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cru62
Samba Member
Joined: December 31, 2002
Posts: 4117
Location: Margaritaville.....24/7
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 Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:43 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Abscate wrote: |
| Just the screws make it tampered, regardless of the number issue. |
That plate would have been attached using screws originally. Only the plates on the PS side of the overhead vent were attached using rivets.
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EmpiGT
Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2005
Posts: 2597
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| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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Wow totally faked vin. The model and vin # should be embossed, Not stamped inwards. Look at this vin of Everett's
Compared to
Last edited by EmpiGT on Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:12 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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Not a huge deal with a legit stamped vin (is it?)...but for a quarter of a million dollars... sort of.
Ps: The comments on market pricing from 5 years ago are too funny. Anyone want to wager it goes for less? |
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EmpiGT
Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2005
Posts: 2597
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| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| On a side note, looking at the two tags above when did they change the stampings on them. Like the "heizg".... ect and the weight numbers below. |
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Z
Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2003
Posts: 2517
Location: galveston, tx
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| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:22 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| I bet they had 200 pics to choose from, and someone at BJ is regretting choosing that one to include in the ad. |
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jeremy57ride
Samba Member
Joined: May 23, 2005
Posts: 1318
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:08 am Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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I wonder if it is truly "no reserve" - What's the over under on 100k? From recent big auction sales it may not get there
Either way.. that bus will always be historic. I've never had more folks approach me about ~ "what my bus is worth" then after that sale. That bus took many, many, many 2,000 dollar buses off the market. In fact, I think the market is still inflated due to that sale. On another note- the vin tag and missing air cleaner bracket is shocking 
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:29 am Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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In case you missed it: I don't think this was ever fully explained
| Douglas Denlinger wrote: |
| I did, however, have five separate possible buyers contact me prior to the sale that declined to bid due to the M-code not matching the Birth Certifcate. |
Maybe it's just the paint code difference... but with the wacky VIN plate, it really makes you wonder... |
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thom
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5943
Location: Sacramento
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:30 am Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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Something looks "off" but maybe I'm just a cynic
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:42 am Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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Was this the turkis/bluewhite deluxe bus that had a bad engine fire prior to it becoming famous?
If so, that could explain the damage to the vin plate and need for a cheesy illegal stamping.
Are there pictures of the original factory M-code plate?
If someone were to buy it on an auction description that says "Finished in correct factory colors" and then get a birth certificate showing that the correct color is the more common less desirable turkis/bluewhite combo, could they return the bus and get their ~$100k back?
If this bus gets half of what it sold for previously, will the press report that the bus market has crashed and then they all become less valuable?
(I like to dream about such things)
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19672
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Lind wrote: |
If someone were to buy it on an auction description that says "Finished in correct factory colors" and then get a birth certificate showing that the correct color is the more common less desirable turkis/bluewhite combo, could they return the bus and get their ~$100k back?
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Loophole worthy.
It would specifically say " Finished in IT"S correct factory colors" were it the actual color it left the factory in.
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PeteSC
Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011
Posts: 881
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 1:55 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| tyzel wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
| Z wrote: |
| easy e wrote: |
Looks like a hammer VIN flat & re-stamp job.
Wasn't expecting that on such a bus.
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That is a tampered VIN. Dont drive that in NY. |
Agreed, you can clearly see the numbers been re stamped over different numbers. Wow
This is an original 23 window right? Or Was this a 15 to start and someone had an m plate and title for a 23? |
You can almost make out the original embossed numbers if you color invert the image in Photoshop:
My guess is originally Typ 25 or 26 (definitely a curved digit at the bottom of the stamped "4" in Typ, VIN # 10XX821
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turkis-deluxe
Samba Security
Joined: January 06, 2001
Posts: 1547
Location: 94518
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Lind wrote: |
Was this the turkis/bluewhite deluxe bus that had a bad engine fire prior to it becoming famous?
If so, that could explain the damage to the vin plate and need for a cheesy illegal stamping.
Are there pictures of the original factory M-code plate?
If someone were to buy it on an auction description that says "Finished in correct factory colors" and then get a birth certificate showing that the correct color is the more common less desirable turkis/bluewhite combo, could they return the bus and get their ~$100k back?
If this bus gets half of what it sold for previously, will the press report that the bus market has crashed and then they all become less valuable?
(I like to dream about such things) |
I thought this bus was a legit MG 23. |
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| turkis-deluxe wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Was this the turkis/bluewhite deluxe bus that had a bad engine fire prior to it becoming famous? |
I thought this bus was a legit MG 23. |
I heard it was turkis from the factory. I don't know if it is true or not. Same with the fire damage. For anything north of $20k, I would want to see an original M-code plate, a birth certificate and some pre-restoration photos. I know that is not how auctions work for buyers or sellers. Actual provenance or a truthful description are far too much to ask for a measly six figure car.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5401198&highlight=blw#5401198
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EverettB 
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69824
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 3:46 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Lind wrote: |
Was this the turkis/bluewhite deluxe bus that had a bad engine fire prior to it becoming famous?
If so, that could explain the damage to the vin plate and need for a cheesy illegal stamping. |
Yes.
My post up above:
| Quote: |
| I know this Bus was burned in the rear before it was restored, maybe the VIN plate was lost and that was the solution? Weird. |
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doublecabmel
Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2010
Posts: 131
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:34 pm Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Everett, will you be stopping by RM? I'll be there. My # is around $75 on this bus (including premium) |
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AlteWagen
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AlteWagen
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EverettB
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AlteWagen
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:42 am Post subject: Re: David Navarez 1963 23-Window @ VW Classic / Barrett-Jackson |
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| Sketchy |
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