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Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade
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Butcher
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:28 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Be careful where you peen the shaft. You do not want the plastic gears to hang up, just the aluminum gear.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 8:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

So I roughed up the end of the shaft a little and was able to get it started through the aluminium gear but struggled to get it through enough to get it to come out the other side. I was eventually able to do it by lightly tapping the pin with a hammer and punch while holding another punch on the other end to brace it. Hopefully it works ok, but as butcher and floggingmolly say you don't need to roughen the shaft up much.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Mellow Yellow 74 wrote:
So I roughed up the end of the shaft a little and was able to get it started through the aluminium gear but struggled to get it through enough to get it to come out the other side. I was eventually able to do it by lightly tapping the pin with a hammer and punch while holding another punch on the other end to brace it. Hopefully it works ok, but as butcher and floggingmolly say you don't need to roughen the shaft up much.

Glad it worked for you and you found out for yourself that you don't need to roughen it much! You should be good to go for years.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Great helping me get my cluster off and out ...

people are looking to fix the odo here where i'm needing to adjustthe mileage on the odo. mine works great, except that it's off bc of larger tire size. . .

i had my bus in for service and decided to put white gauges on. Went in with 165k on the ticker which was accurate based on PO. Came out with 220k on the ticker.

How does one adjust the mileage? I've tried lightly to spin the dark grey gear, lightly, not wanting to break anything ... is it possible to roll back my mileage w/o taking the cluster down any further? The 4 screws on the clear plastic are loosened - that's as far as i've gone.
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dgbeatty
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:28 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

The shaft you had repaired needs to be slid over enough to be free on one end. You can then adjust the odometer. Without knowing all of the facts it would appear that the repairing mechanic gets to lick that calf again. Take him some donuts to ease his pain.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:55 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

goffoz wrote:
Just FYI I didn't see it mentioned anywhere, so be aware
I just re-fixed my odo, but in the course of dissasembly I dropped all the odo gears Rolling Eyes sheesh
So after reassembling the gear train and testing it, maybe 5 times Rolling Eyes
I found it is possible to assemble the odo so that it will trip the mile dial at any ratio of the tenth scale on the trip. 5 tries to get it right Sad

ie: when the tenths scale hits 5 the mile dial on the odo roles over. Rolling Eyes

So be careful... use the tooth pick, if you want the odo to role at the 9 on the tenths scale

Any solution here. Whatever I did mine now also trips between 4 and 5.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:51 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

What color is the gear on the end of the shaft? Red, green or some other color. How many teeth does it have? There a few different gears that fit. Post a picture of the gear and the worm gear.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:57 pm    Post subject: odometer fix Reply with quote

thanks for the tip kamzcab86 , i custom made a clip, w a bend, that snaps on to keep the gear from coming out
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:03 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

A friend's 82 has a dead odometer. Glad I found this thread for reference. Thanks for all the info.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:03 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Vnyd Dog wrote:
goffoz wrote:
Just FYI I didn't see it mentioned anywhere, so be aware
I just re-fixed my odo, but in the course of dissasembly I dropped all the odo gears :roll: sheesh
So after reassembling the gear train and testing it, maybe 5 times :roll:
I found it is possible to assemble the odo so that it will trip the mile dial at any ratio of the tenth scale on the trip. 5 tries to get it right :(

ie: when the tenths scale hits 5 the mile dial on the odo roles over. :roll:

So be careful... use the tooth pick, if you want the odo to role at the 9 on the tenths scale

Any solution here. Whatever I did mine now also trips between 4 and 5.

