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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 7:30 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

a-marshal wrote:
.. is there a (good) reason why someone might want extra marks on the fan near the timing mark?

No. Get yourself a timing scale and read this if you haven't already: http://www.ratwell.com/technical/FindTimingMark.html

Quote:
Question Two or (maybe 1b) .. for how many degrees of the cams rotation are the followers/push-rods/rockers unloaded? With the mark off the expected 180 degrees cylinders 2 and 4 would not necessarily have had the proper clearances but to my admittedly inexpert touch the gap stays constant for all the marks.

~20 degrees of crank rotation each way, close is good enough.

Quote:
Finally I lost one of my heater control boxes on the last road trip... since I've never hooked them up and didn't ever intend to do I need to care very much?

Aside from the heat exchanger filling up with sand and gravel kicked up by the tire, no...., but don't cap it off it needs to vent.
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beatles4
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

When you say don't cap it off, it needs to vent. Do you mean those two large pipes that run under the bus and go up to the dash and floors? i thought you need to cap those off if not running heat exchangers because exhaust gases can make their way through them and into the car.


Also the previous owner of my bus marked a letter H and 180 degrees oppose of it marked an I on my crank pulley. I haven't examined closely where the stock pulley mark is suppose to be.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:56 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

You need flow through the heat exchangers at all time, where the air is going forward into the cab or just being shunted to the outside through the flapper valve. If your accordion tubes have been removed or if there are big gaping holes in the heater pipes then do seal off the pipes going into the cab as they make an entryway from mice.

Tin cans clamped over the back ends of the pipes work as does cramming aluminium foil into the pipes.
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sdalcher
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:19 am    Post subject: CHT question Reply with quote

Ok, so now I'm questioning just how hot my engine is running. After changing the oil to 15W50 synthetic, the oil temp is still registering high, but the engine is not smelling hot. So I'm questioning my dip stick oil temp device and just how accurate. Thinking that I would really like to add a CHT and maybe a sump mounted oil temp unit. Where is the best place to purchase? I found CIP but the CHT was almost $200... I'm not opposed to spending that kind of money if needed, but it seems a little on the high side. So please share your experiences and cost if you would.

Many thanks!
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1967250s
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:23 am    Post subject: Re: CHT question Reply with quote

sdalcher wrote:
Ok, so now I'm questioning just how hot my engine is running. After changing the oil to 15W50 synthetic, the oil temp is still registering high, but the engine is not smelling hot. So I'm questioning my dip stick oil temp device and just how accurate. Thinking that I would really like to add a CHT and maybe a sump mounted oil temp unit. Where is the best place to purchase? I found CIP but the CHT was almost $200... I'm not opposed to spending that kind of money if needed, but it seems a little on the high side. So please share your experiences and cost if you would.

Many thanks!

Hey, great looking Bus. Can you post a good close(several) up of the engine? Do you have a black plug on top center of the fan housing? If you do, use a timing light into there to time the engine. I had a similar over heating problem, turned out timing was too retarded. I would also recommend using 10w40 for summer, 10 w 30 for winter. I use Castrol. Too thick, and not enough oil goes to cooler. Make sure the flaps in the fan house work, lever should spring upright in failsafe if thermostat fails.
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Sawspa
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:16 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Hello, i have a valve question. I have a 1978 2.0L hydraulic valve ge code engine. I adjusted the valves to .006 per bently and found the noise to be rediculous. Then I read Collins Page and adjusted them 1.5 turns in. It seemed to work pretty good. BUT, i now can only get #3 to 55 pounds compression. Im pretty sure the spring in the lifter isnt broke and there isnt any chatter in the valve train. Could I have burnt a valve out with it adjusted to .006 ? I drove it for about three or four hours that way. What test do i need to do before i remove the head?
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:31 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Sawspa wrote:
Hello, i have a valve question. I have a 1978 2.0L hydraulic valve ge code engine. I adjusted the valves to .006 per bently and found the noise to be rediculous. Then I read Collins Page and adjusted them 1.5 turns in. It seemed to work pretty good. BUT, i now can only get #3 to 55 pounds compression. Im pretty sure the spring in the lifter isnt broke and there isnt any chatter in the valve train. Could I have burnt a valve out with it adjusted to .006 ? I drove it for about three or four hours that way. What test do i need to do before i remove the head?


Adjusting hydros to .006 usually doesn't cuase many probles aside from the noise, running it a long time like that can pound out the circlips in the lifters but if the pushrod wasn't removed after running it like that the lifter will still stay together even without the clip.

Low compression is more likely a failing valve seat, the bad rocker adjustment may have exposed something that was already happening but it's probably unrelated and you've just noticed it now.

