Another TDI Vanagon discussion...

[Jsstr8]

So since this topic hasn't been discussed enough, I thought I would start another post. I had planned on putting a 1.9TD(AAZ) into my van and have done quite a bit of research on it. However, a really good deal on an AHU TDI just came my way and I am going to have to take it.
The engine has been removed, but the wiring harness is still in the car. I was told that I can retrieve it if I wanted. I may just go the m-TDI route, but would like to have the harness in case I decide to do the full e-TDI. I will be reading up and will post pics and updates of the progress.
Any input, opinions, or deprecations are welcome.

[AndyBees]

Not an AAZ, AHU, nor a m-TDI ....... (ALH with most all of the bells and whistles)

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=276798
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[Jsstr8]

I'm pretty intimidated by the electronics. Plus I think most people have to modify the engine cover to accommodate the ALH (my Vanagon is a Westy). I wanted to do AAZ because it was 100% mechanical and much less intimidating. However I can still go the m-TDI route if I can't figure the electronics out.
I will agree that ALH would be sweet, just not for me. I'm only going AHU because of the deal.

[singler3360]

Yes, lot's of discussion on here and the Yahoo forum about regearing, tire size, chipping and other mods. Driving according to EGT is very important. While driving within acceptable limits of RPM and EGT on a recent roadtrip, my AHU with about 10k miles experienced a catastrophic valve failure that also took out the turbo. I'm having a new completely rebuilt motor and turbo professionally installed and then will most likely put this van up for sale. My wife has MS and this setup is too hard for her to drive - too many gauges to monitor.

I love the performance of the TDI; the torque and MPG. If you drive by EGT properly within service limits, you will find yourself going 55-60 mph in some situations, whether on hills or into a strong headwind. This is the only thing I don't like about it on the open highway.

[Jsstr8]

I have the 1.6NA in my van, so just getting onto the interstate would be an improvement. Sorry to hear about your wife and having to part with your van. Shouldn't be hard to find it a new home. I'll keep your wife in my thoughts/prayers.

[Waldi]

Go with the mech AHU.

Just find someone who does a good pump for you.

[Zeitgeist 13]

An mTDI AHU @ fifty degrees would be very similar to an AAZ install.

If you get the harness from the donor, you can send it to a vendor and have them convert it to a plug n' play unit for Vanagon eTDI. Then you just need to resolve the pedal potentiometer. The rest of the intercooler, pyrometer and coolant line stuff would be standard diesel install tasks. The one thing you should consider is that the AAZ doesn't absolutely require trans re-gearing, which in the TDI is pretty much is a must...oh, I see you have the original DJ trans, which is geared super low. No matter what turbodiesel option you choose, I would plan on swapping in a DK code aircooled van trans at the very least.
_________________
Casey--

'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik?

[Zeitgeist 13]

Is this an AAZ manifold and turbo?

_________________
Casey--

'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik?

[singler3360]

[AndyBees]

I pulled this rig to Alaska and return last summer with no problems. EGTs were never an issue. I have a McNally EGT gauge set-up. I run 70 mph on the expressway with camper. It has a Stage 1 Malone tune.

Yes, the engine needs a raised lid or at least a hole cut in the existing lid with a cap over the spot. I've seen a few Westys with the hole in the lid.

Yes, sorry to hear about your wife's condition. My wife has a few skeletal issues that she deals with daily. We both are at that point in life that putting things off not an option. We want to go and do as much as possible now, not later. Those health issues will sooner or later bring it all to a halt !

Good luck with your project and hope all goes well for your wife!
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[singler3360]

[Zeitgeist 13]

What type of intercooler setup do you run, and where did you locate the pyrometer probe?
_________________
Casey--

'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik?

[Christopher Schimke]

[Vanagon Nut]

[Waldi]

[quote="Zeitgeist 13"]Is this an AAZ manifold and turbo?

yes a changed/weldet AAZ manifold but a RA/SB k14 watercooled turbo.

[Zeitgeist 13]

[AndyBees]

I have no clue how well or bad an AHU TDI performs (stock or modded) or anything about a 1.6 TD. I have driven Rabbit and Jetta 1.5s and 1.6s NA.