Once you get in there and fool around you should be able to see what it's doing wrong and how to fix it. It's been years since I had mine apart multiple times and finally got it to work right but at one point it was rolling up big numbers on the LEFT side. Sorry I don't remember the details but it's not hard to figure out.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

I dug into my instruments last night to fix the recently non functional odometer, of course it was the classic shaft slippage. I took a chance on simply pushing the shaft back through the grey gear on the driver side and snapped a 1/4Ē rare earth magnet onto the end of the shaft at the grey gear. I expected it to act as a retainer to prevent the shaft from moving again. So far so good. If it fails again I will update this thread.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

I have been working on an issue with my grey syncro's odometer.
When I first got it on the road, the ODO worked for 30 miles, then the shaft slipped loose and "fell down", so of course it didn't spin. I put the shaft back in place and built a nice little retainer that's worked well, but after 30 additional miles- the odometer doesn't function at all. The shaft hasn't slipped down, and the speedo works great- but the miles just don't go up.

Any idea what would cause this?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2018 10:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

10cent inspired odometer fix. My gear had popped off so I didn't address the pin side, so if the pin moves I will do the lock washer.

Anyways I took a .025" thick piece of metal from an old computer and attached it to the existing screw on the odometer housing. I sanded/filed and used a vise to bend it to keep the gear in place. The metal is clearing everything and it doesn't seem to interfere.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:43 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

^^^ Nice work & fitment (!) but I hope you cleaned the swarf off the sanded edge...???

Hit a couple good bumps & that would not play nice with all the pretty plastic gears... Confused

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 7:54 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

These fixes prevent the gear from sliding off the shaft. However since it is still loose on the shaft, wonít it eventually spin and cause odometer inaccuracies? Why not just buy a new press fit gear from odometergears.com and be good for a long time?
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:12 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

That is what I've been saying for awhile. The fix is not fixing anything. The proper fix is making certain the other gear is attached to the shaft. Sadly, the great idea is not so great.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:17 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

I've fixed a couple by removing the gear, knurling the shaft using the teeth of pliers, and then pressing the gear back on with some super glue added for that belt and suspenders effect. No need to fabricate anything.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:36 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Read the thread, gentlemen. When I showed the axial stop it was in addition to better fixing the other gears to the shaft. The axial stop won't stop a slipping gear (like, duh?), but fixing the slipping gears won't keep the shaft from slowly walking out. Do both and you won't be in there again.
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Butcher
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

If the fixed gear is pressed on correctly, it will not slip. Done correctly, it will never slip. The bracket is only warranted if you do not do your job correctly. I have probably not have done as many as you, but everyone of mine never came back. I would say at least 50-100. Many of the cars are vintage that are still on the road.

I get what you are saying, but if you need the bracket, then it proves the gear is not fixed to the shaft.

I would not expect two mechanics to agree on anything, but it's just an opinion I have formed thru the 40 years of German car repairs.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 3:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Odometer Fix/Cluster upgrade Reply with quote

Just bought my first Syncro last month and been slowly fixing things. Decided to tackle the inoperative odometer this week. Speedo worked, most of the time but odometer did not. PO stated that he had never known it to work in the 5 years he owned it. Odometer status on title is exempt. I read everything I could and it all sounded like a real chore so I opted to buy a replacement speedo. Came in two days ago, installed yesterday. Took it for a test spin and in 2nd gear 3000 rpm reading 40 mph... Double checked the speedo face it has the proper ď1600Ē face, but apparently someone was in the scamming state of mind and swapped a Syncro face on a Vanagon speedo. NOT HAPPY! Sent message to seller on EBay, no response yet... Decided today that I might as well see if I could rebuild my old one. Watched several videos, read every thread I could find.

I think Iím ready to do this. 1st difficulty, the needle did not want to come off... I was really afraid of breaking it. I finally found a fork with tines slim enough to slide under and gave it gradually increasing force. It finally came loose.

Next problem was the needle return spring whic also did not want to come loose. It finally came loose and then I quickly disassembled into the main components, cleaning as I went. Quickly found that the metal gear was free spinning on the shaft. I initially tried a 3/32 drill bit as a mandrel to slide in and displace the shaft. This worked, but the bit was just barely long enough and I had no room to grip it. I then thought about my transfer punch set and quickly substituted the 3/32 one for the drill bit and now weíre cooking!