Remove the rockers an that head and place a straightedge across all the valve tips, are any lower ot higher that the rest? When reinstalling the rockers be careful torquing the hold down nuts, 9 'lbs IIRC.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:31 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Sawspa wrote:
Hello, i have a valve question. I have a 1978 2.0L hydraulic valve ge code engine. I adjusted the valves to .006 per bently and found the noise to be rediculous. Then I read Collins Page and adjusted them 1.5 turns in. It seemed to work pretty good. BUT, i now can only get #3 to 55 pounds compression. Im pretty sure the spring in the lifter isnt broke and there isnt any chatter in the valve train. Could I have burnt a valve out with it adjusted to .006 ? I drove it for about three or four hours that way. What test do i need to do before i remove the head?


Give the lifter time to self adjust. Even once it has been run a long time it may not have full compression once it has been shut down repeatedly while you do the test.

Hydraulic lifter tend to like thin clean oil, I highly recommend something like a 5w30 "high milage" synthetic or a 5w40 "Diesel" synthetic. Adding some Marvel Mystery Oil to you old oil for several hundred miles before you drain it helps as well.
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Sawspa
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:41 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
Sawspa wrote:
Hello, i have a valve question. I have a 1978 2.0L hydraulic valve ge code engine. I adjusted the valves to .006 per bently and found the noise to be rediculous. Then I read Collins Page and adjusted them 1.5 turns in. It seemed to work pretty good. BUT, i now can only get #3 to 55 pounds compression. Im pretty sure the spring in the lifter isnt broke and there isnt any chatter in the valve train. Could I have burnt a valve out with it adjusted to .006 ? I drove it for about three or four hours that way. What test do i need to do before i remove the head?


Adjusting hydros to .006 usually doesn't cuase many probles aside from the noise, running it a long time like that can pound out the circlips in the lifters but if the pushrod wasn't removed after running it like that the lifter will still stay together even without the clip.

Low compression is more likely a failing valve seat, the bad rocker adjustment may have exposed something that was already happening but it's probably unrelated and you've just noticed it now.

Remove the rockers an that head and place a straightedge across all the valve tips, are any lower ot higher that the rest? When reinstalling the rockers be careful torquing the hold down nuts, 9 'lbs IIRC.

I can hear air coming thru the exhaust and the intake. I had the heads rebuilt last winter. My exhaust is not conventional. each header runs to a glass pack and straight out the rear of the bus. Could that be heating up the valves? Tonight im going to back outvthe adjusting screw on the rocker to make sure the valves are closed and put air to it again. I am running a 10w-40 oil. If i still hear air i will remove the valve rails and put a straight edge on it to see any unevenness. I will pay attention to the 9 foot/pounds when reinstalling them. Not sure if ive screwed up by not adjusting the valves right or it was a bad head rebuild. Im scared i might have another problem that is burning the valves.
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dlxkey
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: CHT question Reply with quote

sdalcher wrote:
Ok, so now I'm questioning just how hot my engine is running. After changing the oil to 15W50 synthetic, the oil temp is still registering high, but the engine is not smelling hot. So I'm questioning my dip stick oil temp device and just how accurate. Thinking that I would really like to add a CHT and maybe a sump mounted oil temp unit. Where is the best place to purchase? I found CIP but the CHT was almost $200... I'm not opposed to spending that kind of money if needed, but it seems a little on the high side. So please share your experiences and cost if you would.

Many thanks!


I bought the Dakota Digital 2 1/4" gauge ($125) and 18' sensor ($14) based on Ratwell's recommendation and it IS fantastic:
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=...prd347.htm

Ratwell's Samba post:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=691206
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:10 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Sawspa wrote:
busdaddy wrote:
Sawspa wrote:
Hello, i have a valve question. I have a 1978 2.0L hydraulic valve ge code engine. I adjusted the valves to .006 per bently and found the noise to be rediculous. Then I read Collins Page and adjusted them 1.5 turns in. It seemed to work pretty good. BUT, i now can only get #3 to 55 pounds compression. Im pretty sure the spring in the lifter isnt broke and there isnt any chatter in the valve train. Could I have burnt a valve out with it adjusted to .006 ? I drove it for about three or four hours that way. What test do i need to do before i remove the head?


Adjusting hydros to .006 usually doesn't cuase many probles aside from the noise, running it a long time like that can pound out the circlips in the lifters but if the pushrod wasn't removed after running it like that the lifter will still stay together even without the clip.


Low compression is more likely a failing valve seat, the bad rocker adjustment may have exposed something that was already happening but it's probably unrelated and you've just noticed it now.

Remove the rockers an that head and place a straightedge across all the valve tips, are any lower ot higher that the rest? When reinstalling the rockers be careful torquing the hold down nuts, 9 'lbs IIRC.

