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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:58 am Post subject: My standard bug build |
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So I have recently bought 3 bugs. A standard and two supers. I was told only one super had a title. Me being the trust worthy guy I hauled them home before checking the title. After inspection the title didn't match any of the cars. Originally I wanted to build a standard to keep for myself. So the plan was to build the super with the title with all the spare parts and sell it to fund my standard build. After the title deal fell thru I have decided to strip down one super and to strip the standard to the pan completely rebuild the pan and next winter buy another standard and put that body on my standard pan.
I know some people may get mad about stripping down cars for parts but these cars are well beyond saving and I have every intention in using these parts or selling them to someone the needs them. The standard had been hit in the rear while being loaded when the previous owner bought it.
After cutting the top off for a friend to use on his build I got the car in the shop and up on jack stands. This car had been sitting outside in the weather with the windows down over 8 years.
After getting the car in I was going to start removing what was left of the body. I could literally pick up on the back bumper and fold the car into a taco. Previous owners had welded braces and flat metal in the heater channels, floor boards, and any other place with holes. You can see in one picture half the car laying in the driveway. That was removed using zero tools. The car had completely rusted in every mount in the rear and just tore across the rear pan.
After two shop vacs full of acorns, mouse crap, and some other form of poop and a whole lot of shoveling out I had the floor and inside fairly cleaned out.
Progress may be slow to start with and a little faster at times. Like before mentioned plan is to completely redo this pan and next winter buy another body with a good title to sit on this plan. Any advice and comments are appreciated good or bad
Thanks |
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PopPop Jambon Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2016 Posts: 125 Location: Florida
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:44 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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I would suggest salvaging and selling as many of the parts as you can and use that money to buy a nice RESTORABLE bug. JMHO
Good Luck to you and Welcome to Samba!! _________________ Eric
VWLM
1968 Beetle 1600 DP
Sort of a Baja
(PO removed the deck lid, cut out the rear skirt and added rear fiberglass fenders, that's about it) |
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gt1953 Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2002 Posts: 13846 Location: White Mountains Arizona
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:17 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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I too would STRONGLY suggest salvaging and selling as many of the parts as you can and come out west of the Continental Divide to buy a nice RESTORABLE bug. _________________ Volkswagen: We tune what we drive.
Numbers Matching VW's are getting harder to find. Source out the most Stock vehicle and keep that way. You will be glad you did.
72 type 1
72 Squareback
({59 Euro bug, 62, 63, 67, 68, 69, 73 type ones 68 & 69 type two, 68 Ghia all sold}) |
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DuaneL Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2012 Posts: 511 Location: Spokane WA
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:17 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Pos_bug wrote: |
Like before mentioned plan is to completely redo this pan and next winter buy another body with a good title to sit on this plan. Any advice and comments are appreciated good or bad
Thanks |
Pans do have Vehicle identification numbers and in a lot of cases that is the number the dmv goes by, you might get away with it but if yopu get a picky state inspector you might end up screwed not having a title for the pan, just a thought to keep in mind. _________________ ____________
1971 std bug, 1776, ACN Super Stock 34-3, dvda dist, 27x8.50 14 tires |
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Floating VW Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2015 Posts: 1596 Location: The South Zone
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:03 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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What, you didn't that was salvageable?
Slacker.
Just kidding.
_________________ "It's time you started treating people as individuals, rather than mathematically predictable members of an aggregate set, regardless of how well that works." |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:12 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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I knew they had vin numbers on the pan. In Illinois we don't have any inspections where I'm at so shouldn't have any troubles with that. I'm not planning on junking anything until every part can be removed to sell or use. I have my eye on a standard I really want to buy but the guy isn't ready to part with yet.
I don't think I will have much trouble with the license part. I had two close friends with trucks sitting on older frames with no issues.
We will see how everything goes. Might be a learning experience. |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 4:57 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Well I worked a little longer on it this evening. Didn't get to work real long but didn't really need to to see a difference.
