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SiggyManx#33
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2005
Posts: 877
Location: Southeast PA
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 Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 6:15 pm Post subject: Front beam question... |
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Getting ready to swap my spindle and noticed my beam leaves moved on me when I had the towing mishap.
Do I just lift, loosen all 3 bolts then tap in? Or do I need to release pressure at the ball joints by popping those as well?
Any help appreciated.
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manxdavid
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2003
Posts: 1841
Location: David Jones, Anglesey, North Wales, UK. Manxclub #678.
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 3:56 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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| I'd just loosen the grubscrews, tap them back in line then retighten. If you're removing the spindles anyway you'll find they'll move easier when the spindles are off and the torsion leaves are relaxed. |
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SiggyManx#33
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2005
Posts: 877
Location: Southeast PA
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:23 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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Thanks David!
I was planning on fixing this before diving into the spindle. I don't like getting too far ahead of myself. |
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SiggyManx#33
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2005
Posts: 877
Location: Southeast PA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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Questions:
I dove into the above beam and I'm hoping someone can give me some advice on whee the leaves ultimately rest?
Do the leaves in the above picture need to be tapped in until level with the center leaf? Or does the center need to be aped from the other side.
I'm think that since the dust cap was lost on this side, it's from the leaves pushing it out but just wanted to check? I have the grubs removed and was thinking that I'd just look for the dimple…..but it wasn't quite that apparent?
Second question…..anyone have an extra dust cap laying around or a solution for one? I'd gladly pay for it….
Thanks! |
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germanx
Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2010
Posts: 326
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 1:34 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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Hi,
Some thoughts:
The full sized leaves of the spring pack are held in position with one central set screw in each axle tube. If these two set screws are still locked and sit tight, these wide springs of the spring pack have the correct position. If you are in doubt, remove the center set screws and check with a flashlight. You should be able to see the set bore in the spring pack if still in center.
If this is the case, the outer, half wide spring plates in your picture have moved to the left side (in driving direction) and should be pushed back into the axle tube until their ends are on level again with the wider spring leaves.
If you lift the car on the front, you reduce the friction of the spring leaves and it should be possible to push the laves back in position with a hammer without removing the spindles (you might put a piece of hard wood or plastic in-between to not damage the edges of the spring plates with the hammer).
Observation:
I see in your pics, that either the upper half spring plate has moved to the right side and cannot be seen, or it was taken out to soften front suspension.
The fact of a missing upper half blade reduces friction of the two half springs underneath, and as such they are more prone to 'wandering' sideways.
I just worked on my suspension and decided to mount a complete spring pack - partially to avoid the above effect - . I replaced the two outer wide spring leaves each with two half ones (this also softens the suspension a bid).
_________________
'73 Beach Buggy
'66 T1 Deluxe |
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SiggyManx#33
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2005
Posts: 877
Location: Southeast PA
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:21 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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| germanx wrote: |
Hi,
Some thoughts:
The full sized leaves of the spring pack are held in position with one central set screw in each axle tube. If these two set screws are still locked and sit tight, these wide springs of the spring pack have the correct position. If you are in doubt, remove the center set screws and check with a flashlight. You should be able to see the set bore in the spring pack if still in center.
If this is the case, the outer, half wide spring plates in your picture have moved to the left side (in driving direction) and should be pushed back into the axle tube until their ends are on level again with the wider spring leaves.
If you lift the car on the front, you reduce the friction of the spring leaves and it should be possible to push the laves back in position with a hammer without removing the spindles (you might put a piece of hard wood or plastic in-between to not damage the edges of the spring plates with the hammer).
Observation:
I see in your pics, that either the upper half spring plate has moved to the right side and cannot be seen, or it was taken out to soften front suspension.
The fact of a missing upper half blade reduces friction of the two half springs underneath, and as such they are more prone to 'wandering' sideways.
