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Crouse the '72 Super Beetle Restoration
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:47 pm    Post subject: Crouse the '72 Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

So, first of all, a little bit about the car. I spotted this car on craigslist early June/late May of 2017 after previously looking at a '50s Ford around here and thought,"That looks neat and Volkswagens are cool so I'll think about it." Well, after about 3 weeks of thinking about it I finally drove up to take a look. Got there and it was a decent car, originally Californian so it had very little rust (Unlike most of the cars in Michigan), Engine had been rebuilt, front end repairs, and a few body panels replaced. It was in good enough condition that I could drive it around a little. After taking a thorough look at it I decided to buy it. I came back with the trailer and drove it home, it was neat as I was driving home I saw all the cars in the great race coming down the other side of the highway. So, anyway, that's how Crouse the bug came into my possession!

A little history on the name, I collect traffic lights (yes, you read that right) and one of my favorite brands of signals is "Crouse Hinds Co" and crouse means "Frisky or Lively" which sounds like a pretty good definition of a beetle to me.

Alright, enough of my rambling, here's the pictures of the car that I'm sure you want to see
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And the engine the way it looked when I got it.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


What it looked like last September.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


For those of you who are wondering this is (hopefully!) going to be my daily driver. It's going to be a mostly stock rebuild, no major engine modifications but there are a few things I'd like to do to make it look a little older.

This is my first restoration and my first car so please feel free to point out anything that I might be doing wrong or could do better, I won't feel insulted. This is a learning project and my goal is to learn how to do it right.

I'm currently waiting for paint to dry on my freshly rebuilt speedo so thanks in advance for any help/info that you guys give me, I'll be glad to hear anything you have to say!

P.S. I do have contacts with two local vintage VW shop owners who both have
large collections of engine and body parts plus I gutted a junk '71 super I found on Craigslist so I have a pretty good collection of and access to parts.


Last edited by SchoolcraftSignal on Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:00 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Fiddlestyx
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

All it needs is a little green paint somewhere and it will look like a traffic light. Very Happy
Grats on the car and have fun with it.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Seems like a good starting point.
How's it looking like now?

Just so you know, you have a '71 engine lid. The '72 has 4 sets of louvers. Being that those two are a one year only, you could probably find a '71 owner with the incorrect one to swap with.
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 6:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Fiddlestyx wrote:
All it needs is a little green paint somewhere and it will look like a traffic light. Very Happy
Grats on the car and have fun with it.


Actually, I'm planning on painting it green, some kind of a Emerald/Forest green (and yes, it's a traffic light color)

Thanks!

joey1320 wrote:
Seems like a good starting point.
How's it looking like now?

Just so you know, you have a '71 engine lid. The '72 has 4 sets of louvers. Being that those two are a one year only, you could probably find a '71 owner with the incorrect one to swap with.


Unfortunately I don't have any recent pics, but I'll try too get some soon! The chassis is stripped down to nothing but the bare bones. I've welded in new floor pans from WW and fixed the rusted out strut mount at this point. I hope to get it to the sandblaster soon!

I do know it's from a '71, but I'm just going to keep it that way. I'm not super picky about years or anything, you can see the red rear apron and orange front corner panel, those were both replaced before I got the car. I do have a second '71 deck lid if anyone needs it though.
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 6:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Here's a few more pics of the car.

Right after pulling it into the pole barn.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


An earlier pic of the engine with the little bike air filter installed.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Interior.
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Dashboard.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The restoration has been held up a little lately due to school and winter temperatures, but it's warmed up lately and I've got a little more time so there should be some more progress soon.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 7:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Tore it right off the pan didn't you! Lol Cool

Looks like a promising foundation for great project. Nice find for the Northeast. Smile
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 8:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

All right... A little update on the car.

First off, I tore into the "rebuilt" engine these past couple weeks and what do ya know, it's not really rebuilt that well! (what a surprise Rolling Eyes )

So, to begin it's actually a '65-'66, 1641cc, 45hp engine. This shouldn't surprise me since it didn't really look right for a super when I got it.

