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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:06 am Post subject: Engine in 67 |
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I recently purchased a 1967 sedan and am trying to learn about the engine that is in it. I believe it is a universal case. No engine number. The sump flange on the right side of the engine below the push rod tubes has the VW and Audi logos. To the left of the logos is the number 8. To the right of the logos is:
2BR
000.101.102
BRAZIL
The hole for the thermostat has been drilled and tapped, I presume at the factory. However, no flaps or thermostat. It does have the T3 dip stick block off plate but does not have the mounting holes for a T2.
I was told by the person I bought the car from that his mechanic said the engine is a 1500 but didn't know how he knew. It has the one piece intake manifold with the curved ends. No horizontal moldings under the gen stand. Incorrect distributor (Bosch 009) and a 28 PICT carb. The engine runs fine and is very peppy. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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Zundfolge1432 Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004 Posts: 12466
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Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:24 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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**enter** the 009 trolls. |
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Sharp64 Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015 Posts: 5304 Location: Central Florida
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Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:31 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Mechanic probably said it was a 1500 as that’s what would have come with the car and what shows up when you look under the engine options for that year. There is zero way of knowing what size the engine is without removing the heads. More than likely it’s a 1600 single port motor. _________________ 1960 Indigo Blue Ragtop (Blue Barry)
1967 Ghia
1985 Westy Money Pit
“...some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.” - Michael Caine
Last edited by Sharp64 on Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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wcfvw69 Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004 Posts: 13389 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Post some pictures of the engine. Sounds like a replacement case was used and as mentioned, more than likely it has 85.5 pistons in it which makes it a 1600. _________________ Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours** |
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Planning on it. Winter project. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:26 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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OK,
here are some pics.
Anything else that might be helpful?
_________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31358 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 1:53 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Brazilian engine case. Single port engine, likely 1500 or 1600cc (1500cc pistons and cylinders are no longer available new).
Likely in your location you could get by with the solid engine lid. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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mukluk Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012 Posts: 7020 Location: Clyde, TX
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 4:22 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Sharp64 wrote: |
Mechanic probably said it was a 1500 as that’s what would have come with the car and what shows up when you look under the engine options for that year. There is zero way of knowing what size the engine is without removing the heads. More than likely it’s a 1600 single port motor. |
I agree with this statement 100%.
In case you're open to tips/observations, three things jump out at me in the pics you posted that you should consider attending to: 1) your 3&4 spark leads are resting upon the left preheat tube, that tube will normally be upwards of 400°F during operation unless the tube is plugged so there's a chance they may be damaged if left there, 2) judging from the lack of screws passing through the left cylinder tinware, chances are quite good you are missing an important piece of tin that helps direct airflow around the back side of cylinder four, and 3) if you have intentions of driving the car in cool or cold weather, it would be advisable to procure and reinstall the air cleaner preheat hoses and stovepipes.
Nice car by the way. _________________ 1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga" |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Mukluk,
Thank you for your suggestions. 1) I hadn't clued into the wires on the preheat pipe. 2) The tin wear you are referring to, is that the flat-ish piece about the size of a post card that the preheat stove pipe would go through? 3) I plan on installing these this winter along with the shroud flaps and thermostat. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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mukluk Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012 Posts: 7020 Location: Clyde, TX
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:06 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Correct, it would be number eight in the diagram below. If the left side is missing, chances are good the one on the right will also be MIA.
_________________ 1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga" |
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:20 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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fuel filter should be removed and placed under car near transmission, fire hazard in engine bay. leaks will land on the high voltage sparking dizzie, so please remove that filter. see also the engine safety wire fire info on link at bottom of this post.
that is a stock 67 air cleaner, but it is missing the two carb preheater hoses, you might want that for winter driving, dizzie is not stock missing lower tin under the cylinders will result in improper cooling and exposed the thin delicate pushrod tubes to impact damage from flung road debris.
later style fuel pump installed. wires should have some sleaving, the ignition wire, which also powers choke element is NOT fused, a short may result in much harness melting, so make sure thoose wires are well protected.
