| Author |
Message |
smitty24
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2008
Posts: 2723
Location: Salem, Oregon
|
 Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:01 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
I did not see what distributor either, is it an 009 or something like an Svda? The Svda and 34/3 are a good combo. My old 1641 with Engle 110 was ranging 22-26 in town (spirited) and 28-32 freeway cruising.
Correct timing, distributor, and carb jetting/tuning is a MUST! I used to get 14-18mpg in town in Colorado with my dp 1600 when my engine was NOT jet and tuned right.
Keep at it bro, things will work out with perseverance! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
crvc
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004
Posts: 1308
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| KTPhil wrote: |
Also check out:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289344
and the links there.
I just re-read your original post... that 34 carb is too large for a single-port 1600. That engine came with a 30 PICT-1 carb. I would look for the right carb before playing with jets. And you still may want to go one size smaller than stock at your altitude. |
I have a dual-port.
crvc |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 33986
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 5:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| crvc wrote: |
| KTPhil wrote: |
Also check out:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289344
and the links there.
I just re-read your original post... that 34 carb is too large for a single-port 1600. That engine came with a 30 PICT-1 carb. I would look for the right carb before playing with jets. And you still may want to go one size smaller than stock at your altitude. |
I have a dual-port.
crvc |
I still think it may be too much carb for a 1600 at your altitude. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
60ragtop
Bonneville Belt Bitch
Joined: March 13, 2006
Posts: 7800
Location: Big Wonderful WYO 82401
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 6:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| KTPhil wrote: |
I still think it may be too much carb for a 1600 at your altitude. |
What do you suggest then seeing VW installed the 34 carb on most dual port engines  It is not to much carb for the elevation, if it were there would be no bugs in the mountain areas.
Stock Dual port engines generally do not get the MPH of single ports.
Most do 22-28 MPH.
I'd guess driving habit has a lot to do with it.
I get 4-5 MPG's more than my wife driving the same vehicle no matter which it is, old or new 
With all the troubles you have with this car trade it in on a Buick 
_________________
Rick
Certified Mechanic by the State of Michigan in 1977
ASA certified in 1987
Certified Hunter Wheel Alignment Master Technician 1986
| tasb wrote: |
I've restored a large number too, but I don't toot my horn quite as loud.
|
| sb001 wrote: |
| maybe he just snapped cause his car sucked |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
crvc
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004
Posts: 1308
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 10:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks for all the replies.
So maybe I'm losing gas from a leak at the fuel filter. It's likely I'm burning gas due to wrong jetting and maybe I'm losing gas due to a leaky float valve. But I doubt it. In the past I had leaky float and ended up with gas in the crankcase. Not the case here. I don't know whether the type-2 cam is a factor but I do have a lot of torque, more than other bugs I've owned.
But after 10 years of working on this bug I'm sick of it. Right now I'm debating between a used Ram 1500 (28mpg) or used Toyota Tundra (19mpg). Since my tools are metric the Toyota makes more sense but 28mpg is hard to ignore.
crvc |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Oilspot11
Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2014
Posts: 135
Location: Green Mountain Falls, Colorado
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| 28 mpg on a Ram 1500? Downhill, maybe. Mine gets a standard 13. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gt1953
Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2002
Posts: 13846
Location: White Mountains Arizona
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 1:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
You can advance the timing a few degrees due to your elevation.
Sound like you are a lil rich on the jets. Add larger air jet.
I live and drive 6500 feet my MPG is 25 and up.
Keep the VW and dial that engine in.
_________________
Volkswagen: We tune what we drive.
Numbers Matching VW's are getting harder to find. Source out the most Stock vehicle and keep that way. You will be glad you did.
72 type 1
72 Squareback
({59 Euro bug, 62, 63, 67, 68, 69, 73 type ones 68 & 69 type two, 68 Ghia all sold}) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aussiebug
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2002
Posts: 2162
Location: Adelaide Australia
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 4:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| KTPhil wrote: |
Also check out:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289344
and the links there.
I just re-read your original post... that 34 carb is too large for a single-port 1600. That engine came with a 30 PICT-1 carb. I would look for the right carb before playing with jets. And you still may want to go one size smaller than stock at your altitude. |
Phil - His engine is a dual port. And the 1600sp did NOT use a 30PICT/1 - it used a 30PICT/3 which has much more complex fuel circuitry.
30PICT/1s were designed for 1300s, not 1600s. The first 30PICT/1s did not even have a power jet system, so when THOSE carbs are used on 1500/1600 engine, they run the engine very lean at full throttle (not good). The clone versions made these days should have a power jet, but they are still a little small for a 1600.
| GT1953 wrote: |
You can advance the timing a few degrees due to your elevation.
Sound like you are a lil rich on the jets. Add larger air jet.
I live and drive 6500 feet my MPG is 25 and up.
Keep the VW and dial that engine in. |
If you increase just the air correction jet, that leans the mid range mixture only, so it leaves the engine running rich at lower and higher speeds. But I agree that he should be able to get it working better than it is.