[img]https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/1618417.jpg[/
I removed the two front bolts and the two bolts on the steering coupler and the rest of the body come right off.
The things pretty ruff but I feel like I can save what's left. My wife doesn't have much faith but that's ok. I was going to take measurements on exact pan placement for the new ones but there doesn't seem like there is enough left to do that.
A little more plans and reasoning behind building the car. Many years back I was given a 73 from my uncle that was originally my grandpas. It was in pretty bad shape. At the time I didn't know a whole lot about rust repair or major repair I have an automotive degree but mostly all mechanical part. After it sat at my house a couple years I decided to sell it thinking it was to far gone for me to repair. I have kicked myself in the butt ever since.
I have since built a couple mini trucks (not fully complete) had a 69 c10 bagged on 22's and bagged a 53 Buick special I owned for a while. I now feel like I have the knowledge and skill to take on a project like this.
Plan for this one is narrowed front beam, disc front brakes, and full air ride. I want the pan to completely gone thru this summer before I find a replacement body. |
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Rome Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004 Posts: 9638 Location: Pearl River, NY
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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That body rot is amazing.
On your front axle, the entire driver's side shock mount is gone. Do I see correctly that the driver's side lower trailing arm has rotted apart next to the ball joint?
If you can pull this off, to resurrect the pan and then install a decent body, you'll have gained a huge amount of respect here. Hope you stick with it, and provide many updates.
Consider saving your outer door handle, steering column ignition switch and the corresponding key if you have one. Also the rectangular rear reflectors which were a 1-year only item on the '70. Same with the seats. The headrests have the same shape as '71 and '72, but the '70 had narrower seat rails than those 2 later years. |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Thanks for the motivating comments. The main supports of the pan are still solid. Has a few spots on the tips with a little rust but should be an "easy" fix. I hope tomorrow to get some wheels on it and roll it out and pressure wash what's left of it and start making a list of parts needed
I obviously didn't have enough left of the pan to take many measurements to make sure the new floor pans are located correctly. I have a 72 and 73 super also can I take the measurements off one of those when time comes? I thought I seen somewhere they were the same from the front windshield back. |
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Rome Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004 Posts: 9638 Location: Pearl River, NY
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Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:13 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Yes. If you are in the mood to cut up either of the Supers, they are the same as a standard Beetle from the front of the door back. You could cut the front clip off the Super right through the front of the heater channel where it meets the door opening, cut off the roof and the dash. Your rear section would be an exact positioning jig for your floor pan holes. Best to weld an angle iron (discarded bed frame?) across the front of both heater channels before you cut off the front clip so that the channels won't bend out of position when you move the rear body section around.
Remember that once you have your Std. pan cleaned up and reassembled, you can fit any standard Beetle body on it from the '50's thru the '70's with a minimum of work. Bodies up to '68 require the rear body mounts in the wheelwells to be raised/rewelded. '69 onwards don't require that modification; they are direct bolt-on. So that might open up your body choices. |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:23 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Hey thanks for the tip on uskng one of the other bug bodies as a jig. One of the supers is in jus a little better shape than the one I have. Also thank you for letting me know what years will fit. I'm sure I will have asked that later on in the build.
Plan was to get the car cleaned up and pressure washed this weekend but looks like I'm gonna be doing hunny do list all weekend. I hope by next weekend I can make my first big purchase of parts. |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Not a huge update but an update. I come home from work today and started messing around the shop I thought maybe I would try getting the motor in eventually going to use running. It's still in one of the supers I purchased with no title. Previous owner said it ran two years ago but suddenly died and wouldn't start.
A couple days ago I tried starting it with an old battery laying around and it would spit and sputter but not start. I put the battery on charge over night and tried it again tonight. Three quick pumps of the pedal and it fired right up. Ran ruff and wouldn't idle but it was running then died. Gas gauge showed nothing in the tank I tapped on the tank and it sounded empty so I dumped all I had in a spare can in it and tried again. After a couple tries it started up and ran a lot better with fresh fuel.
