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advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself
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advCo
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:40 am    Post subject: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Hey folks. Let me introduce myself quick before I get into the car. My name is Nick, born and raised in Boston, MA but moved to Houston, TX a year ago. My pop is a mechanic by trade and used to work solely on air cooled VWs, so I have a bit of a mechanical background. We restored a '64 Beetle a few years ago (got me into this rabbit hole of restoration as a hobby) which remains with my 'rents up in New England, and I currently am restoring 2-3 vintage motorcycles and own a few more. I do all my own mechanical work and motor building on the motorcycles, so I am handy with a wrench. I own my own design and fabrication business - I design graphics (vinyl and print) as well as fabricate/design signage, furniture and interior spaces and with that have done plenty of wood, metal and custom fiberglass work (see the blue Honda below) as well as quite a bit of bodywork and paint.

One of pops in our restored '64
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The Ghia and a few of my motorbikes
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A little bit about the car. Its ROUGH. My girlfriend's father up in Louisville bought it ~10 years ago with the intent to restore it but never got around to it. I started asking 'what's under the tarp' and before you know it I'm hauling a Ghia back to Texas with me. The PO told him the motor had been "rebuilt" 4k miles ago (there's 44k on the clock so I'm assuming that just means valve job, but who knows). It turns over and everything 'looks' OK powertrain wise.

Once I got the old girl back home, I took a closer look. It appears to have been "restored" already since there's bondo bubbling off all over the place. Shocked There are a few really bad spots on the body that I expect to have to cut out. My plan for this is to cut out the rot and reweld formed sheet metal panels, but I am always open to suggestions.

As I expected, the floor pans are shot and will need replacing, as well as the rear skirt around the motor. I know repop sheet metal pans are available but I was talking to a buddy and he mentioned fiberglass pans and that got me thinking, but that's for another day.

Frame and suspension all looks solid. The interior will need gutted, but I hope to possibly save the seat upholstery (not holding my breath). The 'hood' is frozen shut, and I haven't yet tried to get it open yet.

Enough of my babbling, I'll let the photos do the talking.

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I know this car 'may' not be worth saving to a lot of people, but I'm a sucker for a good project, so I'm going to do my best to get it driveable and looking fairly presentable. It won't be a show car, but I plan to keep it so this will be a long haul project and I'll be trying to do things right. I've had the car for about a month now, and haven't done much besides research and put it into a portable garage next to my shop. Pops gave me a Clymer manual that covers the Beetle and Ghia, so I've been doing a little reading on the mechanicals.

I pulled the plugs and put some oil into the cylinders to help free up the rings. First part of the plan is to clean the carb, hook up a charged battery and run a fuel bottle and see if she won't fire up.
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Evil_Fiz
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Welcome and congrats on the Ghia. You will find that the prevailing opinion on this forum is that most, if not all, Ghias are worth saving. Your example does not look so far gone that it can not be saved. It sounds like you are the right person for the job. Stick with it, and we love pictures.

...we're all in this together.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:51 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Yes welcome Nick. As "Evil" says most forum people will tell you it's worth saving and fortunately there's a lot of evidence to support that in the Stickies at the top of the Ghia Section...particularly this: Ghia Restoration Topics – For Instruction and Inspiration.

Yes there is a lot of repro tin out there to help you on your way and fiberglass pans which have advantages, such as....um...ah...nope sorry, it's gone, can't remember what the advantages are. Wink Seriously, 99% of people here would advise metal panels all the way. These car are unusual beasts in that they are all different to some degree, coachbuilt vehicles usually are. By that token a lot of the repro tin need massaging to fit. Something I'm sure you can manage. Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:12 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

welcome to the Ghia Forum!!
Concur with John, forget the fiberglass floor pans and break out the welder.
To open your hood, remove the horns rubber boot down low upfront. Then you can reach your arm up and release it from the inside. Don't be upset, some one will call your ghia a "Fatchick", its just a term of endearment for the late ones. It may be me. Wink
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:53 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

c21darrel wrote:
welcome to the Ghia Forum!!
Concur with John, forget the fiberglass floor pans and break out the welder.
To open your hood, remove the horns rubber boot down low upfront. Then you can reach your arm up and release it from the inside. Don't be upset, some one will call your ghia a "Fatchick", its just a term of endearment for the late ones. It may be me. Wink


Lol. Laughing I thought 70-72 were chubby chicks, 73,74 fat chicks
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:52 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

All Ghias are worth saving. Especially so if craftsmanship is generously applied.
Nicholas
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:59 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Quote:
Lol. I thought 70-72 were chubby chicks, 73,74 fat chicks


Quote:
All Ghias are worth saving. Especially so if craftsmanship is generously applied.