Altering the FUEL jets affects the whole rpm range.
Jetting the 34PICT/3 on a 1600 engine; for distributor, altitude and fuel.
Stock jetting was usually 55 idle, 127.5 main jet, 80 air correction and 65 power jet. That's at sea level, when used with a vacuum distributor, and straight gasoline.
First, think about the engine at sea level.
Stock main jet 127.5.
Got 10% ethanol in the fuel? That leans the mixture 4% and since each jet size changes fuel consumption by about 2%, you go two sizes larger - 132.5.
Got a 009 distributor? That requires a richer mixture to reduce the flat spot - so go for a 130 for straight gasoline or 135 for 10% Ethanol.
Now for each 5000' you need to reduce the jet size by one size, so 127.5 for straight gasoline and a vacuum distributor, or 132.5 for straight gasoline and a 009 distributor for example.
This main jet chart might help
----------------------Straight gas------10% Ethanol----5000' gas----5000' Eth
vacuum distributor----127.5--------------132.5----------125----------130.5
009 distributor --------130/132.5---------140------------127.5--------135
Sorry about all the dashes - it was the only way I could get the chart to line up.
Generally you can keep the same air correction jet, the idle jet and the power jet, but at altitude with a vacuum distributor and straight gas, you might try a 50 idle rather than a 55.
The above are suggestions - due to the engine age and condition, carb condition and differences in individual tuning, some changes to those sizes might be needed.
Whilst you can use the smaller carbs on a 1600 duel port, you do loose some performance and since you already loose a bit with altitude, it might not be the way to go.
The 30 series carbs have a 24mm throat versus 26mm for the 34PICT/3 carb - that's a 17% difference in throat area, so roughly 17% difference in total airflow when both carbs are working to the max.
Having said that, my 71 1600 dual port engine works very well (at sea level with straight gasoline) with a 30PICT/2 carb designed for a 1500sp - a very slight drop in performance at high speeds (it runs out of breath) but good pulling power at lower revs.
_________________
Rob
Rob and Dave's aircooled VW pages
Repairs and maintenance for the home mechanic
http://www.vw-resource.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grandpa pete
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2008
Posts: 6426
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 10:25 am Post subject: Re: Normal MPG? |
|
|
| crvc wrote: |
1967 bug, With the tire removed I smell gas.
crvc |
Check your vent tube . Many have been shortened by well meaning but misinformed po's .
There are two plastic clips ( NLA ) that hold the vent tube in place And a hole in the sheet metal for it .
_________________
63 two fold rag
66 sedan delivery Type 6
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=569619&highlight=sedan+delivery |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
itskyle
Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2013
Posts: 634
Location: Plainfield, IN
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Normal MPG? |
|
|
| crvc wrote: |
1967 bug, engine replaced with type-2 block, line-bored with new bearings, 1600cc AA pistons/cylinders, heads given new valves and guides at machine shop, stock muffler.
I've been noting mileage for months, finally sat down with note book and calculator. It tells me for the past 6 months the bug has been getting between 14 and 18mpg on city streets. In summer closer to 18mpg. In winter less than 15mpg.
I drive daily at 7-8000ft altitude with steep hills. There is a fuel filter behind the right rear tire. With the tire removed I smell gas. It seems leaky but not to the point of leaving a drip or stain on concrete. It has a 34PICT 3 carb, 2-3 years old and covered with staining and gas odor if I'm close enough.
Any comments or suggestions?
I'm ready to trade it in for a pickup. If I have to live with 18mph might as well have a truck.
TIA,
crvc |
Air pressure on tires?
_________________
--
69 or 72 Autostick Bug current
66 Bug (We both miss it)
74 SuperBeetle Auto Stick (I miss that car)
73 SquareBack, Straight Stick (Wife misses this one.) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jack1448
Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2012
Posts: 271
Location: Northern NJ
|
| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Lots of good tips on the engine, but don't forget the rest of the car. Make sure alignment and wheel bearings are in good condition, and brakes aren't causing excess drag! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
crvc
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004
Posts: 1308
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 10:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
I ordered a 127 main jet. Taking the old jet out it's hard to read the number but with a magnifying lens I think says Solex 115. That done, it drives horribly; No ability to climb even mild grades. I buy the lowest octane gas. Could that be a factor along with the change in jets?
crvc |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
crvc
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004
Posts: 1308
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The old jet was 115. Yesterday I replaced it with a 127. And now it runs badly. In my junk drawer I found an old pict 34 with a 120 main jet. I guess the next step is trying that jet.
crvc |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Max Welton
Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003
Posts: 10697
Location: Black Forest, CO
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
crvc
Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004
Posts: 1308
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It seems to run better with the 120 main jet. Someone has suggested a second gasket for the top of the carb. So I added a gasket off an old carb. But when took the carb off to change the jet I saw I now had three gaskets atop the carb. Don't remember ever adding a second gasket but I must have in the past 10 years. So I took two gaskets off while changing the jet.
crvc |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Max Welton
Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003
Posts: 10697
Location: Black Forest, CO
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