Ran good enough I couldn't help but to drive it around the yard a little bit. I was so surprised it started.
It's a 1600 dual port. It has flame thrower coil and distributor. Car actually has disk brakes in the front. Wish there was a way to run them on the standard. If anyone has any performance upgrades or ideas I would love to hear them. Supposed to be nice all week so I hope to make some more progress tomorrow! |
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Rome Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004 Posts: 9638 Location: Pearl River, NY
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:29 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Fantastic that the engine started so easily for you. Try these two articles for an introduction into a stronger engine:
http://www.aircooled.net/vw-performance-engines/
http://www.aircooled.net/vw-performance-easy-mods-bolt-on/
Same vendor has many more tech articles on aircooled VWs, and has excellent service when you purchase parts.
Does the Super which has the running engine have a decently solid body and chassis? If so, maybe you should concentrate your efforts to get that one going, or if the other Super is the more solid one, simply transfer the running engine into that one. Are you able to work around the lack of titles by using a bill of sale from the PO and an "abandoned car" form from your state's DMV? We have such a method in NY.
For your standard Beetle pan that you are rebuilding, remember that Karmann Ghia disc brakes bolt right on to a Beetle front end. Ghias had front discs standard as of the '67 model year. But you need the Ghia/disc-specific front spindles to install the calipers, disc and dust plate. For safety reasons its best to buy the parts new, but if you find Ghia spindles and the dust plates at a swap meet/parts seller then you can piece the new calipers and rotors from other sources to save some money. |
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Lingwendil Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009 Posts: 3988 Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:57 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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Pos_bug wrote: |
Not a huge update but an update. I come home from work today and started messing around the shop I thought maybe I would try getting the motor in eventually going to use running. It's still in one of the supers I purchased with no title. Previous owner said it ran two years ago but suddenly died and wouldn't start.
A couple days ago I tried starting it with an old battery laying around and it would spit and sputter but not start. I put the battery on charge over night and tried it again tonight. Three quick pumps of the pedal and it fired right up. Ran ruff and wouldn't idle but it was running then died. Gas gauge showed nothing in the tank I tapped on the tank and it sounded empty so I dumped all I had in a spare can in it and tried again. After a couple tries it started up and ran a lot better with fresh fuel.
Ran good enough I couldn't help but to drive it around the yard a little bit. I was so surprised it started.
It's a 1600 dual port. It has flame thrower coil and distributor. Car actually has disk brakes in the front. Wish there was a way to run them on the standard. If anyone has any performance upgrades or ideas I would love to hear them. Supposed to be nice all week so I hope to make some more progress tomorrow! |
Get us a pic of the brakes, if they are the same generic disc kit that everyone sells you might be able to swap them over with the correct bracket _________________ 73 super beetle thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649622 Back on the Road!
Modify your Kadrons for SVDA http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8115884#8115884
Cast iron VJU4BR8 SVDA reference thread- https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
Need replacement filters for original Kadron aircleaners? WIX #42087 is a perfect fit, as is Napa Gold #2087! |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:46 am Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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I'm not 100% sure on getting a title with a bill of sale and abandoned vehicle papers. I have never really looked into it. I had a lot of trouble once before trying to get a title for a 69 f100 and I knew the owner that the title was in there name just lost. My local DMV believes if it's not normal practice of just swapping title and doing easy paperwork they don't want to do it.
As for the body being in better shape it's a little nicer. Hard to be worse than the one I tore apart. But the floors and such are in just as bad shape and it's going to need most of the patch panels you can buy to fix the body.
I will try to get a picture of the disc brakes tonight when I get home from work. |
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Pos_bug Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2017 Posts: 8 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: My standard bug build |
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These are the best pictures I can get of the disc brakes on the super
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