I can hear air coming thru the exhaust and the intake. I had the heads rebuilt last winter. My exhaust is not conventional. each header runs to a glass pack and straight out the rear of the bus. Could that be heating up the valves? Tonight im going to back outvthe adjusting screw on the rocker to make sure the valves are closed and put air to it again. I am running a 10w-40 oil. If i still hear air i will remove the valve rails and put a straight edge on it to see any unevenness. I will pay attention to the 9 foot/pounds when reinstalling them. Not sure if ive screwed up by not adjusting the valves right or it was a bad head rebuild. Im scared i might have another problem that is burning the valves.

As WT's says it may take a little while for good lifters to bleed down after having been set that loose so give them a chance, set it up on TDC for that cylinder and see if either adjuster is still compressing a valve. Another small possibilty is bent valves from the lifters staying pumped up, rare but not impossible.
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Tcash
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:09 am    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Sawspa , the distributor rotor should be pointing to the spark plug wire for the cylinder that you are testing and the timing mark should be on zero.

Good luck
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

So i backed the adjuster screw out till there is no contact on the valve stem, and it still is showing 60% loss. How much air pressure should i be doing this test with? I put the motor on tdc for 1 cylinder and show 30% loss and i can hear air coming out of the 3/4 bank with the valve cover off. Should this be happening? I am putting the cylinder at tdc by doing what tcash said. I am unable to press the pushrod in to see if the lifter is working. When i turn the adjusting screw it compresses the valve and not the lifter. Did the over pumped lifter make my valves open too much and couldve burnt all of them????
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:17 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

You have to have the cylinder you are testing at TDC for that cylinder (both valves closed), you can tap the adjuster screws with a plastic hammer or wooden dowel and hammer to bounce them on thier seats while applying air pressure to make sure it's not just a piece of carbon stuck between the valve and seat (do check that the pushrod is still seated in the cup on the end of the rocker after).

Good lifters shouldn't compress but will (should) self adjust when running, the only time they are squishy is when there is air in them.

Not sure why you hear air coming from the opposite sides pushrod tubes, your loss could be through the rings, what's the breather sound like?
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:28 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

Cyl#1 - tdc, i backed the adjuster screws on intake and the exhaust all the way out to "no contact". Showed 60% lossAll of the air seemed to be escaping thru pushrod tubes. No air from the air cleaner or exhaust. The pushrod tubes had a pretty good whistle.
Cyl#3 - tdc. Backed adjusters clear out. 60% loss, air was heard in the intake and exhaust, some in the oil cap, but not really any noise heard in the pushrod tubes.

Two seperate problems? Rings and valves? How much am i looking at for a rebuild if i remove the engine and take it to a vw shop?
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:40 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

No idea on costs, there's been a few outsourced rebuild recommendation threads lately, maybe Tcash can find them. If it's not leaking out the intake or exhaust the rings are the only route left. How's the oil pressure and endplay on this engine?, any idea how many miles it's got on it? You can do pistons and cylinders at home, all depends on how much time you have and if you can follow instructions.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:54 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
No idea on costs, there's been a few outsourced rebuild recommendation threads lately, maybe Tcash can find them. If it's not leaking out the intake or exhaust the rings are the only route left. How's the oil pressure and endplay on this engine?, any idea how many miles it's got on it? You can do pistons and cylinders at home, all depends on how much time you have and if you can follow instructions.

No idea on oil pressure and end play. I put pistons ,rings and had the heads redone this last winter. Thats why im frustrated! I accept that i screwed up the valve timing and possibly burnt the valves, but the rings too! Shouldnt some air get past the rings? It doesnt smoke or have blow-by.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:57 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

try a "wet" leak down- if the numbers get better and then back to 60- you have bad rings- if it stays the same you have valve issues.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:11 am    Post subject: Re: CHT question Reply with quote

dlxkey wrote:
sdalcher wrote:
Ok, so now I'm questioning just how hot my engine is running. After changing the oil to 15W50 synthetic, the oil temp is still registering high, but the engine is not smelling hot. So I'm questioning my dip stick oil temp device and just how accurate. Thinking that I would really like to add a CHT and maybe a sump mounted oil temp unit. Where is the best place to purchase? I found CIP but the CHT was almost $200... I'm not opposed to spending that kind of money if needed, but it seems a little on the high side. So please share your experiences and cost if you would.

Many thanks!


I bought the Dakota Digital 2 1/4" gauge ($125) and 18' sensor ($14) based on Ratwell's recommendation and it IS fantastic:
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=...prd347.htm

Thanks! I ordered one.

Ratwell's Samba post:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=691206
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:29 pm    Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread Reply with quote

check for leaks where the head meets the cylinder.
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