good luck _________________ Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:51 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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Thanks,
I hadn't thought about the ignition wires and sleaving. The fuel filter will be moved this winter and the rubber fuel line through the fire wall replaced with metal. Also, the safety wire on the brass carb fitting will be installed: I already have one on my other VW. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:11 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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No under cylinder air deflectors, either. Number 4 on the figure, above. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 33990 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:13 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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davidw99 wrote: |
No under cylinder air deflectors, either. Number 4 on the figure, above. |
Can't tell from the pic, but do the cylinder pairs at least have the small Type 1 deflectors? |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:32 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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I'm not sure what you mean. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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splitjunkie Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 4091
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Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:52 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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davidw99 wrote: |
No under cylinder air deflectors, either. Number 4 on the figure, above. |
Good eye.
There is a sheet metal deflector that should be snapped to the head studs between the cylinders on the bottom side. They are very important so you should fix that immediately.
Your engine appears to have some of those goofy spring loaded plastic push rod tubes. That will work to your advantage in this case. You have to take the rocker arms off and pull the push rods, storing them so they go back in the same spot, and then remove the push rod tubes. The deflectors will be easy to snap into place. Put everything back and readjust the valves with the engine cold. _________________ Chris
You know, a lot of these scratches will buff right out... Jerry Seinfeld |
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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also see that you dont have a thermostat, which means long warm ups, exrra engine wear, poor fuel economy. dont skimp on that, youd not runa chevy nor toyota with the thermostat missing, dont do that on the Bug either.
rubber check valve on bottom oil drip tube is missing, this is important for without it crank case ventalation will not work properly and dirty air can be injested into the crank case via this open hole (ie bottom of that tube that extends below motor from oil filler) _________________ Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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davidw99 Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2003 Posts: 696 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 11:52 am Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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OK, this is what I have learned since my last post. The little pieces of tin (about 2 x 2") that are put between the cylinders on the heads are present. The larger air deflectors (about 5 x 5") between the actual cylinders are not. While I was under the car I measured the valve studs and they measure 8mm. At least, they are definitely not 10mm. Based on the case being a Brazilian single port universal case, what does the 8mm stud diameter indicate about the engine, if anything?
I have purchased the shroud flaps, the thermostat, bracket and rod and the rear deflectors that the stove pipes go through. Stove pipes are coming. I will get the under cylinder deflectors soon.
I can't believe that all of this stuff was missing. It's all present on my '73. I know, I rebuilt the engine. Never thought about not putting it all back. _________________ Dave
'73 Saturn Yellow Sports Bug that has undergone a full pan off restoration. "Herbert IV."
'67 Sedan. "Bellamy." Currently being "refreshed" and recently repainted. |
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Rome Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004 Posts: 9637 Location: Pearl River, NY
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: Engine in 67 |
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dave, while you are in the parts purchasing stage, also buy 3 of these spark plug holders- https://vwparts.aircooled.net/SearchResults.asp?Search=spark+plug+holder
Each one snaps into an approx. 1/2" dia. hole along the vertical face of the fan shroud. The left one is below the ignition coil, the center one below the throttle cable outlet hole, and the right would be mirror-image to the left one. They're all along a straight line on the shroud. These enable three things: Keeps the spark plug cables off other parts of the engine, keeps them separated (should not tie-wrap them directly together), and holds them in place so they don't shake around on bumpy roads.
Also recommend buying a bulk pack of zinc-plated 1/4" flat washers to position under your engine tin screws. You'll need to remove your rear breast plate (the one with the two round plugs for the carb preheat hoses) to fit your lower cylinder rear tins for which you remove some of the screws anyway. Clean off the tin screws with a wire wheel bench grinder, then apply anti-seize grease to the threads so they come out easier in the future. All those tin screws need very little torque to tighten, so don't over-tighten!
Finally, hose clamps for the top ends of the large fresh-air hoses at the fan shroud snouts. You can use regular HW store clamps, about 2 1/2" dia. If either hose blows off the snout, the cooling air which normally goes through the heater box will not reach the HB, causing a significant heat build-up in the HB and on the underside of the head and the pair of cylinders.
Last edited by Rome on Sat Oct 14, 2017 2:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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