Next thing, when I got into the cylinders the first thing I noticed was that everything was black, black and oily. This is a mix of improperly seated rings and the carb running a bit too rich.

3rd, the heads are single port when they should be dual port for the size of the engine.

4th, one of the spark plugs was stripped out at some point and to fix this the PO drilled, tapped, and added a little bushing/sleeve thing which causes #2 spark plug to be recessed into the head and for #2 to run hot.

5th, and final, the sleeves (I forgot the technical term) which the valves ride in are all excessively worn and there is a large amount of "wiggle room" when you pull out the valves a little.

All these mistakes made by the guy who rebuilt the engine plus the fact that he sold it to a teenage kid who didn't really allow for a break in period after it was rebuilt gives me an engine which probably would have blown up except for the fact that it was only driven for less than 250 miles after the rebuild.

Hopefully this is the extent of the problems which I'll face on the engine. The nice thing though is that almost everything is OG German parts!

So, now my question is what should I do with this engine? Will the 45hp be enough to keep me going with the extra weight of the SB? Should I try to find a SB engine or stick with what I've got? Like I said before this is going to be a driver so I'll probably convert to a doghouse cooler.

Before I get finish off this post I'd just like to say that I am only 14 and this is my first car so bear with me here. So, any opinions on the above questions would be greatly appreciated. I'll try to post some pics tomorrow but I can't get anything more than what I've got now because the engine is with my friend who's looked at it and helped me figure out all this.

Once again, any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

SchoolcraftSignal wrote:
All right... A little update on the car.

First off, I tore into the "rebuilt" engine these past couple weeks and what do ya know, it's not really rebuilt that well! (what a surprise Rolling Eyes )

So, to begin it's actually a '65-'66, 1641cc, 45hp engine. This shouldn't surprise me since it didn't really look right for a super when I got it.

Next thing, when I got into the cylinders the first thing I noticed was that everything was black, black and oily. This is a mix of improperly seated rings and the carb running a bit too rich.

3rd, the heads are single port when they should be dual port for the size of the engine.

4th, one of the spark plugs was stripped out at some point and to fix this the PO drilled, tapped, and added a little bushing/sleeve thing which causes #2 spark plug to be recessed into the head and for #2 to run hot.

5th, and final, the sleeves (I forgot the technical term) which the valves ride in are all excessively worn and there is a large amount of "wiggle room" when you pull out the valves a little.

All these mistakes made by the guy who rebuilt the engine plus the fact that he sold it to a teenage kid who didn't really allow for a break in period after it was rebuilt gives me an engine which probably would have blown up except for the fact that it was only driven for less than 250 miles after the rebuild.

Hopefully this is the extent of the problems which I'll face on the engine. The nice thing though is that almost everything is OG German parts!

So, now my question is what should I do with this engine? Will the 45hp be enough to keep me going with the extra weight of the SB? Should I try to find a SB engine or stick with what I've got? Like I said before this is going to be a driver so I'll probably convert to a doghouse cooler.

Before I get finish off this post I'd just like to say that I am only 14 and this is my first car so bear with me here. So, any opinions on the above questions would be greatly appreciated. I'll try to post some pics tomorrow but I can't get anything more than what I've got now because the engine is with my friend who's looked at it and helped me figure out all this.

Once again, any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


Looks like you are on a good road. Keep doing what you are doing and you will figure it all out. Make sure to get a good book or two like John Muirs book. The internet has alot of resources but nothing like a detailed explanation from a book before you go searching I say.

Make sure to keep an eye out on this board and craigslist for OG parts that you can easily restore (like a correct air filter and so on.) I say the engine if put together properly should be plenty unless you are looking for a hot rod or whatever.

