Author |
Message |
dylandran9 Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2018 Posts: 16 Location: california
|
Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:58 am Post subject: brakes |
|
|
I'm building a 74 baja bug what would be a good option for brakes descent performance and descent pricing? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dirtkeeper Samba Member
Joined: February 19, 2008 Posts: 3200 Location: Left of everywhere
|
Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 11:06 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
I have front disc brakes, ghia type, and recently put type 3 drum brakes in the rear. After fighting to get them bled properly, I also have a steering brake, often a challenge to get bled properly.
My braking is great. Feels really solid and balanced. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dylandran9 Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2018 Posts: 16 Location: california
|
Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 11:41 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
i want to go disk in the front for-sure but what brand should go with because i want decent brakes any recommendations? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
|
Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:09 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
what is the car and how will it be used. Race car disc brakes are expensive. EMPI disc brakes tend to break the centers out of the hubs when used offroad. We could use more info to help you.
Speed costs money. How fast can you afford to go?
And why are you so sure you need disc brakes? _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
YDBD Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2017 Posts: 890 Location: Bavaria, Germany
|
Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:52 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
This is a repost, cuz it makes sense:
Dale M. wrote: |
Suggest you get a copy of "BAJA BUGS & BUGGIES" By Jeff Hibbard (HP Books) to more acquaint yourself with many aspects of VW bugs and such...
Dale |
As I was reading it last night I was thinking..."hmmm, I should put front wheel cylinders on the rear to handle the big tires...$h!t, how much work is that..." _________________ '56 pan Dune Buggy since '69
don't live in the past...but when I did:
'67 bug
'64 baja
'60 dune buggy
'73 Personenkraftwagen Type 182 "Thing" |
|
Back to top |
|
|
earthquake Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2008 Posts: 3984 Location: SANDY VALLEY, NEVADA
|
Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:56 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
Ghia front breaks actually weigh more then stock drum breaks, I had a post years ago where I posted it, here's the link..
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=322750&highlight=disk+brake+weigh
Now I think the disks are better brakes and not have to adjust them all the time is nice
Casey _________________ 74 CLASS 11 LOOK-A-LIKE
69 DUNE BUGGY
79 INTERNATIONAL SCOUT II
05 SCION XB SERIES RELEASE 2[#437]
95 Chevy C3500 dually
98 Ford E150
Link to Kelly J. Nolte 3/20/53 - 11/6/08
https://time-zonelabs.blogspot.com/p/about-kelly.html
DEATH TO CHINGERS!
[From a military recruitment poster in the novel "The Stainless Steel Rat" By Harry Harrison] |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dylandran9 Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2018 Posts: 16 Location: california
|
Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:47 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
about 500 for just front |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Vanillagurilla Samba Member
Joined: November 21, 2017 Posts: 1061 Location: California
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mal evolent Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2009 Posts: 2912 Location: San Antonio, Nuevo Mexico
|
Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
mine is all VW: Ghia front rotors, Type 3 calipers, Type 3 rear drums, Type 3 master cylinder
the parking brake works, and it's lawyer proof, all VW bits, just the best of VW brakes _________________ 73 Beetle Baja, Ghia front brakes, Type 3 rear brakes, 2220 ( 94 X 80 ), Weber Progressive, Bosch SVDA, '97 Mustang seats
Baja Bugs for Volkswagen Virgins: Index |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dylandran9 Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2018 Posts: 16 Location: california
|
Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:09 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
well i was thinking v6 honda with a bus box, I've looked into jamar I've looked into saco brakes and ive looked into latest rage brakes latest rage i know has good parts usually but i am not sure any reviews? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
|
Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:13 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
Good luck with a bus box with a Honda V6. My buddy has had one with that setup for many years. Great. But it eats LOTS of Bus boxes. I suggest you should be thinking more on the lines of a Mendeola. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Terryrayw Samba Member
Joined: May 21, 2018 Posts: 3 Location: FL
|
Posted: Mon May 21, 2018 4:32 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
I got the disk brake conversion kit from Fisher buggys in Tampa. That's what I use on the front brakes with a proportioning valve. And then Wildwood breaks in the back |
|
Back to top |
|
|
craigman Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 2397 Location: redding
|
Posted: Mon May 21, 2018 5:55 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
Anything more than stock is an improvement. Stock brakes suck. Period. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
|
Posted: Mon May 21, 2018 10:00 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
craigman wrote: |
Anything more than stock is an improvement. Stock brakes suck. Period. |
IF you are using the car for road racing on a high speed course with tight turns. Then ...yeah, stock Bug drum brakes suck. If you have a 700hp LS engine in a 5,000lb buggy...Then ...yeah, stock Bug drum brakes suck.
