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vanjoe Samba Member
Joined: December 25, 2009 Posts: 606 Location: Santa Maria
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:37 pm Post subject: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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I am just curious if anyone might have an idea why my van runs so smooth and is peppy. It isn't no sports car but it scoots along good. This is my 4th van and my first automatic which I love and would never go back to a stick in a Vanagon. This van idles and runs smoother than any Vanagon I have had and is a dream. How can I tell if the motor has been rebuilt and if it has been bored out and is bigger than a 2.1? _________________ 1990 VW Vanagon tin top weekender Carat
1998 Mercedes S420
"Why is there never time to do it right the first time, but there is always time to do it twice?"
"Back to the basics!" |
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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6798 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:45 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Christmas is near...it thinks your going to get him something! 😆 _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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jimf909 Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014 Posts: 7402 Location: WA/ID
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Your previous three vans were running on three cylinders?
This van has been converted to a modern day power plant?
Two stabs at answering you question.
Enjoy the peppy-smooth ride! _________________ - Jim
Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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Wolfram Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2005 Posts: 184 Location: Waiheke Island/On The Road USA
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Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:49 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Cooler temps result in an increased O2 content as the air is denser.
Also combustion temps are lower.
Disclaimer: not a physicist. _________________ 88 Westy, '07 EJ25 Vanaru.
Either van-less on Waiheke Island in New Zealand where we spend the Southern summer, or Wolfram is in Seattle/Olympia in storage. |
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E1 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2013 Posts: 6378 Location: Westfalia, Earth
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 1:52 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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If per chance the headlights can spin 360 degrees, you might ask Linda Blair.
If not that, gotta be aliens.
Have fun, Happy Thanksgiving. _________________ ‘84 Westy, 2.1L with Digijet, 5.43 R+P, GT Gears
"Adding power makes you faster on the straights.
Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
— Colin Chapman |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22568 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:17 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Can we stop skills from Subar-trolling please? _________________ .ssS! |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:34 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Old school superstition dictates that one never talk about how well something is working!
That being said, a healthy WBX runs quite well and zips along with pep and enthusiasm! Only the longest steepest hills will get to you. Your top speed is of course limited.
A well running WBX is a joy to drive!!
How do I know?
I did two cross Country trips with a "good" running WBX and now just did a third 8,000 mile trip with an "excellent" running WBX, what a DIFFERENCE!!!!
A joy to drive!
I never pushed it past 70mph and mostly did 57-63 on secondary roads.
I did run Interstates headed East cruising at a steady 65 for several days but I hate those roads! (Had to make time and get home)
The difference in performance was attention to tune up details, proper timing, TPS, vacuum leaks, engine compression, etc.
Mine too is an automatic. I've had literally dozens of VW's in my life (1950's to 1970's) and this is the best running VW that I've ever had.
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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wcdennis Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2004 Posts: 954 Location: Winston-Salem NC
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:07 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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I recently heard a Vanagon owner say, that after getting the ignition timing set properly, he can't imagine ever wanting to do an engine swap. Apparently, it made a world of difference to a Van he had been driving a while. |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Ahwahnee Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010 Posts: 9776 Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:46 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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'Peppy' is indeed a good adjective for how these drive when in a proper state of tune and allowed to use the full RPM range.
'Fast' and 'powerful' are not appropriate as there is just too much weight and drag and too little cc's to make that happen - but a peppy feel is possible.
Good to know that an automatic can achieve this - certainly in a stick one's driving style can do a lot to help the van perform at its best.
The Vanagon does remind me of a scouting report on a certain major league catcher. The report said his speed was "Deceptive... he's slower than he looks". |
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Waldi Samba Member
Joined: February 28, 2014 Posts: 1752 Location: Germany
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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My Syncro Sika with DJ 112hp has exactly 1500kg.
This drives not only "peppy". |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50260
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 8:31 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Back in 1989-90 when I was first looking at buying a Vanagon I couldn't believe how crappy every one I drove ran. Must have driven at least a dozen new and used and none could hold a candle to how my old Bay with an 1800 pulled away from a stop. The same has been true for most Vanagons I have driven since, yet each of mine once properly tuned has run very well, heck even my 83 1/2 with its original horribly abused 1.9 engine with close to zero compression would scream down the highway.
