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giddy up Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2017 Posts: 136 Location: BC
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:44 am Post subject: beginning painting |
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so i have had 3 quotes on painting my 69. all have come in around $7000CAN! i have removed everything sanded down the entire car ready for primer, removed all fenders, removed all rust filled all. the car is smooth and ready for spray filler and paint. blown away at how much it costs to get a paint job done. so.........im doing it myself. used to spray furniture for a living so i think it is something that i can tackle. testing my skills on the smaller parts first. gonna spend money on a new spray gun and paint and primer. figure i can save about $6K. i want to spray fill the car before i paint to remove all imperfections. any recommendations on a product that would work best for this?
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eyetzr Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2013 Posts: 1423 Location: Toronto, Ontario. Canada
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:36 am Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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Talk to your local paint store rep & tell him what you want to do. Most of these shops will get you lined up with all the materials to do the job. Try to keep all the materials compatible, some paints do not like some filler primers & sealers.
Get a different gun for spaying the primers on the car, you really do not want to have bits of prime coming out when you are laying down the paint.
Best of luck. _________________ I think he meant "rare", as in "not well-done" |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 17963 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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CUSTOM PAINTING by Tom Brownell will answer your bodywork/painting questions. _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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swharris Samba Member
Joined: September 10, 2010 Posts: 496 Location: N. Orange County
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:15 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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Mike Fisher wrote: |
CUSTOM PAINTING by Tom Brownell will answer your bodywork/painting questions. |
The first printing was June 1, 1965! Let's hope it's been updated? Products have changed significantly, but the basics are still the same obviously. |
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swharris Samba Member
Joined: September 10, 2010 Posts: 496 Location: N. Orange County
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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giddy up wrote: |
so i have had 3 quotes on painting my 69. all have come in around $7000CAN!
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When I restored my '69 bug in the early 90's I think I paid $700US. That was to fix all my horrible bodywork and paint it Zenith blue(I hated the '69 light blue). I know that was a long time ago, but wow that is 1k% increase!
Best of luck on your project. Are you shooting single stage or base/clear?? |
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giddy up Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2017 Posts: 136 Location: BC
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:55 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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swharris wrote: |
giddy up wrote: |
so i have had 3 quotes on painting my 69. all have come in around $7000CAN!
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When I restored my '69 bug in the early 90's I think I paid $700US. That was to fix all my horrible bodywork and paint it Zenith blue(I hated the '69 light blue). I know that was a long time ago, but wow that is 1k% increase!
Best of luck on your project. Are you shooting single stage or base/clear?? |
Not sure. I will contact a supplier and get their opinion as I’m a newbie. Would like to use a base and a clear I think. |
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swharris Samba Member
Joined: September 10, 2010 Posts: 496 Location: N. Orange County
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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[/quote]
Not sure. I will contact a supplier and get their opinion as I’m a newbie. Would like to use a base and a clear I think.[/quote]
The single stage will be a bit cheaper in product costs, as with the two-part you obviously have double the supplies. |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 17963 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:47 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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Acrylic Lacquer BC/CC sprays flat easy! Polishes out professional looking. Clear protects the paint from rock chips. Easy to spot repair! Never needs to be waxed just washed. _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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theKbStockpiler Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2012 Posts: 2316 Location: Rust Belt
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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:32 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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This may be redundant but it will make sure your head is in the right place:
I would practice on painting non showing and or interior pieces with Single Part paint to keep the learning curve easy.Two Part Paint requires a Fresh Air Respirator because there is no allowable amount to inhale. It's VERY hazardous!The less hassle the easier it's going to be.
If you can feel transition points in a body panel(like where filler has been used), you will certainly be able to see it once it is painted.Prep is the majority involvement in painting.
The paint has to thinned so the gun is capable to spray it without being too thick or too thin and the gun has to have the ability along with the correct nozzle to do so.
Your movement of the gun must also be so the layer is not too thick or too thin. Too far it dries on it's way there and too thick it will run.
My experience with a siphon gun is that if you don't have some 'Bounce Back' of the Spay;( the mist actually hits the panel and bounces back on you), the paint/air won't properly mix and give a smooth finish so you have to have enough bounce back. _________________ My beetle is not competing with your beetle. I have the yellow beetle in my town. There is a red one, a green one ......
Use all safety devices including a mask. |
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swharris Samba Member
Joined: September 10, 2010 Posts: 496 Location: N. Orange County
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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:13 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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theKbStockpiler wrote: |
This may be redundant but it will make sure your head is in the right place:
Two Part Paint requires a Fresh Air Respirator because there is no allowable amount to inhale. It's VERY hazardous!The less hassle the easier it's going to be.
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That is the case with any modern catalyzed paint. Single stage or two stage. It is the isocyanates in the catalyzed paint that is at issue. Use a supplied respirator when spraying anything with an isocyanate. |
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theKbStockpiler Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2012 Posts: 2316 Location: Rust Belt
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Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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The info I had was that Respirator Manufacturers would not put in writing that THEIR mask was recommended for isocyanates. I have heard of people using only a mask but it was not recommended and big shops won't spray it unless they have a booth and a Fresh Air Respirator.
Thanks for the correction on the One Stage with the hardener. _________________ My beetle is not competing with your beetle. I have the yellow beetle in my town. There is a red one, a green one ......