All the chubby ones are worth saving. Very Happy
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advCo
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:47 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Thanks for the encouraging words gents. After procrastinating work and reading through a bunch of threads here, I feel a bit better about getting involved in this project - chubby chick or not, we'll get it roadworthy again. Work on the car won't really start until the "winter" - I am finishing up the resto of a motorcycle and getting ready to sell 2 others to fund the floors for this build. I expect this resto to take 1.5-2 years, which may be a tight timeline but when I get started on a project I don't stop until its done Laughing

In the meantime I've been doing research on suspension, mods, etc and what to look out for during the restoration process. My general plan is to keep mostly everything stock when I do restorations, then mod as I see fit later. I plan on building an adjustable beam while I have the body off to drop the front 1-1.5 inches, mostly just to level it out. Any other suspension mods will be done after the restoration is complete.

As far as aesthetics go...I really dislike the yellow that this particular car has been painted. I know it has been resprayed in a much brighter shade of yellow than the L10E Pampas Yellow, but I can't bring myself to like the color. The thought of spending all bunch of time restoring a car I just don't like the color of...well...

What's the general consensus on color change here? I usually even keep my motorcycle restos close to original color as I can. I really love the L20E Amber and the L52E Pastel blue.

I hope to get some time this weekend to try and start her up, strip the interior and get a ton of pics of all the nice rusty spots for you guys.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:03 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

In response to your color question, there are two camps in this forum, the "It's your car, do what makes you happy" group, and the "it depends on whether you want to retain the most value for resale or whether the value is what the car is worth to you since you plan to keep it" group. Be honest with yourself and the answer will materialize before your eyes. Oh, and then you have the purists who won't like anything you do that deviates even slightly from stock Laughing

FWIW, I am going down the "modified but mostly with reversible changes" road.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:48 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

As to a color change, in your situation I think it's feasible. The 2 color choices you mentioned are from the same '70 model year, which is the best plan for a color change. Your Ghia will need every exterior panel to be worked, either simply by sanding, or by metal replacement. The majority of the engine compartment as well, with the engine surround sections. By the time you have the metal all repaired, welds ground down, filler applied and primed, there will be very few areas that will remain the original color. So go for it. Here's an amber '70 I photo'd 14 years ago at a meet in PA. If you like this style of wheels, they are called "Sprint Stars" which come either in 4.5 or 5.5" widths. The ones on this Ghia are 4.5" wide.
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I wish you perseverance to finish the car to be presentable and driveable. If you find yourself in a lull, just gripe here and we'll most likely be able to revive your interest. We also always enjoy photos of updates.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 2:31 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Quote:
By the time you have the metal all repaired, welds ground down, filler applied and primed

...you will be several years older Wink
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

c21darrel wrote:
Quote:
By the time you have the metal all repaired, welds ground down, filler applied and primed

...you will be several years older Wink


Plus there's a good chance in 3-4 years (ha ha on the 1.5 Shocked )your color preferences are going to change as well. Look forward to what it'll be when the time comes.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:39 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

^^^^True that.
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advCo
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:07 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Good advice, we were looking at the brochure for this year model Ghia today. There are some great colors for this year, so there will be some tough decision making when the time comes.

I found a set of 4-lug Porsche rims locally for a great price that I may try and pick up and work around. I need to find some more info on them and widths for 'em before I make any moves.

I think they'd look pretty slick.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:34 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Careful with those wheels- they are late '70's Porsche 924, with a 4x106mm bolt pattern. They will not bolt directly onto your Ghia hubs because those are 4x130mm. Could even be 14" diameter instead of the Ghia-sized 15". You could buy new discs and drums which are blank, and have them drilled for the 4x106 pattern, or simply find other wheels that do bolt right on. IMO Porsche 914 alloy wheels look very good on Ghias and do bolt directly on. Most of the 914 alloys, either originals or aftermarket, tend to be 5.5" wide.

More info here on 924 rims: http://www.wheelsupport.com/porsche-bolt-patterns/
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:04 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

Thanks for the info. Too bad they aren't a bolt on. I am going to consider my options and mull it over for a bit, may go look at the rims anyways (the price is that good) Smile
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

With the exception of it being a coupe, that's exactly how mine looked when I started.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:30 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

advCo wrote:
Thanks for the info. Too bad they aren't a bolt on. I am going to consider my options and mull it over for a bit, may go look at the rims anyways (the price is that good) Smile


Find out width and offset. Ghias are a difficult car to fit non-stock wheels/tires. (check how many pages in the "tire and wheel thread)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=299926
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 6:10 pm    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

sounds like you're the right man to save that Ghia.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 4:15 am    Post subject: Re: advCo's '70 Ghia Project Log - Brace yourself Reply with quote

I'm suprised no one has said to take a screwdriver to the rockers yet. With the pans that bad I'd almost guarantee you'll be replacing some rocker/heater channel area. It's rough but can be done. I'd also say just go ahead and plan to take the body off. It will make life so much easier and you will be able to get to everything and see what your really looking at. Brace yourself. It will be worse than you can see right now. Should still be plenty doable though. Good luck and have fun.
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