I just worked on my suspension and decided to mount a complete spring pack - partially to avoid the above effect - . I replaced the two outer wide spring leaves each with two half ones (this also softens the suspension a bid). |
Thanks for the response. I actually came across your beam rebuilding as I was searching for answers.
The upper half spring plate that appears to missing is in there as I didn't remove anything. It could actually be in the correct position and just not seen.
The center set screw on the beam is still in place and I only removed the lock nut. I'd imagine that's why the center leaves are still in position in the picture?
If I am tapping these back in, should I keep the center adjustable beam set-screw tightened down to prevent the entire stack from shifting? Or will the other leaves not move with the grub screw still tight. Or do I loosen all of them for the tapping into place?
Does anyone have a solution for the dust caps? |
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jspbtown
Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2004
Posts: 5157
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:34 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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| Quote: |
| Does anyone have a solution for the dust caps? |
Freeze plug? |
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germanx
Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2010
Posts: 326
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:26 am Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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| Quote: |
The upper half spring plate that appears to missing is in there as I didn't remove anything. It could actually be in the correct position and just not seen.
The center set screw on the beam is still in place and I only removed the lock nut. I'd imagine that's why the center leaves are still in position in the picture?
If I am tapping these back in, should I keep the center adjustable beam set-screw tightened down to prevent the entire stack from shifting? Or will the other leaves not move with the grub screw still tight. Or do I loosen all of them for the tapping into place?
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Hi,
1. Take a thin welding filler rod or something similar and try to push it into the space supposed to be filled by upper the half spring. If you can push it in more than 2 inches, the upper half spring is not there.
If you cannot push it in more than half an inch remove the right upper dust cover. You should see the displaced upper half spring and you can tap it back into position as described before.
But my guess is it is not there. Why should all half springs move to the left and just this upper half one moves to the opposite side - sounds unlikely to me.
2. Correct.
There is a way to judge from the outside if the spring plates are centered or not. If they are centered, the set screw sits deep in the whole of the spring pack. With the outer counter nut on, the set screw will hardly stick out anymore.
If the set screw does not sit deep in the whole (meaning the spring plates are out of center), it will stick out over and above the counter nut by about 5mm or more.
If the center set screw is locked and sits deep, the full spring plates are still held in place. In this case You might want to open the set screw itself by only half a turn, just enough to keep the full sized blades locked in position. Opening the set screw up by half a turn, it will release the locking pressure from the plates. (this might help to reduce friction of the half sized spring plates and it will be a bid easier to tap them back into position.)
3. The same principle as for the center lock applies for the set screws in the trailing arms. If you open up the set screw just half a turn, you release the pressure from the half spring plates and it will become easier to tap them back into place. But don't take the outer set screws out, because you run into the risk of your trailing arms sliding out and from the spring pack. Than you will have much more work to get it back together again.
The primary function of the set screw isto ensure your trailing arms don't slide of the front beam. By doing so, tightening the set screw has an effect like a wedge being driven in-between the two inner full spring plates pushing them apart form each other.
The suspension force itself (the torque momentum during twists to the spring blades is taken up be the internal cross-like shape of the trialing arm and the two centers of the beams (where the set screws are located).
_________________
'73 Beach Buggy
'66 T1 Deluxe |
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SiggyManx#33
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2005
Posts: 877
Location: Southeast PA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:21 pm Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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Just wanted to follow up here….I got everything together perfectly thanks to the advice and the details from Germanx.
Best piece of advice in here for my circumstance was the I'll know e erything is right by the depth of the set screws. Saved me from putting everything back together incorrectly. A little more work and I know it's together the right way.
Thanks all for the help! |
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germanx
Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2010
Posts: 326
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:18 pm Post subject: Re: Front beam question... |
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Happy I could give something back here. So far mainly I benefited from the experts, glad it worked the other way round this time 
Have fun with your buggy!
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'73 Beach Buggy
'66 T1 Deluxe |
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