Just ran down US 395 on the back side of the Cascades and Sierras in my 83 1/2 now with a 2.1L and pulled the highest passes with minimal efforts. I would guess from Burns, OR to Barstow, CA I had to use third gear because of the grades for less than 10 miles total carrying a load of about 1200+/- pounds. |
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vanjoe Samba Member
Joined: December 25, 2009 Posts: 606 Location: Santa Maria
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 8:44 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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I am actually being serious with this question. Even though I do like the replies so far haha. I bought it a year ago and it has ran flawless. I don't drive it everyday like I was when I first bought it and haven't been able to drive it very much since July due to starting a business. However, when I do drive it, it amazes me every time. It sat for 4 years before I bought last November and did some of basics to it right away. The guy I got it from had no records due to it being his father who past away before it sat. I am pretty sure the motor had to have been gone through but I don't know how to tell. So any advise would be appreciated. Thanks I advance. _________________ 1990 VW Vanagon tin top weekender Carat
1998 Mercedes S420
"Why is there never time to do it right the first time, but there is always time to do it twice?"
"Back to the basics!" |
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jimf909 Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014 Posts: 7402 Location: WA/ID
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:18 am Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Congrats on having a well running van! It seems that you’re in a good place to benchmark it’s state of tune for future reference.
Start with a general inspection. My guess is that you won’t see or hear (intake, exhaust, etc.) many leaks. Note any items that will soon need maintenance. Start the to-do list. Next run some diagnostics: compression test, cooling system leak-down test, oil pressure test, note the timing advance, etc. Log this data for future reference when the van isn’t running as well.
How many miles on the van? As for what’s been done to it, have an experienced tech inspect it. The may be able to quickly (or not) tell if the engine is new, the heads have been replaced, etc.
Most important is to keep the van in its current state with pro-active maintenance. If you start seeing or hearing something unusual attend to it before it becomes “normal”.
You don’t say much about your previous vans that you compare this one to, but I wasn’t joking too much when I said they may have been running on three cylinders. As others have said, many Vanagons are worn out of spec, in a crappy state of tune or both. There may be nothing special about your current van other than it was maintained by the seller’s dad. _________________ - Jim
Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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mikemtnbike Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2015 Posts: 2780 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 1:26 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Proper timing and- placebo effect or whatever- running EFree have helped my van feel "peppier." _________________ 1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
2020 GTI SE manual |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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furrylittleotter Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2008 Posts: 1506 Location: West Seattle
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:06 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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What you Are experiencing is no doubt a performance boost due to a lean fuel condition. Don’t worry, the exhaust valves will probably destroy themselves on the next big, long hill you climb.
Neil2 |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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0to60in6min Samba Member
Joined: November 27, 2006 Posts: 3414 Location: OR & CA (Oregon/California)
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:51 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Did you empty your van recently? |
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Howesight Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2008 Posts: 3262 Location: Vancouver, B.C.
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Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:30 pm Post subject: Re: Why is my van so peppy? Not complaining just curious |
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Here's my theory about why your WBX seems so peppy and why there is likely a lot of variability from one WBX engine to another:
1. The MV 2.1 has only 90hp when everything is perfect.
2. When things are not perfect, like injectors with clogs or poor spray patterns, the decrease in horsepower can easily be 10 to15 HP or more. That is a lot of power in an engine with so little to begin with.
3. There is likely (just my theory) an unacceptable variability in the timing mark on the WBX pulley and also the indexing of the woodruff keyway in the pulley and the keyway on the crank itself. This means that many of us are not getting a true and accurate reading of ignition timing when attempting to set it. (This can be solved with careful checking of true TDC when assembling the engine or, if you are skilled, through the spark plug hole.)
4. Many people set spark timing the Bentley way rather than the total advance way. This, again, leads to insufficient spark advance.
5. Most mechanics not very familiar with the anti-knock character of the Heron-head WBX design are conservative in adjusting ignition timing, for fear of inducing knock. In most other old engine designs without knock control, this is a valid approach. Not so much in the WBX.
6. As vehicles that seldom see daily use, Vanagons often have mildly sticking valves. That causes compression leaks with attendant power loss. Similarly, disuse can allow and lifters to pumped down somewhat, reducing valve open duration. This also causes power loss.
7. There is a lot of variability in the breathing ability of different Cat Converters. _________________ '86 Syncro Westy SVX |
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