carb Type 4 engine as a "Ready Service Spare", but it will need to be rebuilt first. It turns over by hand fine, seems like it has good compression, but the seller warned me the driver's side head is damaged. Later, I'll learn what that really Shocked means! Right now that spare is resting in the corner of my garage waiting its turn.

I have bought the Bentley, and Tom Wilson's book, and from my local library, I borrowed the "How to Keep your Volkswagen Alive..." book with all that great artwork reminiscent of R. Crumb and the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers. So, with those books as guides, and as time and money permits, I will resume the TLC program I began with that sorely abused 1971 bus I foolishly sold.


Last edited by Wasted youth on Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:49 pm    Post subject: more pix, underneath Reply with quote

Here is the starter side of the engine/transmission. Electric fuel pump. Note the brittle fuel lines, the cheazy fuel filter. Nice lack of rust, not an east coast or PNW car. Losts of grease, and the seal around the trans pan is wet. Although the CV joint boots look fine, they actually broke apart when I took them off.

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Here are a couple from the wheel wells:

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I'm hoping that the evidence of the Orient Blue still readily visible in the wheel wells is a good indicator that there is not a lot of hidden rust elsewhere, like rocker panels, etc.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Nice Bus !
Now the fun begins starting to clean and fix every thing .
Look like it's in really good shape no Bad rust !!!
The Machine that Vw had to plug into the test port in the engine bay was as big as a semi, well not that big but you get what I mean !
Take it one step at a time!
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nicely done on that acquisition! BTW, what year is it? I have a 78 Automatic deluxe, and I was pleasantly surprised, never having driven one before.

BTW, those of us who grew up listening to Creedence Clearwater Revival, know how to pronounce Lodi.... Laughing Wink
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I almost got 'stuck in Lodi again', where I learned about two seperate styles of CV joint screws. Rolling Eyes

It's a 1973 model year. According to another Samba member, this was the first year of the A/T, and following years' transmission models were slightly different, and those were the same trannies VW put in the Rabbit.

By the way, what makes a bus 'deluxe'? I've seen that reference before, but still not sure of the details.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasted youth/adulthood wrote:
I almost got 'stuck in Lodi again', where I learned about two seperate styles of CV joint screws. Rolling Eyes

It's a 1973 model year. According to another Samba member, this was the first year of the A/T, and following years' transmission models were slightly different, and those were the same trannies VW put in the Rabbit.

By the way, what makes a bus 'deluxe'? I've seen that reference before, but still not sure of the details.


It may or may not be correct, but I am calling it a deluxe as mine has a sunroof. Referring back to the split window 21 & 23 Window deluxe, in my case.

Been there, with the different CV joint bolts. Enough to make you crazy especially if you don't have all your tools with you. I have always put all the proper ones in asap! Wink
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 12:15 am    Post subject: ATE Brake Caliper Rebuild 1973-79 Reply with quote

I would like to revive this thread as a 'build thread', and I have done a lot of work since I brought it home. My experience with the features of this bus was either greatly limited or non-existent. I have no experience with VW air conditioning, and had no experience with the 1700cc or Type 4 engine. No experience either with the 003 transmission. Some of that experience has changed in the last year. Let's start with the brakes: Part 1 - ATE calipers, 1973 model year.

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Here I am driving out one of the pins that holds the caliper brake hardware in place. These pins have a small ball-like fitting on one end that should be carefully driven into the body of the caliper when replaced. This hardware is replaceable, and I chose not to re-use the old hardware. In this picture, I am driving out the pin from the opposite end of the little ball fitting.

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By the way, the cause of me getting into these was a seized caliper during a test drive trying to learn how to make a Weber Progessive DFAV carburetor work. More on that later...it turned out well for me anyway! Very Happy

Next, I removed the dust seal around both pistons. I used a small 90* scribe or pick to get under the lip. Don't scratch the piston!

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A few of the pistons were stuck in place, so I carefully used a clamp and a wooden handle to compress the piston to break them free.

