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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:40 pm Post subject: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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So, I purchased an ARB 2500 awning.
While waiting for it to arrive I read all 15 pages of posts here about the awning and mounting options.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=555872
I have a PopTop so it must be side/Gutter mounted.
I see the big Vanagon parts players all of mounting brackets and that some have Stainless Steel mounts and charge accordingly.
As an average It will $70 easy for a basic steel 2 mount mounting kit. The $230 purchase price of the awning wasn't planned for so if I can save $70 with a few hours work, something yanked out of the garage and a weld bead or two..... I'll be happy!
I'm a big DIY guy and hate to buy things that I can fix or make.......
I really wasn't sure how to begin but then I stumbled upon Sodo's post.... He made his own mounting!
Yes!!!!
Sodo used 3/16" x 3" inch Steel Bar.
Here is what Sodo made.......... Genius!!
I find the gutter clamp fascinating in it's simplicity!
I do wonder if a small length of angle would be good there instead of the flat bar...... Give more "grip" for the clamping piece? I could be over thinking this though.......
The ones you buy seem overly complex, many bends..... They of course are designed for the heavy Fiamma awnings........ We are using them for ARB's because they already exist.
This is NorthWesty's Stainless mount......
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 10:25 am; edited 1 time in total |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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Here is my bar of steel, it is 3/16" x 3" x 36".
I must have picked it up for something that I never did.....
I first cut off two 13 1/2" lengths being careful to keep square ends.
I used my Bosch angle finder to get an angle to bend the tab that rests on the body to..... 163* or 17* depends how you look at it!
I scribed a line 1 1/2" back from the square end.
I scribed it because I will be heating it red hot to bend and any pencil or marker will burn off.
After heating it I carefully clamped the steel in the vise on my scribed line across the steel..... I thrn bent it to the angle needed.
After they were both bent to 17* I went to the bench grinder to round off the sharp corners........
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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After grinding I took a file and smoothed the grinding marks off and made each radii the same......
Now the front mount is fine at 3" wide, the rear mount will overhang the window rubber, something that I don't like in all the store purchased mounts. (Sodo used a narrower metal bar here, 1 3/4" wide to avoid the overhang problem)
I decided to mark, cut off and clear the rubber glass seal......
I filed the rear mount in a similar manner smoothing off any sharp edges....
I do think I'll go back and arc that cut to mimic the arc of the rubber seal better.....
Here they are side by side......
The black line across both units marks the bottom of the rain gutter......
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 7:01 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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Notice on the Store purchased ones, there is a small metal tab welded at 90* from the vertical.
This tab clamps the bottom of the rain gutter.....
It is a lot of work to take a big piece of steel and make a little piece out of it.
What do I have?
In a corner I have a stack of wood, plastic and steel gathering dirt......
I pawed through it and found some 3/16" x 3/4" Steel bar......
PERFECT!!!!!
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EDIT: NOT PERFECT!!! 3/4" is too narrow..........
******************
I cut off 2 7/8" of 3/4" bar. Why not 3" to match my bar? The 2 7/8" leaves a 1/16" step in in each side giving a finished look......
I ground the corners to a radius and filed them smooth......
I decided that I want a slight upward angle to better grab under the gutter....
Here it is clamped and ready to weld.....
But Alas...... That will be tomorrow!
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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svswan Samba Member
Joined: February 13, 2013 Posts: 71 Location: Olympia WA
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jimf909 Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014 Posts: 7404 Location: WA/ID
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 9:21 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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Well done! (Nice vice)
Thanks. _________________ - Jim
Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 6:17 am Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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TO THE SCRAP PILE!!!!
Went to the garage and started pawing through the pile seeking 1 1/4" steel bar.....
Found a 3/16" x 1 1/2" steel bar, a 1/8" x 1" steel angle (a lot of that ?!? ) and a 3/16" x 1 1/2" x 2" Steel angle.....
The 1" x 1" is too small, too thin and the legs are too short.... REJECT!!!
A little holding up of pieces shows me that the 1 1/2" leg of the 1 1/2" x 2 is too wide.......
Too wide by about 1/4"....... just as I suspected.
But, I've got this angle in hand and with a little work it will fit perfectly.
I need to shorten the 1 1/2" leg and round the edge to mate nicely with the body's shape under the rain gutter.
I'm only dealing with inches here so it is totally doable.....
As a DIY project, most of you probably don't have a welder sitting in your garage.
I think that I am going to utilize the "L" of the angle and use fasteners instead of welding. (You can weld yours if you desire)
This may have just morphed into a DIY "No Weld" ARB awning gutter mount system!
