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roset
Samba Member
Joined: January 18, 2006
Posts: 39
Location: Eugene, OR
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 Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:23 am Post subject: Rear Bench Seat Belt Laws |
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Hey. I have a 73 Westy and the rear bench and jumpseat (behind the driver seat) don't have seat belts. Is this legal? I've been looking on forums and keep hearing that if it didn't come with belts, then you don't need them. Is this true? There are belts in the driver and passenger seats, but nothing in the back of the bus...
I'm also going to be driving through Canada and will go camping with some friends so the bus will be full of people....will that be a problem?
Thanks!
Oh, and the bus is titled and plated in Wisconsin
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kkjellquist
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Joined: June 04, 2013
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Bala
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udidwht
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Joined: March 06, 2005
Posts: 3779
Location: Seattle, WA./ HB, Ca./ Shizuoka, Japan
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:51 am Post subject: Re: Rear Bench Seat Belt Laws |
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| roset wrote: |
Hey. I have a 73 Westy and the rear bench and jumpseat (behind the driver seat) don't have seat belts. Is this legal? I've been looking on forums and keep hearing that if it didn't come with belts, then you don't need them. Is this true? There are belts in the driver and passenger seats, but nothing in the back of the bus...
I'm also going to be driving through Canada and will go camping with some friends so the bus will be full of people....will that be a problem?
Thanks!
Oh, and the bus is titled and plated in Wisconsin |
73...someone removed them then. There should be 2 on the rear bench and 1 one the jump seat (behind driver).
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djdh68dlux
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Joined: February 24, 2005
Posts: 770
Location: I.E., SoCal
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Seatbelts became mandatory for USA sold autos in 1965. Laws requiring everybody to actually USE the seatbelts varied from state to state. My dad has a 1963 MGB that to this day has no seatbelts. I remember riding around in it with him all the time in the 80s as a kid, convertible top down and everything. In hindsight, probably not the smartest thing to do, but people were either tougher or dumber back then! 
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Vince Waldon
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Joined: November 07, 2010
Posts: 451
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:28 pm Post subject: Re: Rear Bench Seat Belt Laws |
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| roset wrote: |
I'm also going to be driving through Canada |
Seatbelt laws in Canada are under both federal and provincial jurisdiction... meaning the actual specifics will depend on what province you are traveling thru, but as far as I know the concept of "one person one seatbelt" is universal, regardless of when the vehicle was made.
Some provinces have exemptions for "historic" vehicles, but nothing I've read suggests a VW bus is considered "historic".
And, at the end of the day... isn't it just best to have 'em, regardless of the law? They are already not the most crash-resistant vehicle... 
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stubing
Samba Member
Joined: November 30, 2011
Posts: 80
Location: Almonte, Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Look under those seat positions because my '72 has belts for two on the bench/bed and on the jumpseat. The PO may have removed them. These lap belts should be restored for the safety of your passengers and period correctness! |
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Desertbusman
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Joined: June 03, 2005
Posts: 14655
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:25 pm Post subject: Re: Rear Bench Seat Belt Laws |
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| roset wrote: |
Hey. I have a 73 Westy and the rear bench and jumpseat (behind the driver seat) don't have seat belts............... I'm also going to be driving through Canada and will go camping with some friends so the bus will be full of people....will that be a problem?
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Are you worried about getting a citation but don't have any regard for the welfare of your passengers?  
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GeorgeL
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Joined: January 16, 2006
Posts: 7346
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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Umm, if he cared about their welfare in a crash he'd put them in a Honda Odyssey, not a bus!
Folks would have a fit if they could see the old days, with kids happily playing on the floor of the bus as it rolled along, rather than being strapped into seats, unable to move, with a video screen in front of them continuously!
+5 for safety, -100 for humanity. |
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stuming
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Joined: August 10, 2010
Posts: 257
Location: London, UK.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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... guys, I think all someone needed to say was: yes, for something this age they're probably legal, but, no, you don't want to drive your family around like that.
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stuming
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Joined: August 10, 2010
Posts: 257
Location: London, UK.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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... guys, I think all someone needed to say was: yes, for something this age they're probably legal, but, no, you don't want to drive your family around like that.
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stubing
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Joined: November 30, 2011
Posts: 80
Location: Almonte, Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Legally a '73 should have lap belts from the VW factory or Westfalia factory . |
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Dampcamper
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Joined: October 07, 2013
Posts: 788
Location: Rainy Portland, Oregon
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| djdh68dlux wrote: |
| Seatbelts became mandatory for USA sold autos in 1965. Laws requiring everybody to actually USE the seatbelts varied from state to state. My dad has a 1963 MGB that to this day has no seatbelts. I remember riding around in it with him all the time in the 80s as a kid, convertible top down and everything. In hindsight, probably not the smartest thing to do, but people were either tougher or dumber back then! |
No, we survivors were just luckier... |
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cdennisg
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Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| djdh68dlux wrote: |
| Seatbelts became mandatory for USA sold autos in 1965. Laws requiring everybody to actually USE the seatbelts varied from state to state. My dad has a 1963 MGB that to this day has no seatbelts. I remember riding around in it with him all the time in the 80s as a kid, convertible top down and everything. In hindsight, probably not the smartest thing to do, but people were either tougher or dumber back then! |
Actually, I a m pretty sure that seat belts are mandatory only for vehicles built after August 1, 1967. Previous to that and after the date you mentioned, most manufacturers had mounting points installed, and belts were installed at the dealer.
Rear seat seat belt requirements came later than those for front seats, but I am not exactly sure on the date.
Your best bet would be to install belts for any passengers you plan to carry. Now worries then.
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roset
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Joined: January 18, 2006
Posts: 39
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:56 am Post subject: |
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Thanks everyone. I'd call the DMV, but at the moment I am living in Italy and won't be back for a month or so. Just trying to get all my thoughts about getting the bus ready for the road again in order.
Good to know the belts did come originally on the bus and that they must have been removed.
GeorgeL is right...not the safest vehicles in the world, but yes, of course I'm not just concerned with the law but also with passenger safty....
It's just that when I got the car and had it checked out by the state (Kansas at the time), they mentioned nothing of the lack of rear seat belts and seemed to check everything out before giving me the title and registration. So I have been driving around with no belts in the back (have front belts) for the past 7 years....granted there are never really any people in the back....
Thanks for the input.
And would I just need to install lap belts? not 3 point?
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Ein VW Muss Man Haben!!
Current VWs:
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- Std. 1700 CC with Weber Carb
- Groovy Paint Job
1972 Squareback |
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aeromech
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Joined: January 24, 2006
Posts: 16971
Location: San Diego, California
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:26 am Post subject: |
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I looked this up once when I owned a 1962 bug. The rule is if the vehicle wasn't built with belts and has never had them installed then they aren't required. For instance, they wouldn't make you install belts into your model A Ford. That said, as far as I know all 1973 buses had belts.
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GeorgeL
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Joined: January 16, 2006
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| Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 11:36 am Post subject: |
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| roset wrote: |
| ...And would I just need to install lap belts? not 3 point? |
You need the belts it came with, in this case lap belts.
However, all bays (IIRC) have hard points for 3-point belts on the outboard positions of the middle and rear seats. This may not apply to campers, though. You might also consider self-adjusting retracting reels to make things easier for your passengers.
The stock belts on early '70s buses were difficult to fasten and adjust and modern belts are far better in that regard. They are readily available in wrecking yards. Just don't take them from a crashed car! |
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