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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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 Posted: Fri May 26, 2017 9:46 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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That'll work. A bit different. But then, I've never seen 2 Baja Bugs identical to each other, even built by the same person.
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Sat May 27, 2017 8:04 am Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| yeah it was my friends dads idea. He was worried about getting strong welds to the torsion and said it always cracks so came up with this and i thought it was a good idea. bit different but that could be good. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 9:46 am Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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got some of the major tubes tacked in its nice to be making actual progress.
you can see the planned gusset around the torsion to create an extremely strong point and to get more weld on the torsion to attempt to eliminate cracking.
as you can see here i have the front spaced out to allow the beam to be straight. IM not sure if i will keep the panhead or cut it off as the spacers scare me but just tubes would be weaker (i think) need a little help there.also full tube would allow the beam to be leaned back a few degrees for caster adjustment.
trying to find the bend i want on the a tubes.
how it sits now with the 31s in the rear. the front wheels will be different but probably sit about there as my droop in majorly limited currently. and the new shocks will fix that. Also thinking about the 235 in the front for now rather than the 215 i have because i hate the "stinkbug" look and the 235 is a bit taller. |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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You're making good progress.
That panhead is way bent. Trying to space out to a beam that's set straight will not be good. Better to cut it out and close off the front of the tunnel with an access plate to service the shifter shaft.
If the tubular support structure is built well, it will be way stronger that the panhead by itself.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| dustymojave wrote: |
You're making good progress.
That panhead is way bent. Trying to space out to a beam that's set straight will not be good. Better to cut it out and close off the front of the tunnel with an access plate to service the shifter shaft.
If the tubular support structure is built well, it will be way stronger that the panhead by itself. |
okay ill talk to them about cutting the pan head off
if i cut the pan head off i wanna take tubes to the bottom half of the tunnel opening. that will be covered with thickish sheet metal. the upper half would be removable for shift rod access.
Its a full 1/4 inch of shims so a pretty big gap. Im also missing a panhead bolt and one of the threaded inserts was pulling out. the panhead in general has a lot of issues really want it to be gone |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:47 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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OK. That's what I was suggesting.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 3:01 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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the panhead will most likely be staying for now due to insurance reasons just to be safe.
What's the easiest way to make shock mounts in the front? Thinking about just making a v on the tube that ties into the top of the beam. With a shock mount at the top.
So looking at the front end mounting is gonna be really hard to do. I might have to buy some warrior towers that would also get bumps out of the way. I wanna keep the stock beam as it has berrings rather than bushings
i have to make something to mount those too and clear the gas tank? how do i do this? Or do i just man up and buy the plate towers
Also as far as seats go I was thinking the tubes from outer runner to tunnel. With sheet metal squares between tube and tunnel. Then angle Iron on top of that for. Mounting the seats. Drill many holes for the seats to mount on so they can be aircraft grade pined for somewhat quick adjustment. Or just the rear and flip them forward.
the a pillars are done my window rollers clear so i dont have to open th edoor to roll them up and down.
rear torsion a tube will also sit on top of the gussett as mocked up then tubes back to the motor cage mounts. the tubes from the top of the b hoop to the motor cage are ready to be tacked. |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 4:20 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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This is my suggestion for going ahead on your cage.
Rear shock mounts and bump stops need to be considered.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| dustymojave wrote: |
This is my suggestion for going ahead on your cage.
Rear shock mounts and bump stops need to be considered. |
the tubes that i have sat there are what i planned on doing very similar to what you drew. the top tubes are notched just not tacked in yet.
I also plan on putting a tube between the two that meets the b hoop at the same level the harness bar does.
I was considering doing a straight tube where i have mine placed for perspective rather than a bent one.
i do like that tube behind the torsion also |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:29 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| bikesndbugs wrote: |
| the panhead will most likely be staying for now due to insurance reasons just to be safe. |
What the hell does insurance have to do with this? In Australia, their DMV gets involved and requires any changes of such things must be proven engineering. In the US...aint no way the DMV gets into all that. But design your changes well anyway.
| bikesndbugs wrote: |
What's the easiest way to make shock mounts in the front? Thinking about just making a v on the tube that ties into the top of the beam. With a shock mount at the top.
So looking at the front end mounting is gonna be really hard to do. I might have to buy some warrior towers that would also get bumps out of the way. I wanna keep the stock beam as it has berrings rather than bushings
i have to make something to mount those too and clear the gas tank? how do i do this? Or do i just man up and buy the plate towers
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This is what I posted in response to your post in SHOCKS...SHOCKS...SHOCKS asking the same question.
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Tube mounts are one option.
Plate mounts like what most now know as Warrior style works too.
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| This involved re-shaping the inner fender panels with a rubber mallet and a body dolly from an 'L' to a '7'. This could be done with the stock gas tank retained in the stock location. |
Or the extended stock towers that Vanapple built for his buggy.
I once built a set of towers for a buggy with 1.5" x .095 tube welded to the top of stock towers that had been cut off an inch above the top tube. Added a 1" x .065 stiffener from the top back of the 1.5" down to the bottom back of the stock tower behind the bottom tube, and another 1" diagonal over to the body mount boss on top of the factory beam clamps. I don't have any pics of that setup though.
If you use 8" travel shocks with stock lower mounts on the arms, or if you use 10" travel shocks with extended mounts near the link pin on the lower arm, then the upper shock mount boss should be 12" above the top of the upper beam tube. So-called 8" warrior style towers fit this. |
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| dustymojave wrote: |
| bikesndbugs wrote: |
| the panhead will most likely be staying for now due to insurance reasons just to be safe. |
What the hell does insurance have to do with this? In Australia, their DMV gets involved and requires any changes of such things must be proven engineering. In the US...aint no way the DMV gets into all that. But design your changes well anyway.
| bikesndbugs wrote: |
What's the easiest way to make shock mounts in the front? Thinking about just making a v on the tube that ties into the top of the beam. With a shock mount at the top.