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Next, I reversed my efforts with compressed air through one of the bleed ports. Be careful! It take less than 15 PSI to accomplish this, and the pistons could pop out violently. If this happens, they can bounce across the shop floor, risking condemning damage. I prevented this by wrapping a shop towel around the caliper body to help capture them. Once you have one of them free, it will be impossible to free up the other one without replacing the first piston back in its recess, because now there is nothing in place to build up the air pressure. So, clean up the first piston, and carefully reseat it with lots of brake fluid all around it. Reseat it just enough to make a seal, not all the way back in. Block it in place with a clamp or piece of wood. Then, repeat the process using the low pressure air to free up the other piston.

In this picture, I have the clamp and wood in place, but loose. I apply air to break it free about a 1/4 inch, then removed the clamp/wood, and wrapped with a towel.
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Freed-up pistons:
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By this time, I had learned about the piston retaining plates that were missing in my calipers. I learned that a special tool was available to rotate the pistons so they are properly positioned in the calipers to accept the retaining plates. The tool was sourced through Scotts German Supply, but was unavailabe at the time. I tried to carefully rotate the piston in place using a brass drift by lightly tapping it around. The idea here is to figure out first where the piston needs to sit, then put it in by hand, then fine tune it with the drift. It worked fine; more on that later.

Here is a picture of the brass drift seeing how well the idea would work. The arrow points to where the brass drift needs to index into the shoulder of the piston lock cut out. Look carefully at the pistons. The top shoulder does not go all the way around! That's where the plates index.
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Some people refer to these plates as shims, but they are not. They keep the pistons from rotating with the force of the disc during braking, and so help apply even braking power. Others have different opinions about this. I found it is nearly as controversial as the Weber Progressive. Rolling Eyes

Disassembled caliper, piston cup or recess. Note scum, rust and pitting.
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I cleaned out the cup with a light buffing of emery cloth and a wash of mineral spirits. The manual advises against honing, or disassembling the caliper, unless the halves are leaking. I was left with some pitting:
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Here is what it would ideally look like after 40 years of service:
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All the parts in exploded lay-out. Missing: Spring washers for caliper bolts, and the all-important piston retaining plates.
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I was disappointed at how impossible it was to find a set of retaining plates. The one new plate shown here was the last in stock from Bus Depot at the time, at a price of more than $14 each Shocked I couldn't find any anywhere, except out of a Vanagon from my local VW wrecking yard. That's those cleaned of rust and ready to be rattle-canned primered. It would have been better to have them re-plated.

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Here is the caliper ready to be reassembled:
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Next: Reassembly!

Thanks for your comments. I will try to keep adding to this, a little bit at a time. I have a lot to post! Also, I need to keep working on the bus.

Reassembly:

After I cleaned the piston, the piston cup and used compressed air to blow out both the top and bottom bleed ports in both directions, it was time to start reassembly. The first puzzle is trying to figure out the relationship of the piston and the retaining plate. By the way, some people call these locking plates.

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I looked in the Bentley and tried to match it up. I was able to match the two holes in the ears of the plate with the guide pin slots on the caliper. The guide pins are those pins you saw me drive out earlier with a small steel drift. Those pins come in a kit called "ATE Brake Hardware Kit" locally available or through your favorite VeeDub vendor.

The plates have two machine-punched tabs, they are about a 30* angle. They go inward, facing the piston. This is where the piston indexes into the plates. If you hold the plate in one hand, then place the piston with its notched shoulder onto the plate, and it indexes and is seated flush with the plate, try to rotate the piston. If you can't rotate the piston without it also trying to move the plate in your other hand, then you have it correct!


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Now, hold it all together and note the relationship between the caliper, the piston and the plate. The smooth side of the plate will face the steel backing plate side of the brake pad. The purpose of this exercise is so you can become familiar with reassembly, and not manage to put the plates in backwards, as someone did with one of my Vanagon salvaged plates. Doing that will flatten the tabs and make the plate useless.

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Now, it's time to put the rubber O-ring into the groove that you can see inside the piston cup on the caliper. It's that dark recess you can see toward the top of the cup opening. This also comes in a kit, which should have two dust boots and two O-rings. Ths O-rings have square sides; they are not your typical O-ring. I was very liberall with clean brake fluid. The Bentley recommends Wheel Cylinder Grease, which was met with the deer-in-the-headlights look when I inquired about some at my local FLAPS.

