Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up
Page: Previous  1, 2
Forum Index -> Bay Window Bus Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
SlowLane
Samba Member


Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 1044
Location: Livermore, CA
SlowLane is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 2:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

BenPonKombi wrote:
See pic of my adapter below.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

So has anyone else noticed that the "In" port on that adapter is plumbed to the center of the filter? Ass-backwards, right?
In this case, BenPonKombi has actually plumbed his pump and filter adapter up correctly: In to In and Out to Out, as ridiculous as it might seem to the more seasoned wrenches among us.
_________________
Present:
'81 Westfalia: 2L, manual. Originally Canadian, now Californiated
Back in the day:
'72 Super Beetle
'69 Camper Van - Corvair powered
'71 Window Van - Transferred Corvair from '69

"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine." - Internet RFC 1925

"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance." - Sir Terry Pratchett
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger Gallery Classifieds Feedback
aeromech
Samba Member


Joined: January 24, 2006
Posts: 16971
Location: San Diego, California
aeromech is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

As Steve said, the IN is on the outside of the filter and the OUT comes from the center. Your picture doesn't show me well enough where the ports actually lead to.
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
SGKent Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
SGKent is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 4:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

some oil filters have a built in bypass. If they flow the wrong way the bypass doesn't work. That means the filter would see the full pressure from the pump when cold. It would probably balloon then rupture the diaphragm.

example:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
SlowLane
Samba Member


Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 1044
Location: Livermore, CA
SlowLane is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

Okay, maybe it was just optical delusion, but it appeared that the In port on that adapter made a right-angle turn to the center boss. One would have to view the underside to be sure, of course.

As far as the bypass valve goes, that is simply there to pass oil around the filter media if the media gets clogged up enough to impair flow. Yes, it would allow excessive pressure to build up if the filter was clogged badly and the flow in the filter was backwards ( ie. center to outside), but there should be no such danger if the filter was new and clean.
_________________
Present:
'81 Westfalia: 2L, manual. Originally Canadian, now Californiated
Back in the day:
'72 Super Beetle
'69 Camper Van - Corvair powered
'71 Window Van - Transferred Corvair from '69

"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine." - Internet RFC 1925

"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance." - Sir Terry Pratchett
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Tcash
Samba Member


Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
Tcash is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

As anoying as it is the oil light quit often does flicker at idle. This may have nothing to do with the oil pressure and have everything to do with the oil sender switch.
Put a gauge on it and see what your pressure is at idle and for every 1K rpm.

Good luck
Tcash

You posted the pic of the oil adapter is not yours. Please post a picture of yours?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
busdaddy
Samba Member


Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51149
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
busdaddy is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

The issue is that anti drainback valve, it's a one way valve and really restricts the flow, hopefully the bearings haven't suffered from starvation yet.
The casting on that filter mount doesn't always let you know what's going on underneath, you have to look from below to see where the passages actually go.
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.

Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

Слава Україні!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
SlowLane
Samba Member


Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 1044
Location: Livermore, CA
SlowLane is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 8:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

The OP said he had 80 psi at a cold idle. Assuming he's reading from the standard oil pressure port, that means he's seeing pressure downstrem of the remote filter.
_________________
Present:
'81 Westfalia: 2L, manual. Originally Canadian, now Californiated
Back in the day:
'72 Super Beetle
'69 Camper Van - Corvair powered
'71 Window Van - Transferred Corvair from '69

"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine." - Internet RFC 1925

"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance." - Sir Terry Pratchett
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger Gallery Classifieds Feedback
telford dorr
Samba Member


Joined: March 11, 2009
Posts: 3555
Location: San Diego (Encinitas)
telford dorr is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 10:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

BenPonKombi wrote:
One last thing, do stock springs and plungers work ok with full flow systems like mine?

Consider: both plungers are AFTER the filter, thus the pump will create whatever pressure needed to get oil to pass through the filter. Therefore, the filter will have little to no effect on the final oil pressure unless (1) the pump is too worn, (2) the filter is hopelessly plugged, (3) the filter adapter, pump cover, or hoses are too restrictive, or (4) a hose or the filter blows up (or some combination of the above).

