Rebuilding my dad's 1966 Sea Blue Ghia

[sputnick60]

[bobnorman]

[advCo]

[bobnorman]

Well, it’s been so long since I was last here, I’m not sure where to start again. As mentioned, I’ve been working away on my 1964 Squareback for the past two years, and while that project is not yet licensed, it is close, and at a point where I feel like retuning to my Ghia and showing her some love. So time to get the Ghia back down on all fours (well twos) and back into her rightful place in the centre of the shop.

The first order of business is to replace the transmission which I had robbed for the Squareback. I discovered that the one in it was shot, with a couple of damaged gears, so I permanently borrowed the one out of this project, as it was actually originally from a Type 3. Funny, I think I said somewhere a few pages back that I’d opt for keeping the Type 3 transmission, and if I changed my mind, I could end up using it in the Squareback. Prescient indeed.

So with the tranny missing from the Ghia, this past fall I started looking for options. I found in my stash of parts a ‘65 beetle unit, which I had started cleaning up, the final drive ratio was the same as the original 1966 tranny (4.375), and not the lower Type 3 (4.125) gearing that I’d wanted, but it’d have to do.

But then an old friend was landscaping around his property and had the rear half of a ‘68 Ghia chassis that he was getting rid of. It had been sitting there in the bushes for about 20 plus years. I figured I’d take it, and maybe use the side plate with the Bowden tube mount on it to replace the one that was broken on the ‘65, and give the rest of the case to a friend who is making an engine test stand. The chassis remains had been exhumed from its plot via backhoe, and with the help of my good buddy Matt, we managed to cut out the remaining bramble and load it into his truck.

After I got it home I hauled the transmission out of the chassis and managed to get the drums off. I was surprised to find that it spun quite freely and smoothly, and when I drained the oil it was surprisingly clean, with no sparkly bits or errant teeth. Also, I discovered that the 68 Ghia had a 4.125 final drive like the Type 3. What the hell, nothing ventured, nothing gained - I have decided to see if this thing might have a bit of life left in it yet.

So this is where I am at the moment. I’ve put the square under wraps and have the chassis once again front and center in the garage. The tranny is on a bench and I’ve cleaned the rust off the main shaft spline and gotten it to where the clutch now slides on and off easily. Currently I’m cleaning up a set of axle tubes given to me by another friend, as the dished part of one of the old ones was heavily scored and the tubes look to be almost rusted through near the cast ends.

I’ll continue on with that, get the transmission back in and the wheels on, and once back to where I was 2 years ago, I’ll move forward with tacking in the pan halves.
Then, and this is the part that I think about in bed at night, I’ll finally be able to get the body laid on the chassis to see how it all lines up before I fully weld the floors. Once that’s done, I should be able to tack the body back together and have something resembling a car again. Life and work are full up, so stay tuned with patience.
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[KGCoupe]

[bobnorman]

[bobnorman]

So, another small update. Been working away on the "bush" transmission. Took off the nose cone to clean up the hockey stick, replaced the rubber seal, paper gasket and put it all back together.

Had a few other issues that I had to deal with, as mentioned one of the axle tubes was pretty scored up, the other was almost rusted through, so I replaced them with another set. In fitting them, the driver’s side took 2 paper shims (which I gather is pretty normal) but the pax side took five! Seemed excessive, but that’s what it was. It has full movement, drops under its own weight with just a slight drag, but is also not floppy, so I’m calling it good. This transmission has the large O ring seals, which I supplemented with the smallest amount of RTV, so I’m hoping for no leaks. I used the one piece boots again, and they went on with no issues, using the boiling water/inside-out trick.

There was a small chunk of the transmission case that had broken off, I assume from years of ice freezing and expanding in the hole. No sign of leaking so I fashioned a new bit out of JB-Weld, and retightened the nut.

The cross shaft arm was a bit stiff, even after working on it a bit, and the inside circlip that holds it in place had lost its tension, so much so that when the arm was pulled, it would start to shift over. So to replace that little clip the whole thing had to come out, and to take the arm out the bushing had to go.

A bit of research on here told me that the bushing comes out to the left (toward the outside of the case). Understand that this thing has been exposed to the elements for the past 20 plus years - it wasn’t easy going. I did eventually persuade it to come out, but it’s in no condition to go back.