In one of my earlier pictures, you can see a box from FAG that has a part number on it. Thats the O-ring/dust boot kit. I got mine off the shelf from Century Distributing in Visalia, California.

I found it a little troubling to install the O-ring, then install the piston. I think it would have been a lot easier to use the special piston positioning pliers to work it into place, but again, I was not able to obtain those. I wound up pressing the pistons past the O-ring with a graduall and even pressure from a clamp. At a certain point, they popped in past the O-ring. The two red arrows point to the notched shoulder where they will index with the retaining plate. I tried to position the pistons in place for this idea, so the final placement with the tapping of the brass drift would be minimized. ChannelLock or slip joint pliers won't fit in there very well!

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I kept the clamp's foot evenly positioned, and applied gradual pressure, constantly checking that nothing was getting cocked or bent. In this picture, look at the top of the two new guide pins. See the little raisin-looking pieces? Those keep the pins from sliding out, and should be tapped into place with an appropriate drift pin and light hammer. Check the final assembly pictures below to see how they are seated into the caliper.
With the parts properly installed, nothing can fall out due to the two guide pins.

Also, don't be confused by this picture! It doesn't show the dust boot installed which needs to happen before the rest of the hardware! I made this picture to show you that the best way I found to evenly install the piston was by using the guide pins to hold the pad and retaining plate straight and even so the clamp's effort would also be even. That's why the pins are not yet driven into place. After the piston was pressed into the cup, I took the hardware back off and installed the dust boots.

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Next, I installed the dust boot. The Bentley said I would need a special press or tool, but I found this was not the case, but I had to ensure it really was seated properly. Note how I totally forgot to clean that groove? FAIL! Evil or Very Mad
Again, I used plenty of clean brake fluid to do the work.

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I have never used this stuff, but thought I would try it. I did not use any 'disc brake squeal quiet goop' in this rebuild. You could see in my earlier pictures that someone else did though. That's the little smear of orange goo that looks like RTV.

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Here is what mine looked like when I was done; not shown: New bleeder valves that were special order (WTF?!) at the time. I got the little dust boots, too Very Happy See how the two guide pins are now driven into place?

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When I was ready to install the calipers, I got the missing spring washers and added 'led plate' to the caliper bolts (luv this stuff!) and set the torque per spec. Pay attention to the caliper bolts. One has a shoulder and only fits in a prescribed way. Check the book, I can't remember if it goes on top or not.
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But it wasn't time for that just yet! Next thing, I put both calipers in a box, and shelved them, because now it was time to renew all the brake hoses.

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The red circle around the wrench is to draw your attention to the idea that it is best to use a flare nut (or tubing ) wrench when replacing the brake hoses. I don't like using end wrenches for tubing work. Shown is an ASE tubing wrench. Since then I bought a metric set Razz .

Next: Rear Drum Brakes.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What excellent documentation skills you have. Keep up the good work!
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, a super post. Having Bentley to describe the steps is one thing, having an excellent set of photos to fill in the gaps is another. Keep it up, I'll be following along.

kj
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

peaceful warrior wrote:

BTW, those of us who grew up listening to Creedence Clearwater Revival, know how to pronounce Lodi.... Laughing Wink


Whenever I roll through Lodi, that song pops in my mind, and I wonder if we will get "stuck". Smile
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasted youth wrote:
Next: Reassembly!


I moved this up to the first post, to complete the the Tech tip.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice caliper write-up !!! I'm following along now !
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So out of the strangest coincidence I had to replace the rear caliper on a 1999 Saab 9-3 turbo and its the same exact caliper as the one you rebuilt ! I knew the those calipers were used across a broad range of vehicles but my mind was a little blown, especially after commenting on your thread a few hours before I even had that caliper in my hands.
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1999 Saab 9-3 turbo... Razz

Looks like they came up with a good caliper design, then!
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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasted youth/adulthood wrote:
1999 Saab 9-3 turbo... Razz

Looks like they came up with a good caliper design, then!


Saab didn't design anything new, they just borrowed it from another manufacturer like they so often do.
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