I have a stock 1600cc single carb and it gets me where I need to go. you can always add some dual carbs and those dual port manifolds should help her breath a bit more.

when I bought my car I had a PO (previous owner) do a helicoil in cylider three and that spark plug blew out on me about a month after purchase. 300 dollars later (bought stock heads from jbugs) and it wasnt too much of a pain. I recommend if you have the thing apart to try to get a replacement head if number 2 is messed up like you say. Good luck bud.
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Buggeee
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:51 am    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

You made me laugh truly when I read your age. I was your age when I dragged home my first vw and it was a flat window super duper too. Very Happy I'm like ancient now and one of my kids is your age and has a yellow flat window super sitting in the driveway to work on. Pulling the body off like that is really impressive and I would not have had the guts or skills back then. I wonder if I even do now!

"valve guides" I think

If you change heads for dual port, you'll be changing intake manifolds, etc. etc. Also if you are going from old style oil cooler to doghouse that's the cooler, fan shroud, etc. etc. The oil holes for the cooler inlet and outlet might be sized a little different too, based on the gaskets that come in the universal kit. Also the old style oil cooler was coupled to a distributor that slightly retarded the timing on the cylinder over there that is getting less air (running hotter) so I think its a different distributor for the doghouse cooler too. In my mind it seems easier to build the motor for what it is and just keep a look out for a stray later model motor in the meantime that already has all the fittings, etc. This one will certainly push the bug around just fine in the meantime.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Yes that single port will be fine.

You write like you’re a much older person. I mean that in the best way!

Good luck, we are here for you!
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

mikewilkinson007 wrote:
...You write like you’re a much older person. I mean that in the best way!

Good luck, we are here for you!


Hey, no big deal there, I prefer to write with proper grammar and spelling. As you can see I'm quite ambitious which has led me into plenty of situations where communication was important and it's a whole lot easier to get answers when people can understand you.

I've decided that I'm going to keep the engine single port. The current heads will get a valve job, mainly because of the wear on the valve guides (Thanks Bugee!) I've already got all the parts (except for a new head) and from the research I've done regarding SP vs. DP for a daily driver it really seems a SP will do better. (This is the thread I found the most helpful:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416141)

As for the Doghouse vs non-Doghouse I've decided I'll keep it as-is for now. If I find later that it needs it then I'll convert, but for now I'm going to keep it the way it is.

A few pics from engine disassembly:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Now, here's the pics of my problem. A friend and I have concluded that it's a mix of a rich carb and rings that haven't seated.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And, one last thing. I was looking at the block the other day and noticed this. It's a little hard to see in the picture, but there's a shiny grey blob of something right behind where the oil cooler mounts. Anybody know what this might be? It looks almost like JBweld, though I really hope that's not what it is. I'm going to look into it further tomorrow.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Looking forward to hearing input from everyone out there!
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Signal, only 14? Sure fooled me! Surprised It is refreshing to read a maturely and intelligently written post by such a young man! So many younger people puke out letters with their fast fingers and hit <enter> regardless if the words are correct or not (usually not); thinking also that grammar does not need to matter once outside the classroom or office.

I also agree that a single-port engine will be "sufficient" for your Super, as your first engine. Have you measured the diameter of the pistons? Most likely they will be close to 85.5mm, making the engine a 1600. If so, then a 1600 single-port was used on Standard Beetles in the 1970 model year and was rated at 57hp. The dual-port heads and larger carburetor which started for the '71 model year on both the Super and the Standard only produced 3 more hp. With the low miles after the initial rebuild, it is likely that many of your parts can be reused after a thorough cleaning and measuring. Also realize that in Europe, Super Beetles were available with the base engine which was a 1300, though a dual-port. Those were rated at about 52hp.

Do you intend to tear the engine down completely based on what you've already seen? That glob of grey goo may very well be JB Weld to close a HOLE in the engine case!

Here's a tip. Keep the lifters in the same hole in the engine case where you took them out. Reason is, that the lifter heads work-harden against the camshaft lobe and wear in together. When you open up the case without using a lifter holder, it's very likely that the lifters will fall out of their holes; thereby you lose track of the original positions. Do this to hold them in place:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I bought a $10 Husky 14-inch parts bin organizer from HomeDepot into which I can place all valve springs, valves, keepers, and lifters for one engine. Mark the compartments 1E, 1I, 2E, 2I...