Bought an Empi bronze bushing and replacement shaft, the shaft is a little off center from the old one, so I think I’ll just replace the bushing and used the old shaft. Have the bushing in the freezer now, and will replace it soon. Meantime, I replaced the output shaft seal, and in doing so, found a bit of rust on the shaft where it meets the seal- That’s no good.

It’s in a hard place to clean up so I devised a way to rotate it with a drill while holding 400 grit around it. Seemed to work ok. So I installed the new seal. The part that touches the seal is nice and smooth anyway.

So with that, I decided to lift it into place and button it all up.

Had installed all new mounts, and had torqued everything down: mounts, spring plates, shocks, etc. when I noticed something missing…

I really didn’t want to haul it all apart again, so time to answer a question...Will this boot fit through this hole with the nosecone in place?

The answer is – Yes, with a bit of effort.
You have to loosen the front and rear mounts, and pry the transmission back slightly while jacking it to get the nose shaft centered in the hole, as when its all buttoned down it sits too close on the bottom to get the boot around it.

Then turn the boot inside out.

And push and pull it though the hole, it takes a bit of tugging, and I used some needle nose pliers to assist. Process was a bit of a pain, so no pics, but here it is after.

Then, right-side the boot, push it into place, and button it all back up again.

I didn’t search this, so I’m not sure if anyone has written anything about it here on the Samba, but it seems like the kinda thing that someone would have gone through before. Bottom line it can be done. All told took me 20 minutes.

I ordered new rear wheel bearings through Wajax (SKF). Got them yesterday, but noticed there are rubber or plastic seals on both sides, Wajax tells me it is the right bearing, I just have to pry out one seal. When I did that, I discovered that the ball bearings themselves are packed in grease, and are protected by a metal cage, not clearly visible like the old ones - otherwise they are the same, I'm assuming this is ok. Guess I'll try it and see. Hell, I don't even know if this transmission is OK yet...
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[bobnorman]

A question about bearings. I ordered some SKF6306 rear wheel bearings. They came with a number 2RS which I learned was a reference to two rubber seals which are on either side. When I prayed the seals off, I could see the metal race which covered the ball bearings. On the original there was a seal only on one side with a gap around it and on the side without the seal you can actually see the ball bearings.

Old one is on the left.

I think I’m ok to use this one, but I’m wondering if I should remove both seals, or leave the outside seal intact?
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[fes]

Six in one, half dozen in the other I think..
Some of these bearings with "seals" are actually acting as a cage to keep the bearings in place, But you have an inner race so you could remove both for the extra lubrication from the gear oil..
If you decide to leave one side of the seal on, I'd suggest leaving the open side towards the axle..They DO lubricate from both sides, but it makes more sense to me to have the open side exposed to the main source..There IS a seal on the OG ones right? or no?
Don't blame me if breaks tho
PS..I'm kind of surprised you didn't clean and repack the original ones
_________________
'68 Campmobile-Pedro
'15 Golf-Stella Blau
'56 Oval-The Turd (for now)

[EverettB]

[fes]

[bobnorman]

Thanks guys, The German ones that came out of it had a seal on one side and plastic races. The original is on the left in both pics.

I went with no seals.

Coincidentally, I noticed this posted in the Type-3 forum the other day. Same type of metal race that my new SKFs have.

Matt, I would have reused my old German bearings, but they both had a little hitch in them after I cleaned them with brake cleaner. Decided to not chance it.

Also, I went through an authorised SKF dealer (Wajax) for these rather than a Cipplier of VW parts (see what I did there?). Counterfeiting of bearings is a real issue these days, wanted to make sure I got the good stuff.
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[bobnorman]

Finally got the transmission back in, buttoned up, and wheels on. So, now I’m back to where I was two years ago.

Decided to finish the rear brake lines. I bought some nickle alloy tubing for the lines, much easier to work with than the steel stuff I was using previously.

Also, a few years back I posted asking about the length of the various lines. Got a couple responses from MellowYellow 74 (62 with dual master) and Evil_Fiz (70 – so rear section would be different from mine). I did a bit of additional research and developed a chart of the info collected. I circled the measurements I used in the pic below. I think it would be mostly correct, keeping in mind that the front section now has a dual circuit MC, and the rear now has long axles.

I also found a few reference shots of original lines here on the Samba, and used them as my guide for the shapes. I believe there’s a shot from Sputnik60’s ‘66, and the other is of a ‘67. To make the curves I used a stainless housing that my dad used to use, it allows for pretty smooth curves while preventing any kinking. I think this piece originally came from a B-17 bomber.