So looking at the front end mounting is gonna be really hard to do. I might have to buy some warrior towers that would also get bumps out of the way. I wanna keep the stock beam as it has berrings rather than bushings
i have to make something to mount those too and clear the gas tank? how do i do this? Or do i just man up and buy the plate towers
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This is what I posted in response to your post in SHOCKS...SHOCKS...SHOCKS asking the same question.
| Quote: |
Tube mounts are one option.
Plate mounts like what most now know as Warrior style works too.
| Quote: |
| This involved re-shaping the inner fender panels with a rubber mallet and a body dolly from an 'L' to a '7'. This could be done with the stock gas tank retained in the stock location. |
Or the extended stock towers that Vanapple built for his buggy.
I once built a set of towers for a buggy with 1.5" x .095 tube welded to the top of stock towers that had been cut off an inch above the top tube. Added a 1" x .065 stiffener from the top back of the 1.5" down to the bottom back of the stock tower behind the bottom tube, and another 1" diagonal over to the body mount boss on top of the factory beam clamps. I don't have any pics of that setup though.
If you use 8" travel shocks with stock lower mounts on the arms, or if you use 10" travel shocks with extended mounts near the link pin on the lower arm, then the upper shock mount boss should be 12" above the top of the upper beam tube. So-called 8" warrior style towers fit this. |
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my insurance wants to insect the car just being careful about it for now. still building it so i can cut it off at a later date.
so the difference between the 10 inch and 8 inch towers isnt the tower itself but the mounts on the arm.
The tubular style of yours might not work on mine as my tubes sit inwards more.
would a tube from the lower on the beam then another tube from the upper beam tube work. im pretty sure ive seen that before but not sure how it worked. it may need some bracing as you described above.
ill see if i can sketch one up tomorrow |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:00 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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bad scetch of a shock mount idea. it would fit well and be very easy to do would also still work if i widened the beam.
is that strong enough? |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:03 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| bikesndbugs wrote: |
bad scetch of a shock mount idea. it would fit well and be very easy to do would also still work if i widened the beam.
is that strong enough? |
so i was discussing this design with a few people and alot are telling me it wont work with .095 wall. and that i should go buy some .120 for that. what do you guys think?
my friend was telling me just to get the plate towers but i dont wanna have to weld those on as its right on the bearing surface area. |
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cbeck
Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2014
Posts: 2495
Location: high ridge, mo
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| Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:49 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| My shock bosses are .250 wall 1"tube. |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:59 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| Quote: |
so i was discussing this design with a few people and alot are telling me it wont work with .095 wall. and that i should go buy some .120 for that. what do you guys think?
my friend was telling me just to get the plate towers but i dont wanna have to weld those on as its right on the bearing surface area. |
Won't work with .095...????? I'll have to remember that and only drive mine slow in parking lots from now on. I must have been extremely lucky to pre-run Barstow MORE race courses at speed and get away with no damage. Not to mention all the miles I've put on that suspension over the many years. Go ahead and buy .120 wall if you wish.
Plate towers were one of my earlier suggestions and welding next to the bearings was an issue I warned about. Seems like an echo in this topic.
I've shown you how I made mine. No welding next to bearings. It works and works VERY well! I described other ways. You could combine the way I built mine and the way I described how I built the towers for a customer's car. There are a zillion ways to do most anything on a Baja Bug.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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dustymojave
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007
Posts: 5802
Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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| Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:06 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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By the way...
cbeck mentioned using 1" OD x .250 wall tube for shock mount bosses. Such bosses are available off the shelf from many suppliers pre-cut to length or in short sections to cut your own. If you use KYB Gas-A-Just #5530 8" travel shocks, their ends are 12mm bore to fit stock VW shock mount bolts. To use stronger 1/2" x 20 fine thread bolts, you can pretty easily bore out the sleeves in the shock ends.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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cbeck
Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2014
Posts: 2495
Location: high ridge, mo
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:22 am Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| I bought a 12" piece of the 250 wall x 1" at the metal supplier for less than 1 shock boss at the flaps. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:34 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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shock towers are on hold untill we get the front tubes in then we can look at my options some more. .120 wall might be a good idea. but personally i think .095 wall would be fine if designed well. I of course am trying to stay off the bearing.
I was considering doing plate extensions to the stock ones and having a tube gusset down to the beam. out of 1 inch 095. this would use minimal material.
similar to the example dusty showed but with a tube support rather than plate. |
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bikesndbugs
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2015
Posts: 218
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2017 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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got alot of tubes in the tire on the engine cage was just an idea.
got alot of the front end tube work done.
what is the max angle the eave twist reliably? 90? 100?
i measured the the travel with the leaves out and got like 9 on driver and 8 on passenger as my tierod hits the cage.
i picked up some fox 12 inch 2.0s with resis for up front today. maybe a bit tall but it was a great deal. i also go a nice tri mill exhaust and some kadrons that are missing a few parts here and there. mainly a throttle body.
shock mounts may end up very similar to dustys but im not 100 percent sure yet. next up is seat mounts. any suggestions? |
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cbeck
Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2014
Posts: 2495
Location: high ridge, mo
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:55 am Post subject: Re: 68 baja build |
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| Did your insurance co come inspect your bug yet? |
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