Your interior looks to be in excellent shape. Remove parts very carefully if you need to so that they don't break. Original German parts are so much better in quality than most of the repros you can buy for cheap. For you, it appears you place much value on preservation rather than new purchase. Putting some effort into degreasing/shining up original parts is a worthwhile attitude and skill.

So you already welded new floorpans in?! Great. Where did you learn to weld, at your young age?

I can well imagine that you would consider painting the car yourself at home; not only because you'll save lots of money, but that you learn a new skill. Every mechanical experience after this car will improve your skill.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Welcome signal! You have me reliving my childhood right now. I was also only 14 when I purchased my first VW Bug. It was a 1955 I dragged out of a field in the dairy land of Chino California!

Totally awesome! You are doing great. Keep up the great work. How long have you been working on cars? You seem to have some wisdom that some people don't get - ever. That cylinder looks like it has an issue. It was missing for some reason. The exhaust valve looks like it never even fired! Wonder what went on.

Good luck and you have plenty of support here!


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Here's the answers to some of the questions I've been asked.

Rome wrote:
...Have you measured the diameter of the pistons? Most likely they will be close to 85.5mm, making the engine a 1600. If so, then a 1600 single-port was used on Standard Beetles in the 1970 model year and was rated at 57hp. The dual-port heads and larger carburetor which started for the '71 model year on both the Super and the Standard only produced 3 more hp. With the low miles after the initial rebuild, it is likely that many of your parts can be reused after a thorough cleaning and measuring. Also realize that in Europe, Super Beetles were available with the base engine which was a 1300, though a dual-port. Those were rated at about 52hp.

Do you intend to tear the engine down completely based on what you've already seen? That glob of grey goo may very well be JB Weld to close a HOLE in the engine case!

Here's a tip. Keep the lifters in the same hole in the engine case where you took them out. Reason is, that the lifter heads work-harden against the camshaft lobe and wear in together. When you open up the case without using a lifter holder, it's very likely that the lifters will fall out of their holes; thereby you lose track of the original positions. Do this to hold them in place:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I bought a $10 Husky 14-inch parts bin organizer from HomeDepot into which I can place all valve springs, valves, keepers, and lifters for one engine. Mark the compartments 1E, 1I, 2E, 2I...

Your interior looks to be in excellent shape. Remove parts very carefully if you need to so that they don't break. Original German parts are so much better in quality than most of the repros you can buy for cheap. For you, it appears you place much value on preservation rather than new purchase. Putting some effort into degreasing/shining up original parts is a worthwhile attitude and skill.

So you already welded new floorpans in?! Great. Where did you learn to weld, at your young age?

I can well imagine that you would consider painting the car yourself at home; not only because you'll save lots of money, but that you learn a new skill. Every mechanical experience after this car will improve your skill.


I did measure the pistons and they're 87mm in diameter. My guess is that the PO installed this: http://www.jbugs.com/product/31119806987AA.html or something similar.

I do plan on tearing down the engine the rest of the way. Now that I've discovered that JBweld-ish blob I'd defiantly like to know what exactly that's there for.

Thanks for the tip with the lifters! I'll make sure to keep that in mind. I usually use Ziplock bags and a filing cabinet to organize my parts. Label the bags with a sharpie and then sort them into the drawers of the filing cabinet (A drawer for Engine parts, Body parts, Electrical parts, etc.)

I'm trying to keep the interior as nice as possible, but while some things looked nice on the top the underside wasn't as nice. Like the carpet for example, it looked nice when I bought it but when I got it out it was moldy in some places on the underside and mice had been in there to. It didn't take long for that to get thrown out. The seat covers are aftermarket, so that's one of the reasons those are nice. I've still got plenty to be thankful for though! There's some interiors out there that look a lot worse than mine!

Yep, new floorpans are in already. I learned to weld from my robotics team. I was taught there and then our local mechanic let me borrow his MIG welder to use on the car.

I do plan on painting the car 'somewhat' at home. I'm part of another program at Gilmore Car Museum (Don't know if anyone's ever been there before, neat place but no foreign cars Sad ) and they have a really nice spray booth that I think I'll be able to use once I get to that point.

