Hella fix for Dangerously dim headlights w/ relays…

[Paulbeard]

Went out today and had to put my lights on. When i pulled into a parking spot against a blank wall, I decided to test the highbeams to see the difference and discovered those splashes of light were my highbeams. No, I don't have a working indicator on the dash. Yes, I know I should fix it.

There were headlight relays installed (I ordered Jay Brown's kit but didn't need it). And I have upgraded the bulbs to 100/85w ones.

So when I got home, I did some investigating. This is the voltage at the battery:

This is the voltage at the socket, using both leads, no local ground:

This is with a local ground (the screw that fastens the side marker light):

And this is the highbeams:

Looks like I lose some voltage on the way up to the light socket but the local ground seems to not be a factor. I tested it a couple of times and the difference was sometimes even less that shown here. How do I sort that out? Pull the relays and see what they're getting at the panel?
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs

[IdahoDoug]

Just to clarify something confusing. You ordered Jay's kit, then later discovered your van had already had its headlights rewired by a previous owner who installed relays? So you decided you did not need Jay's kit, and did not install it, instead choosing to rely upon the existing headlight wiring work someone else did?

And now you are unhappy with the headlamp output after putting in high wattage bulbs?

Do I have that correct? I ask, because I am confused by the mentioning of Jay's kit, and then that you didn't/don't need it.
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[borninabus]

I wouldn't call a turn signal screw "local" or even a "good" ground.
my headlights are grounded right at the bucket with self tapping sheet metal screws.

cleaned your battery posts and/or main ground straps recently?
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88 Van WBX, A/T - 13 JSW TDI 6M/T - 2012 Touareg TDI Sport

[bluebus86]

them voltages could be a tad higher but if the van js off and your battery is not perfect, you may see low voltages like this. is test ran with or without motor revkng, thus thurning alternator. you may simply have a low battery or as other person mentiined poor battery connection(s)

then measure the voltage drop across the relay, and the ground terminal at bulb to a nearby body panel (ground) measure drop across battery cable ends to battery posts.

you will find the drops someplace. fix them.

for this, measure the battery voltage across the posts when lights are on, the differance of battery voltage at the two pbuld (while light is on) verses what you measure at the bulb will be the total drop, the total is the sum off all the drops across the head lamp circuit loop.

good luck, may you see the light.
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[dhaavers]

[Paulbeard]

[Paulbeard]

[IdahoDoug]

OK - got it. So, I've done a number of lighting upgrades to a variety of vehicles over the years. I have been surprised at how often the relays themselves are the culprit and that includes name brands (Bosch, cough, cough). But the noname relays are just aggriegiously bad. So, I would check the power side of the circuit that's been previously installed, and if not already in place, I'd take the headlamp grounds right to freshly drilled holes at the light buckets. And I'd check the relays themselves as I personally have had a lot of them fail in the last 20 year, where the 20 years before THAT, I'd never seen one fail. Probably the direction other components are going due to offshore production.....

As you probably already knew, bulbs are very sensitive to voltage, and will continue to operate but at levels of output that are disproportionate to the voltage drop.
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[Paulbeard]

The voltage to the battery from the alternator reads 13.86. I think 14 and change is the standard so it looks like I have a place to start. There was no difference at all on the headlight ground, be it bright metal in a screw hole, a protruding screw through the body or the socket itself — 11 and change volts. Both sides, right and left, are the same from the last time I checked that.

I think the ground strap gets looked at first, then test again to see if we are getting good charging voltage. If that works out, test the lights again. If they are still weak, I look at the relays. No idea who made them but it sounds like makes no difference: everything is crap nowadays. You pays your money and takes your chances.
_________________
Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs

[Abscate]

Putting in relays is just covering up wiring problems.

Find the bad wires and replace them

By the way, a battery at 12.06 V is in need of charging replacing as a start point.
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.ssS!

[Paulbeard]

[kamzcab86]

[IdahoDoug]

Paul,

One question I might ask is do the lights get brighter when the engine is revved? That may indicate one issue over another. I'll also do things like turn on heavy load items like blower fans and watch the headlight pattern react. Some variance is normal, but you may learn something reportable by doing a few things like that for input.

Doug
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[Paulbeard]

[bluebus86]

[Jake de Villiers]

First step is to cut the ground wires from the lights and ground them directly to the body with sheet metal screws. When I did that I gained 1 VDC at the lamp socket.

Then check your other grounds: battery, engine and transaxle.
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[bluebus86]

[Jake de Villiers]

[Paulbeard]

[greebly]

If both lights are dim, and once worked assuming the relay kit was installed properly initially, you can rule out relays, fuses, crimp connections to the relay kit Headlight switch, bright/dim switch and wires to the headlamps. As each bulb has it's own path it is unlikely that both would be affected. .Remaining would be ground at battery and at chassis to bulbs or the battery weak under load. 12 volts is a discharged battery. A healthy battery fully charged will be at least 13 - 13.2 volts.
Edit*** The main supply wire from the battery to the Fuse panel can be restrictive and create a voltage drop that would affect both lamps. but the 12 volts you measured at the battery indicates it is weak. was this with the lamps energized?