My only experience with TDIs is the ALH. My 2000 Jetta has been basically trouble free for 351k miles. I've done TB jobs on lots of ALH engines, among other maintenance items.

I installed a 2002 Jetta ALH TDI engine in my '84 Vanagon. I did all the electric stuff myself, including installing the Jetta Cluster in place of the Vanagon Cluster (most all bells and whistles).

I'm running a 1980 DK tranny with the 4.57 R&P with upgraded 3rd (1.14) and 4th (.77). I built the tranny myself with parts from Weddle. Wheels are 215/75/15s on Van Café steelies.

The EGT probe is mounted just above the Turbo.... bored and tapped for the NPT. I had McNally to make up a special 16 foot long wire to reach gauge pod on dash.

The engine ran just fine with no Tune..... but, performs much better with the Stage 1 Malone tune. The Turbo and everything else is stock. The Intercooler is mounted in front of the left tail light assembly and is isolated from the engine heat...... thermostat operated puller fan on bottom. I installed splash guard to protect from rear wheel debris.

I've put just over 40k miles on it since August of 2012.

Here are the stats for the Alaska trip

Miles in these calculations are GPS. The odometer was 17.2 miles less.

First half of trip to Homer, Alaska (from Southeast Kentucky)

Miles: 4,630.5
Fuel: 182.268 gallons
Cost: $853.79 (straight dollars not adjusted for Canadian exchange)
Av per gallon: $4.689
MPG: 25.404

Second half of trip (Homer Alaska back home via the back country of British Columbia on down to Sturgis, South Dakota [during biker event week] and return)

Miles: 6,251.4
Fuel: 227.68 gallons
Cost: $1,044.79 (straight dollars not adjusted for Canadian exchange)
Av per gallon: $4.588
MPG: 27.456

Overall for the trip

Miles: 10,881.9
Fuel: 409.948 gallons
Cost: $1,898.58 (straight dollars not adjusted for Canadian exchange)
Av per gallon: $4.631
MPG: 26.544 ......... pulling a camper of about 1400 pounds plus at least another 300 pounds of "stuff" inside the Van.

The entire project can be seen at the link below. Beware, it is a very long Thread with lots of narrative and photos. It will take hours to go through it. It is my intent to do a summary with links to the major aspects of the project.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=276798

I am more than pleased with how well the project turned out. The Van handled the camper extremely well. Braking was never an issue and it has the smaller pre-86 disc system up front.
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[AndyBees]

Below is a snap-shot of the Speedometer on the Yellowhead Highway east of Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. The actual GPS speed was 68 mph.

Below is a snap-shot of the Scan Gauge taken at about the same time as the pic above was taken.

Below is a pic of the gauge pod mounted on the dash. The gauge on the left is EGT/Coolant temp combo (McNally). The coolant temp aspect was not working properly due to grounding issues. The Turbo gauge (VDO) is in the center and the Coolant gauge (Westach) on the right was not connected at that time.

As you can see, the EGT was at 990f. This was on a long sloping hill running just under 70 mph. The highest temp I saw was 1020f on some hills in western Montana.

_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[tjet]

AndyBees - clever idea on swapping over the speedo. Did you keep the same key?

I have an '02 Jetta TDI with 275,000 miles. I'd like to put it in my Syncro one day.

BTW, mine tends to overboost at / above 3100 when I'm in 5th

[?Waldo?]

All else equal (turbo, boost pressure, intercooling) the AHU and the ALH will perform exactly the same and consume the same amount of fuel or at least close enough that the difference would be purely academic. There is no performance or fuel economy benefit to the ALH engine over the AHU engine other than that of the bolt-on components.

EGT is directly related to intake air temperature, the fuel to air ratio (I intentionally said fuel to air rather than air to fuel) and turbo efficiency. If you increase the air or reduce the fuel, the EGT decreases. If your turbo is reasonably efficient at a higher boost pressure than your current max boost and you increase max boost without proportionately increasing the fuel accordingly, then the EGT will go DOWN. Often times people who suffer from overly high EGTs would benefit significantly by increasing the max boost pressure, especially if their intercooling system is functioning reasonably well and removes some of the additional heat of the additionally compressed air.

I prefer mTDI over eTDI for a variety of reasons despite actually enjoying electronics and being quite capable in that regard.