VW_Jimbo wrote:
Welcome signal! You have me reliving my childhood right now. I was also only 14 when I purchased my first VW Bug. It was a 1955 I dragged out of a field in the dairy land of Chino California!

Totally awesome! You are doing great. Keep up the great work. How long have you been working on cars? You seem to have some wisdom that some people don't get - ever. That cylinder looks like it has an issue. It was missing for some reason. The exhaust valve looks like it never even fired! Wonder what went on.

Good luck and you have plenty of support here!


Thanks! This wasn't really expected. This started because I had seen a '49 Ford for sale on the side of the road that I thought was neat. We took a look at it and it was neat, but definitely not an easy project, and I'm glad now that I didn't pursue that. Shortly after my mom had showed me beetles because she has always liked them. We were perusing Craigslist one night and happened to come across this car. There was a little conversation with the seller, we went out to look at it with my cousin who's restored a few beetles before and then after negotiating the price down a little more I ended up driving home with it!

To be honest this beetle is really my first time "working on cars." Before this I knew how to, I had just never actually worked on a car.

That exhaust valve is so clean because the entire engine only has about 200 miles on it since it was "rebuilt." That exhaust valve and the other (not pictured) look like they haven't been used because one was on cylinder #3 which runs hotter, and the other is because of that helicoil thing which made cylinder #1 run a little hot. At least this is my best guess.


Thanks for all the help so far everyone!
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:03 am    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Forgot to post this before. I've played around a little on Busselecta.com and came up with about what I'd like it to look like when I'm finished.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Please try VW. Java Green . My first car was a 1964 Java green beetle in 1967.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Something a little interesting today. I pulled out the fuel pump pushrod and spacer out today and look what I found!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I really don't know how this happened, I guess someone shoved it in too far and then the cam bent it? Now I'm definitely planning on splitting the case. I'm really hoping there isn't any more damage on the inside, from what I can see it doesn't look like it. There's just lots of globs of silicone because the PO used way too much sealant!

Well, hopefully there's not too many more unexpected surprises.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

I'll let someone with more experience than me make the final call, but I wonder if there was a mismatch between the rod and the fuel pump. The generator style fuel pumps take one length rod, and the alternator style fuel pumps take a different length rod. Sometimes people mix them up if they are not aware. Good luck on the results of your teardown! It will be enjoyable to see what is inside the heart of this robot. Wink It will be totally your's when you are done. A machine running on physics, magnets and mechanical forces (no chips or computer logic). Your peers will not have a reference for this in their life experience. Enjoy.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

Do not reuse that fuel pump base. That maybe one of those aftermarket ones that when they got hot, they would expand, enough to lock the rod in there. Looks like that happened.
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SchoolcraftSignal
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Crouse the '72 Super Super Beetle Restoration Reply with quote

That's my guess too Buggeee, they must have shoved it in and called it good!

VW_Jimbo, I don't plan on reusing that base. It's in four different pieces and quite brittle, but it is OG VW so I don't think it was a problem with it being cheap aftermarket.

Anyways, it got warm enough to do some work on the car, which means it got above freezing. So, here's some pics of the chassis as it looks now:

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Now, here's my welds. They're definitely not perfect, but they got better as I progressed. Part of the problem is that I drilled the holes for the spot welds a little too large which melted them out around the edge and some were a little too far over the lip of the chassis. Seat track welds turned out nice though!

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Also, I removed the padded dash because I'd like to convert to metal. If anyone wants an OG, not cracked dash pad then I've got one!

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A little while ago I found a bunch of '71 SB parts on Craigslist for $100. When I got there the owner told me he bought the car just for the engine and tranny for his Dune Buggy so I got to gut the rest of the car! The car itself wasn't in great condition, Bondo and rust everywhere, so I wasn't really worried about that. I got a pair of nice rust-free, dent-free doors from it though. Also got these nice OG chrome A-pillar guards, matching ones are on the doors too!

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