Used my handy flaring tool I bought a few years back. It’s made in the UK and makes a really nice flare. I like that it’s small too, good for tight spaces when you need to make a line on the car.

Here are the completed lines. I think they are pretty close to original shapes (keeping in mind the mods).

So that’s done, except for the main line which will have to wait until after the pan is installed. I tightened up all the conections, except those to the MC, as that will also have to wait until after the pan is in... Speaking of which, that’s up next.
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[bobnorman]

Decided to stop procrastinating and get back to the pans. Rather than picking up where I left off (driver’s side) I decided to start in on the passenger’s side pan. I really dislike the look and the pressing quality of the rear of these pans. The 66 would have originally had the earlier style anyway, so that’s what I’m going back to. I managed to get some of original the rear pax side, but very little from the rear driver’s remained.
This is the initial fit up.

I measured the distance between the bolt holes in bottom of the body in a couple places, and determined the width to be 53 7/8" plus or minus a 16th depending where you measured. Did a bit of math, subtracting the tunnel width, minus the lip, and then dividing by two, I determined the pans each needed to be 24 1/16 from the inner edge to the middle of the bolt holes.

So I cut them to 24 inches even - that should give me enough leeway for adjustments on the lip. With that worked out, I got a straight edge and cut the inner edge off.

Then I cut out the rear section.

And tacked on the remaining bit of the original.

Made the missing bit using the same cutouts for pressing the piece that I did for the other side a couple years ago. Not perfect but good enough for me.

Initial fit up seems ok.

Pressed the two recessed rib bits into it, and gave it a shot of primer so I could see it better. Final trimming and tacking of this bit is next.

I’ll also have to extend the pressed lip at the front a bit, and shorten some of the pressings where the inner edge was trimmed. That shouldn’t be too hard, I know others have done it, and I already have a press tool made for it.

Here’s how they both compare. Still some adjusting to do on the DS piece to make the position of it match, but it’s pretty close. Before I can install the pax side pan I still have a bit of work to do though. I have to remake the rear cross member that is missing altogether.

Slow going, but I am getting closer to getting these done and fitting the body, and that’s the main thing.
_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[bobnorman]

Well, time for another small update. I won’t jinx myself and say that I’m 100% back at it, but after a few months of sorting through mounds of collected junk, most of it non-VW, I am back at the Ghia.
First order of business was to take it down from the wall where it’s been chained up for a few years.

Instead of cracking in on the pans again, I decided to dig into the body a little. I took the front half out of the crate it’s been in for 10 years or so, just to see exactly what I’m dealing with here, and maybe help inform the alignment of the pans as well.

Had a look at the rear section, as there was some obvious filler in a few spots.

Funny how they seemed to (unsuccessfully) try to pull a dent in the rear quarter with a slide hammer, but ended up just covering it with a half inch of filler. There two layers of metal here, but I noticed in the wheel well that the inner panel was dented in as well, a couple smacks with a deadblow hammer and the whole thing popped right out. The only real issue to deal with there now is the puckers and holes left from the previous “repair”. There another section forward of this that also had thick filler, I’ve scraped that off but have yet to pop the dent out.

Thinking about the access I have here while split in half and separated from the car, and I’m going to do as much of the underside work, as I can now. I’ve been stripping off the undercoating and grease/dirt, by spraying it with a little kerosene first, and then scraping it off a day or so later after it softens. Seems to be coming off nicely, and I have to say, I’m amazed at how solid and rust free this thing is!

I’m also amazed at how little paint there was from the factory. The whole middle and rear is just primer with a little over spray.

If anyone is doing a concourse restoration and wants to see how the paint was applied in ‘66, this is a good reference. I think I’ll be painting it all though when I do it.

That’s my small update for now, not sure how fast my pace will be going forward, but I’ll keep slowly plugging away as life permits. At least I’m back at it again, and it feels good!

_________________
Air does not freeze. Air does not boil.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=289807

[sputnick60]

I'm glad you're back in the game
Nicholas
_________________
'66 Karmann Ghia Cabriolet...
'65 Porsche 356C Coupe...
2005 Mecedes Benz C180 Kompressor Estate
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

[Vladiiiii]

Good that you're back,

Now....about this, I wonder why does it look familiar...

[bobnorman]