I slowly withdrew the mandrel until the metal gear fell out. I then took a small chisel and lightly staked the edges of the internal hole that the shaft slides through. I wasnít light enough...grrr I had to gently rework the areas that I had jus staked with a dremel and a very fine stone. Finally got the fit I wanted, the shaft would start but then quickly bind, but by judicious twisting of the shaft and pushing it would slowly move further into engagement. Bingo! Thatís what weíre loooking for!

So now I reassemble the shaft and the numbered rollers, no issues there. Then Iím looking at the tumbler gears that engage the rollers and I think... Hmmm the Bus is new to me, mileage is unknown and the title list mileage as being exempt... Iím going to reset the odometer to 000000 so that the Bus and I can start all over together. So how do I do this?

There is one shaft that all of the tumbler gears ride on. If I could get that shaft loose I should in theory be able to then adjust all the numbered rollers to 0. Then reset the tumbler gears one by one. First things first. The shaft has each end peened substantially so that it will not slide out of the housing. I pull out the trusty dremel and slowly and meticulously begin working one side of the shaft down with a very fine stone. I shortly am able to slide the shaft out of the bracket on one side. I slowly withdraw the shaft and remove each gear one at a time and arrange it in the same orientation that it came out. That was easy!

So now the thinking comes in. I study the tumbler gears and see that there are 8 tumblers on each gear and that there are 4 narrow tumblers and 4 wide tumblers and are arranged wide then narrow then wide, etc around the perimeter of the tumbler gear. I look at the numbered rollers and quickly see that the one side of the numbered rollers is evenly spaced with slots all the way around. The other side however has only one narrow slot and the rest of the gear is clearanced. Now I begin to understand how this works. I also realize that Iím actually working on the back side of the speedometer and so if I want it to read 000000 on the face I need to set 555555 on the side Iím working from which just happens to align with the single slot on the left side of the gear.

So this took a couple of tries to get it right. I would set the 1st gear with one of the wide teeth in the long slot formed by having the numbered rollers aligned at 555555 and the advance the shaft through the gear until it was slightly protruding and then repeat the procedure. This was very tedious as the numbered rollers kept wanting to shift around and the tumbler gears would come in to engagement and out of engagement. I literally had to reset each tumbler after every new one was added on. This was caused by the shaft sliding away from the numbered rollers so I could slide the next tumbler gear on. Now that I figured it all out, I think I could do this fairly quickly.

I then did a dry run once all the tumblers were back in place and spun the metal gear by hand to see if the numbered rollers worked as they were supposed to. They did! Now I added just a bit of crazy glue on the ends of the tumbler gear shaft so that it would not slide out and I reassembled the entire speedo, lubricating the helical gear with white lithium grease. There wasnít any lubricant anywhere else that I could see and so I left everything else dry.

Important note! At no time did I let the numbered rollers ever come off a shaft or mandrel of some kind. I had fears that there may be spring washers of some sort in between and Iím not sure if each numbered roller has a different tooth engagement. I donít think that either is the case, but just to make sure I left them fully intact as one unit the whole time by sliding a mandrel in to displace the shaft and then by sliding the shaft in to displace the mandrel. I did take the tumbler gears out individually and kept them in order and in th proper orientation. Even with these precautions I did manage to put one on backwards and had to disassemble and reassemble the whole series of tumblers. It was not immediately clear that I had made an error, until I attempted to advance the metal gear by hand and it would only turn a limited amount before jamming. If I had installed and run it that way it would have destroyed the speedo Iím sure!

I reinstalled the reconditioned unit and everything works. The only thing that may not be 100% is the 1-9 mile tumbler seems to advance 1/2 turn early so that at 1 mile the one was all the way on top and the 2 was already visible. The 10-99 mile roller works as it should, so maybe this is just the way the VW speedo works. Anyhow it is consistent so Iím satisfied. It took the better part of 5 hours to do this as I took it very slow and analyzed every move before doing it. I believe that I could do this again in under an hour. Sadly I did not have camera handy for all of this and I have attempted to clearly describe my actions. I hope that others will find this helpful.


Last edited by sdalcher on Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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