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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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 Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Stripped66 wrote: |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| Stripped66 wrote: |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
I jacked up the rear end and it turns over perfectly. |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| I went back out and turned it over with the key. It turns over by hand again. Just now it’s hard to turn. |
Your problem(s) sound a lot like you've been leaving your transmission in gear with the parking brake on. |
I do leave it in gear with the brake on when it’s parked. Doesn’t everyone? Can that cause problems? That would be news to me. Interesting. Thanks |
It can cause the exact problems you've described when you're attempting to rotate the engine by hand to check your valve lash... |
How so? Sounds like you mean if I leave it in gear with the brake on and try to adjust the valves? Like if I was ignorant? Or that by leaving it parked in gear with the brake on, it will act that way even when the brake is off and it’s outta gear? If that’s the case, I’d think most people wouldn’t be able to turn over their engines. It would be a common problem. Thanks |
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Dan Ruddock
Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012
Posts: 3594
Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:46 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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Try having someone push in the clutch when you turn by hand.
Dan |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:00 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Dan Ruddock wrote: |
Try having someone push in the clutch when you turn by hand.
Dan |
Already did that. Does anyone read these threads before commenting? I like to get all the info from a story before saying anything. I guess that’s not the way it works today. No wonder nobody knows anything anymore. Have a great day! |
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Stripped66
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2005
Posts: 3470
Location: Charleston, SC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:12 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
Like if I was ignorant?
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Yep.
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
The wheels don’t move when I’m turning it over in neutral or in gear by hand.
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Is this not a red flag?  How can this engine and transmission run just fine, but have no connection whatsoever between the engine and wheels when in gear while you turn the engine over by hand? So, either your crank is missing its woodruff key and/or the hub of the pulley is broken -or- you don't actually know whether your car was in gear or not in gear.
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| 66brm wrote: |
| Bodacious wrote: |
| Why not just make a custom set of wires with a Y splice in them. Then you could just run one distributor. |
I don't think electrickery works that way |
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Bock
Samba Member
Joined: September 18, 2004
Posts: 158
Location: Tennessee
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:16 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| People are trying to help you. After 4 pages of good advice, you are going to be the one who solves this issue...or your mexhanic. Start pulling it apart and let us know what you find. If its a buggy like your screen name then it shouldnt take you long. |
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Stripped66
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2005
Posts: 3470
Location: Charleston, SC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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BTW, this
| [email protected] wrote: |
| I've seen more than 1 engine where the #1 main bearing was so loose in the case, that the entire bearing and crank moved, and the crank cheek bound on the main bearing webs. It ran "OK", but it would bind when rotating by hand. |
plus very little clearance between the throw-out arm and pressure plate can give the impression that end-play is fine.
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| 66brm wrote: |
| Bodacious wrote: |
| Why not just make a custom set of wires with a Y splice in them. Then you could just run one distributor. |
I don't think electrickery works that way |
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74 Thing
Samba Member
Joined: September 02, 2004
Posts: 7391
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:30 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Pull out the engine-does it turn over fine then when it is disconnected from the tranny? If it does not then the problem lies within your engine. |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:52 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Stripped66 wrote: |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
Like if I was ignorant?
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Yep.
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
The wheels don’t move when I’m turning it over in neutral or in gear by hand.
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Is this not a red flag? How can this engine and transmission run just fine, but have no connection whatsoever between the engine and wheels when in gear while you turn the engine over by hand? So, either your crank is missing its woodruff key and/or the hub of the pulley is broken -or- you don't actually know whether your car was in gear or not in gear. |
As I said already, it he wheels don’t move when it’s turned over by hand. They do move when it’s turned over by the key. Plain and simple |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:57 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Bock wrote: |
| People are trying to help you. After 4 pages of good advice, you are going to be the one who solves this issue...or your mexhanic. Start pulling it apart and let us know what you find. If its a buggy like your screen name then it shouldnt take you long. |
I get that people are trying to help me. That’s cool. What’s not cool is the condescending from some people. I’m not cool with that. I’m also not cool with people talking to me like I’m an idiot. I don’t really care what it is. Doesn’t even matter to me really. Im gonna drive it till it breaks. When it breaks, I’ll take it apart and fix it or buy a new engine. That simple.
I just wanted to figure it out so other people that might run into this situation would have an answer and not run around like a monkey like most of you’s Want me to do. The internet is the worst form of communication and has made society and the people in it pukey. Some of yous are cool people that get it. Most of yous are common nothing’s. Sad but true. Thanks |
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TomSimon
Samba Member
Joined: January 13, 2004
Posts: 751
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:35 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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I'm late to the party on this, and I was going to ask "do you have the distributor out?" If the the distributor is out, the distributor drive will become partially disengaged and lock the engine when turned by hand, usually chipping the brass gear on the crankshaft. It's a simple novice mistake.
The distributor has not been removed, right?
It sound like you run it, shut it off, then put it in neutral and it's difficult to turn, like something is hanging up. Is that it?
As for the keyboard ninjas being condescending, the Samba pre-dates facebook, and most other car forums. I want to say I've been on here for 20yrs maybe? The moderators here are pretty permissive for the most part. It's a salty crowd in here. and for good reason, that I don't have time to explain. I'd never defend that, but I'd tell you to just expect it, here.
