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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:43 am Post subject: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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So my 71 bay project is coming along. It has a 911 flat 6 with 915 transmission fitted, air ride suspension and Porsche brakes but the one problem we have is that we can not run traditional cables for the hand brake so wanted to retrofit an electric handbrake like most modern cars have. I have found a few calipers with motors on them but need to find a control system.
Anyone got any ideas or experience? |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:38 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Shile its not an emergency brake....just a parking brake....have you thought about a "line lock"?
Ray |
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skills@eurocarsplus Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007 Posts: 16803 Location: sticksville, ct.
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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those systems are CAN and LIN bus controlled, unless you bypass it somehow. also tied into the ABS etc etc
I am using brembo's on a chevelle build now
http://www.brembo.com/en/company/news/brembo-electric-parking-brake _________________
gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
Jake Raby wrote: |
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
Brian wrote: |
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16923 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 3:03 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
Shile its not an emergency brake....just a parking brake....have you thought about a "line lock"?
Ray |
Line locks can leak. Had it happen on a 737 once. The aircraft rolled in the hangar and fortunately someone was nearby and threw some chocks down to stop it. Close call. _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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tommu Samba Member
Joined: November 15, 2011 Posts: 616 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:28 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Citroen's always had parking brake on the front wheels. Might make cable routing easier for you? _________________ |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22568 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:14 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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aeromech wrote: |
raygreenwood wrote: |
Shile its not an emergency brake....just a parking brake....have you thought about a "line lock"?
Ray |
Line locks can leak. Had it happen on a 737 once. The aircraft rolled in the hangar and fortunately someone was nearby and threw some chocks down to stop it. Close call. |
Happened on Lufthansa I think. Pilot wrote , " Bad taxi, almost Uber" into log _________________ .ssS! |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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aeromech wrote: |
raygreenwood wrote: |
Shile its not an emergency brake....just a parking brake....have you thought about a "line lock"?
Ray |
Line locks can leak. Had it happen on a 737 once. The aircraft rolled in the hangar and fortunately someone was nearby and threw some chocks down to stop it. Close call. |
Yep....that exact fear is why I have never used one.
I have actually seen a set up long ago on a full custom off road vehicle that used a second set of small motorcycle calipers for the parking and emergency brake. It was powered with a single circuit MC that was operated from a pushrod on the tail end of the hand brake lever.
It was ingenious. I could never figure out whether the owner did this simply because he had parts laying around and it was easy...or if there was no other way he could figure it out.
This was back in the 80's when there were a lot less cars laying around in junkyards with GOOD designs of twin piston calipers...with parking brake. The sliding single piston caliper has come a long way...greatly improved.
Ray |
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ivwshane Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 1920 Location: Sacramento ca
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:58 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Interesting! So its a solenoid driven cable pull. I wonder how or if it modulates...meaning can it just pull to lock or can you actually use it like an emergency brake during a total hydraulic failure....and apply partially to slow down. Ray |
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ccpalmer Samba Member
Joined: September 17, 2006 Posts: 3850 Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:09 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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dpetteng wrote: |
So my 71 bay project is coming along. It has a 911 flat 6 with 915 transmission fitted, air ride suspension and Porsche brakes |
Photos please!! _________________ '71 Westy |
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ivwshane Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 1920 Location: Sacramento ca
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
Interesting! So its a solenoid driven cable pull. I wonder how or if it modulates...meaning can it just pull to lock or can you actually use it like an emergency brake during a total hydraulic failure....and apply partially to slow down. Ray |
You've got me. Before this thread I didn't even know electronic brakes existed:o _________________ 77 westy 2.0 FI
69 ghia coup 1600dp
70 single cab |
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tristessa Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2004 Posts: 3992 Location: Portland, OR
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
Interesting! So its a solenoid driven cable pull. |
I can't speak to the E-Stopp product, but the electric parking brakes I've seen for mobility vans use a linear actuator to pull the cables. My old high school algebra teacher has one on his Econoline van, along with hand controls and a wheelchair lift.
Last edited by tristessa on Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:36 am; edited 1 time in total |
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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:24 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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So, in the UK, line locks are not legal for our MOT test (annual vehicle test). The rules for an MOT say it needs to be fully independent of the main braking system.
The problem is running cables from the cab via the big Bay pull handle so my thoughts are make it as simple "looking" as possible and run electronically. I first looked at the big cable actuator above but again, this takes lots of space where I don't have it.
This has brought me to using the calipers with integral motors of which there are a few choices but I need a way to control them as my engine ECU does not have a control function for this.
What would you like pictures of? |
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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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So does anyone know anything about control systems for electric handbrakes? |
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lil-jinx Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2013 Posts: 1109 Location: New Brunswick,Canada
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Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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I had thought that maybe a electric trailer brake controller could be adapted to your system, they use power to apply the brake,which would not be a problem for emergency stopping,but would drain your battery if used as a park brake.
We want pictures of everything ,your bus,your engine install ,transmission,brakes, we love pictures. _________________ https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy
1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes. |
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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:46 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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So, as a background, the van is my 1971 UK Bay camper. It had a minor restoration 14 years ago and we used it for 10 years for camping etc. Four years ago I got it to my restorer as we were moving to the states for a couple of years. Over the next two years it was worked on between other jobs, first on the list was to replace the hacked about roof with a sunroof version and add an engine hatch from another van (you will see why I need it later):
The biggest single job was finding a way to properly mount a 1985 911 flat 6 with 915 transmission AND fabricate a full front a rear air ride on a bay, quite a rare combination. I am not going to share too many pics as my restorer has done a lot of design work and wouldn't like it easily copied but we now have a 911 oil tank, engine and transmission mounted along with airbag air ride at the rear and a newly built front airbag beam from transporterhaus (custom made). In this time I have been collecting every exterior panel and have NOS versions for everything apart from the front panel which is a Gerson funky green panel. Still looking for a NOS left hand sliding door.
Last edited by dpetteng on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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lil-jinx Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2013 Posts: 1109 Location: New Brunswick,Canada
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Pictures locked up by photo bucket.
If you have an onboard air compressor for the air ride,could you use the air system to activate and release the park brake,a spring to put the brake on and air pressure to release it,much like a transport truck but on a smaller scale. _________________ https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy
1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes. |
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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:16 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Another unusual thing we are using is the POrsche aircon compressor on the engine to fill the air tanks. The MOT test will not allow air brakes on cars in the UK, hence trying to figure the electrical solution! |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16923 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:48 pm Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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Corona beer in the UK? Blasphemy I say! _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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dpetteng Samba Member
Joined: November 14, 2006 Posts: 353
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:45 am Post subject: Re: Electric hand (emergency) brake |
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aeromech wrote: |
Corona beer in the UK? Blasphemy I say! |
Not mine! |
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