In short, not to worry. The stock stuff works fine. The biggest problem is generally the oil is too thick when cold (hence 10w30 oil - it's thinner when cold). As long as your oil pressure measures OK, you're OK.

To be absolutely sure of your connections, (a) disconnect the points lead (green wire) at the coil so it won't start, (b) remove the oil filter, (c) put a bucket by the filter adapter to catch the oil, and (d) have someone crank the engine while you observe that oil squirts from the outer filter supply hole. If it comes from the center, the hoses are backwards.
_________________
'71 panel, now with FI
'Experience' is the ability to recognize a mistake when you're making it again - Franklin P. Jones
In theory, theory works in practice; in practice, it doesn't - William T. Harbaugh
When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. The pain is only felt by others.
Same thing happens when you're stupid. - Philippe Geluck
More VW electrical at http://telforddorr.com/ (available 9am to 9pm PST)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
scrivyscriv
Samba Electrician


Joined: October 04, 2011
Posts: 2922
Location: Memphis
scrivyscriv is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:19 am    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

aeromech wrote:

As far as oil light flicker at hot idle I've found that it's caused by wear between the bypass piston and the bore wall. These can be oversized and cure the problem. These pics show me performing the mod to a T4 engine but a T1 is similar.


Interesting, thanks for sharing that. I wonder how many times one can oversize that bore during the life of a case. It's interesting that you see wear in that area, given all the oil on either side of the piston.
_________________
Robert in Memphis
Dünkelgrügen 1967 Java Green bug thread
Engine rebuild thread
If you're ever in the Memphis area, you are welcome to stop by for advice and help.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
BenPonKombi
Samba Member


Joined: June 26, 2015
Posts: 36
Location: Houston
BenPonKombi is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 7:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

Gentlemen,

The adapter shown in the picture I posted is not my filter adapter; it's just a picture I took from google images to show what kind of adapter i'm dealing with. Mine is has the inlet and outlet going the opposite direction and it does not have the threaded hole on top of the inlet port. You can see my actual adapter in the picture below.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
1970 Microbus
V-Dub Chasing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
BenPonKombi
Samba Member


Joined: June 26, 2015
Posts: 36
Location: Houston
BenPonKombi is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 7:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

Quote:
In short, not to worry. The stock stuff works fine. The biggest problem is generally the oil is too thick when cold (hence 10w30 oil - it's thinner when cold). As long as your oil pressure measures OK, you're OK.



To be absolutely sure of your connections, (a) disconnect the points lead (green wire) at the coil so it won't start, (b) remove the oil filter, (c) put a bucket by the filter adapter to catch the oil, and (d) have someone crank the engine while you observe that oil squirts from the outer filter supply hole. If it comes from the center, the hoses are backwards.

telford dorr, you brought up some good points. I'm going to follow your suggestions to confirm if oil is flowing correctly.

In regards to oil pressure, what should my VDO gauge read when cold and when hot/ idle?
_________________
1970 Microbus
V-Dub Chasing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
aeromech
Samba Member


Joined: January 24, 2006
Posts: 16971
Location: San Diego, California
aeromech is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 7:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

scrivyscriv wrote:
aeromech wrote:

As far as oil light flicker at hot idle I've found that it's caused by wear between the bypass piston and the bore wall. These can be oversized and cure the problem. These pics show me performing the mod to a T4 engine but a T1 is similar.


Interesting, thanks for sharing that. I wonder how many times one can oversize that bore during the life of a case. It's interesting that you see wear in that area, given all the oil on either side of the piston.


Here's some more info. The size of the bypass plunger plugs are different in a type 1 and a type 4. When reaming the T4 as I showed the threaded hole for the plug is larger than the reamer so I didn't cut on the threads. When doing a T1 you actually remove some of the thread inside diameter. This to would be the limiting factor when oversizing. But my guess is that it's taken a million movements of that bypass piston going up and down to wear out the bore side clearance so needing to ever do the job again to a 40 year old engine case sounds remote to me.
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
VWCOOL
Samba Member


Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: Down under
VWCOOL is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 3:44 am    Post subject: Re: Full Flow Oil Filter Swelling Up Reply with quote

You wont have any of these problems if you take the fool-flow filter off, use good air cleaners and change oil every 2000 miles
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Bay Window Bus All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.