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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dhaavers Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010 Posts: 7733 Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 6:45 am Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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Go, Dave, go! Show us how it's done!
_________________ 86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2015 Posts: 704 Location: Berkeley Ca
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 8:44 am Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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Sweet Dave, thanks for the documentation |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7893 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 11:03 am Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own gutter mount brackets |
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djkeev wrote: |
Looking at this photo that joetiger posted of his ARB, one can easily see that the "standard" purchased awning mount brackets stick up above the awning.
Is there any reason for this?
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Those brackets were originally designed/made for the Fiamma.
I agree with your plan: shorten them so that they won't be seen. _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:37 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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During lunch I did some figuring and cutting.
I cut a 2 3/4" length of 3/16" x " x 1 1/2" x 2" angle.
I held it up where it would sit in the rain gutter and figured that 1 3/16" would be perfect!
I scribed a line and used my saw-z-all to slice the iron length wise.....
Off to the grinder and smoothed things out, I also created the bevel needed for under the rain gutter.
A bit of file work removing the grinding marks and viola' !! one bottom angle ready to be mounted!
I did set it back from the edges 1/8" for pleasant visual proportions......
At this stage you could easily weld it, but I'm going to do a weld-less bracket and bolt it together.......
I discovered that by using the angle the vertical portion no longer touches the rain gutter. The line for the bottom of the gutter relocated because of this......
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:03 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10347 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:42 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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nice R&D David
For those without power tools or an Oxy/Acetylene set up.....
I've had good success using a propane torch to heat mild steel at least cherry red. Depending on gauge, I can get it closer to orange in colour. Even cherry red seems to be enough to allow a bend or two. MAPP gas would likely get the metal hotter. Just be patient, set up your work safely, turn off a light or two so you can see the metal change colour on both sides while heating it. It takes a lot longer but even just a hacksaw and good files can work just fine. Scrap piles are a great resource but this dimension metal should be available at an Ace or up here in Canada, Home Depot or Canadian Tire.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:55 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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Vanagon Nut wrote: |
nice R&D David
For those without power tools or an Oxy/Acetylene set up.....
I've had good success using a propane torch to heat mild steel at least cherry red. Depending on gauge, I can get it closer to orange in colour. Even cherry red seems to be enough to allow a bend or two. MAPP gas would likely get the metal hotter. Just be patient, set up your work safely, turn off a light or two so you can see the metal change colour on both sides while heating it. It takes a lot longer but even just a hacksaw and good files can work just fine. Scrap piles are a great resource but this dimension metal should be available at an Ace or up here in Canada, Home Depot or Canadian Tire.
Neil. |
I agree 100%!! ^^^^
Power tools make it quicker but hand tools work too.
I am NOT welding my mounts simply to show that one can make mounts without spending big $$'s and do I dare say that you end up with a superior product to boot!
I could weld these but it's kind of fun developing this as a no weld concept.
Ask your metal supplier if they have scraps! A 1' length of 1 1/4" angle is darn near worthless to a supplier. Same for the 3/16" x 3" stock. Two 12" pieces will work just fine and be very cheap. A nice supplier with toss them at you and say "get out of here!!".... So you slip him a $10 to buy coffee and donuts for the guys.......
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10347 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:14 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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djkeev wrote: |
I am NOT welding my mounts simply to show that one can make mounts without spending big $$'s and do I dare say that you end up with a superior product to boot!
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Cool. I get it. I've tried a similar approach many times before; make something with the average Vanagon owner in mind. Not as easy as it looks. e.g. taking into account what basic tools a Vanagon owner may have access to.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: ARB Awning, Making your own NO WELD gutter mount! |
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I cut some 3/16" x 1 1/2" bar into 2 3/4" lengths and stacked them in the gutter in various ways to see how they could work.....
None of these left me with the warm "Fuzzies"...... I only saw binding/bending bolts and proprietary solutions.
Hmmmmm back to the scrap corner!
I found a 2" x 1/2" "U"........ The gauge is fairly thin so there are strength concerns, it's maybe an 1/8" or so????? ( I think I picked it up a few years ago at Tractor Supply thinking I could use it for my running board mounting in my Super Convertible but ended up buying the "proper" replacement panel.)
I hacked off a 2 3/4" length and placed it in the gutter..... Just for giggles.....
I wasn't as repulsed as I thought I would be...... If I made that "U" an "S"......
Hmmmmm........
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Fri Mar 11, 2016 6:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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