Use all safety devices including a mask. |
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giddy up Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2017 Posts: 136 Location: BC
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Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:08 am Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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so from all the comments and research this is what i think im leaning towards at this stage. please feel free to send your input. car is sanded to 150. think im going to spray with evercoat "slick sand". will be purchasing a gun with a 2.0 head for this as i have a better quality gun that i only want to use for final paint. taking evercoat to get properly shaken and applying coats until deadly smooth. going to get a single stage PPG paint and apply after completely wet sanded. i have a proper respirator so that is not an issue. my biggest most pain in the ass problem is trying to find the space to properly spray my car in my area. neighbours are getting cranky already from the work. the hunt is on for a space to work my magic. a question i have also is, if i apply a single stage paint, is that a done deal or can i choose to apply a clear coat if im not satisfied with the end result? looking forward to the next chapter
giddy up |
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eyetzr Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2013 Posts: 1423 Location: Toronto, Ontario. Canada
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Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:04 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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You may spray clear over the single stage. There are a bunch of things that you will have to watch for.
Compatibility.
You will have to completely sand the paint in order to get the clear to stick, if you do not sand it properly the clear will peel off in those areas. If you sand to hard the sand scratches will show through the clear.
As this is your first go at painting, stick to the single stage & wet sand as required.
I am sure others have tried this & may chime in with information. Cheers _________________ I think he meant "rare", as in "not well-done" |
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swharris Samba Member
Joined: September 10, 2010 Posts: 496 Location: N. Orange County
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Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:59 am Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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giddy up wrote: |
so from all the comments and research this is what i think im leaning towards at this stage. please feel free to send your input. car is sanded to 150. think im going to spray with evercoat "slick sand". will be purchasing a gun with a 2.0 head for this as i have a better quality gun that i only want to use for final paint. taking evercoat to get properly shaken and applying coats until deadly smooth. going to get a single stage PPG paint and apply after completely wet sanded. i have a proper respirator so that is not an issue. my biggest most pain in the ass problem is trying to find the space to properly spray my car in my area. neighbours are getting cranky already from the work. the hunt is on for a space to work my magic. a question i have also is, if i apply a single stage paint, is that a done deal or can i choose to apply a clear coat if im not satisfied with the end result? looking forward to the next chapter
giddy up |
Sorry to belabor the point, but by "respirator" do you mean this?
If so, that is not safe. If shooting Iso's you should at minimum have something supplying fresh air from outside your shooting environment. Some will tell you that if you are shooting is a modern downdraft booth with great flow, you are safe to use just a mask. The research does not support that though. Nitrile gloves and not latex are a must too as well as a full disposable hooded suit. http://www.bodyshopbusiness.com/your-lungs-your-skin-your-life/
If you've not visited Autobodystore.com, you should. Old and clunky site, but lots of fantastic information on painting. Good forum. Prices on products are really good too. I have no affiliation btw.
http://autobodystore.com/ |
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Al Huva Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2004 Posts: 81 Location: kelowna BC Canada
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Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:51 am Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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Seeing that you are in British Columbia and the Low Voc laws are in effect I would spray single stage that you can get at Napa or Lordco . If you go base clear most of the bases are water based and as I understand you may need different guns etc and then your clear is solvent based . As others would say pls spend the time getting the body super smooth as the B/C will show your imperfections while SS is little more forgiving. You may be able to find a paint store that has B/C solvent based Hope that helps Practice with the high build primer block it out get your technique down and then paint your beetle |
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theKbStockpiler Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2012 Posts: 2316 Location: Rust Belt
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Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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Hardener is bad Sh.t.
I'm using ZeroRust because it gets pretty hard without a hardener on everything except the visible exterior where it will get something different. It is significantly better than rattle can products even One Part Epoxy and Rustoleum Professional which is good. They advertise it as a phenolic modified alkyd. I have used it before, it's dries noticeably hard and is sticky like ink before it dries. They should have named it " Will Stick to Anything Paint'. You cant paint right over rust like they claim but it is a decent product. They also claim because it does not have a hardener,it's the safest ,hardest paint available.
I have sprayed Napa Enamel and the durability is not as good as factory paint but it is not bad. I think paint with hardener is overkill unless you are going to have to wash it all the time or is in a harsh environment like driving down dirt roads, parking lots, etcetera. There are a lot of expensive restorations that don't hold up to rust with Hard paint so I don't think it is better in that respect.
If you use the Waterbourne Based Paints , only the clear coat has hardener in it so you will greatly reduce your exposure that way. You have to use a clear coat though. _________________ My beetle is not competing with your beetle. I have the yellow beetle in my town. There is a red one, a green one ......
Use all safety devices including a mask. |
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eyetzr Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2013 Posts: 1423 Location: Toronto, Ontario. Canada
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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:48 am Post subject: Re: beginning painting |
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You can get low VOC solvent based base coat. The clear......well that is the ISO killer. Stick with the single stage low VOC & polish if you need. Respirators can be personal choice. I use a charcoal full face mask, but I only paint my own stuff now. I have a fresh air mask when I used to paint full time. You will need a separate compressor to feed a fresh air mask. _________________ I think he meant "rare", as in "not well-done" |
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