So put on your thick skin, ask your questions, be slow to be defensive (no one knows you or your experience afterall) just ignore the knuckleheads who woke up on the wrong side of the bead and have nothing constructive to contribute, and fix the problem at hand.
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2-time NASA Pro Racing Champion, Bonneville 130 Club and 150 Club Memeber, BRS Pro Gas racer |
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mikedjames
Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2012
Posts: 2743
Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:41 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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One thing that can make an engine hard to turn over is a hydraulic lock . More than a combustion chamber plus deck height of gas will stop it turning over. About 60 ccs of gas is enough.
Take the plugs out and with ignition off turn it over by hand. The jet of gas that comes out is suprising if you use the starter.
Did that with a T4 engine after a leaky ICT filled a cylinder overnight ..somebody had their head in the way. Not me....
If you have any Weber carburettor in the setup suspect it of leaking gas through the fuel metering valve .
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Ancient vehicles and vessels
1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.
1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy |
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Stripped66
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2005
Posts: 3470
Location: Charleston, SC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:15 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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Does this '66 have an Autostick transmission, or an automatic trans swapped into it?
If your transmission is in gear and the clutch is engaged, there is no way you'd be able to rotate the pulley and NOT see the wheels turn. Either you're not rotating the pulley enough to take up the backlash in the gears/slack in the drivetrain, or you've sheared the woodruff key/damaged the hub of the pulley.
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| 66brm wrote: |
| Bodacious wrote: |
| Why not just make a custom set of wires with a Y splice in them. Then you could just run one distributor. |
I don't think electrickery works that way |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| TomSimon wrote: |
I'm late to the party on this, and I was going to ask "do you have the distributor out?" If the the distributor is out, the distributor drive will become partially disengaged and lock the engine when turned by hand, usually chipping the brass gear on the crankshaft. It's a simple novice mistake.
The distributor has not been removed, right?
It sound like you run it, shut it off, then put it in neutral and it's difficult to turn, like something is hanging up. Is that it?
As for the keyboard ninjas being condescending, the Samba pre-dates facebook, and most other car forums. I want to say I've been on here for 20yrs maybe? The moderators here are pretty permissive for the most part. It's a salty crowd in here. and for good reason, that I don't have time to explain. I'd never defend that, but I'd tell you to just expect it, here.
So put on your thick skin, ask your questions, be slow to be defensive (no one knows you or your experience afterall) just ignore the knuckleheads who woke up on the wrong side of the bead and have nothing constructive to contribute, and fix the problem at hand. |
No sir. The distributor hasn’t been out recently. It hasn’t been spun without the distributor. It is a manual transmission bug. Not a dune buggy. A standard bug.
It truly doesn’t seem like anything in the engine. Crank pulley is fine. Woodruff key is fine. Endplay is fine. It purrs like a kitten and runs great! It’s gonna end up being something stupid. I truly believe it’s in the bellhousing. I don’t want to pull the engine unless I have to. I wanna drive it. And I do. It’s raining today so I can’t work on it. I’m a dude in the driveway. I don’t have a garage or shop. Thanks to all that tried to help. I appreciate your time and knowledge. |
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chrisflstf
Samba Member
Joined: February 10, 2004
Posts: 3442
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:16 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Quote: |
| It’s gonna end up being something stupid |
Its probably a cheap chinese ratchet that is broken internally and jamming |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:29 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| chrisflstf wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It’s gonna end up being something stupid |
Its probably a cheap chinese ratchet that is broken internally and jamming |
In real life, you’d be quiet as a church mouse. Facts. You’d learn respect real quick |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:22 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Looks like I found the problem. It looks like it dropped both valves in the #4 cylinder. Seems like the retainers came off. Now I have to pull the engine. Thanks to everyone who helped and their suggestions. |
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Pruneman99
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2012
Posts: 5013
Location: Oceanside
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| Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:35 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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Ah that sucks. Suprised it was running quietly.
Check all the valve keepers. The two halfs should not be touching. Many of them do and it chews up the valve until things get loose and come apart. |
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sled
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2005
Posts: 6179
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| Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:46 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| Looks like I found the problem. It looks like it dropped both valves in the #4 cylinder. Seems like the retainers came off. Now I have to pull the engine. Thanks to everyone who helped and their suggestions. |
then there is absolutely no way the engine was running and driving smoothly as you described.
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drive your split. |
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Old Green Buggy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2018
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:51 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| sled wrote: |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| Looks like I found the problem. It looks like it dropped both valves in the #4 cylinder. Seems like the retainers came off. Now I have to pull the engine. Thanks to everyone who helped and their suggestions. |
then there is absolutely no way the engine was running and driving smoothly as you described. |
It surely was and still is. |
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Stripped66
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2005
Posts: 3470
Location: Charleston, SC
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| Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:55 am Post subject: Re: Maybe you can help me solve a mystery? |
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| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| sled wrote: |
| Old Green Buggy wrote: |
| Looks like I found the problem. It looks like it dropped both valves in the #4 cylinder. Seems like the retainers came off. Now I have to pull the engine. Thanks to everyone who helped and their suggestions. |
then there is absolutely no way the engine was running and driving smoothly as you described. |
It surely was and still is. |
You're full of sh!t, and yes I'd say that to your face
_________________
| 66brm wrote: |
| Bodacious wrote: |
| Why not just make a custom set of wires with a Y splice in them. Then you could just run one distributor. |
I don't think electrickery works that way |
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