But if either of those are your deal...Why are you on the Samba HBB Offroad forum?
If you have a tube frame buggy with a 1600 Bug engine the you use on desert or forest trails, or other typical offroad VW based buggy or Baja, then stock VW drums should work pretty damned well. EMPI disc brake kits weigh about as much and some more than stock Bug drum brakes. There are race brake systems for such applications that work better. that cost a hell of a lot more than VW drum brakes. They will lock up the wheels on most buggies nice and tight so you have NO control of the car as soon as you touch the brake pedal. Kind of like having an ON/OFF switch for the brakes. With very large tires and/or a very heavy Baja, they aren't too bad. There are some race brakes for micro stub hubs and for combo spindles that work nice, for a price.
If you're talking about brakes for use on the street...Why are you posting about them on the offroad forum?
Speed costs money. How fast can you afford to go? Or stop for that matter. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mal evolent Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2009 Posts: 2912 Location: San Antonio, Nuevo Mexico
|
Posted: Tue May 22, 2018 9:03 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
cost = ( HP after / HP stock ) to the 3rd power
reliability = 1/ ( HP after / HP stock ) to the 3rd power _________________ 73 Beetle Baja, Ghia front brakes, Type 3 rear brakes, 2220 ( 94 X 80 ), Weber Progressive, Bosch SVDA, '97 Mustang seats
Baja Bugs for Volkswagen Virgins: Index |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
|
Posted: Tue May 22, 2018 11:29 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
Not sure all of the readers will understand that math Mal.
But I, for one, DEFINITELY AGREE with it.
Mal's math for Dummies:
[not trying to say anybody is stupid...just trying to state it in more plain language]
As horsepower is increased from stock, the cost is increased at a vastly higher rate. Double horsepower = 4x the cost.
As cost is increased, reliability is reduced the same way cost increases. If it's double the cost, it's likely to be 4 x as unreliable. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
Last edited by dustymojave on Tue May 22, 2018 6:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
craigman Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 2397 Location: redding
|
Posted: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
I think that's the new Common Core math! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Vanapplebomb Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2010 Posts: 5389 Location: Holland, MI
|
Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 8:43 am Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
craigman wrote: |
Anything more than stock is an improvement. Stock brakes suck. Period. |
Anything more than stock to a point is an improvement. It is VERY VERY easy to have too much brake on the front in particular. I actually reduce brakes on the front...17mm vs stock 22mm cylinders.
As for the stock brakes sucking...not really. What is so bad about them? If you can lock up all four wheels, what are bigger brakes going to get you? Your limiting factor is traction at that point. Stock drums/backing plates are often lighter than common aftermarket disks/calipers...so no real advantage there either unless you spend over a grand for really high performance brakes. Which again begs the question, what good is it to spend a grand on brakes when you can use stock parts and lock up your tires?
Just my $0.02. Others can disagree with me, and that’s fine. Valid arguments on both sides of the table. It’s like the type 1 vs type 4 engine debate...Valid arguments for both at the end of the day. _________________ 1800 Type 4 Berrien 295
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021 |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
|
Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 4:32 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
I agree with you entirely Vanapplebomb. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
craigman Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 2397 Location: redding
|
Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: brakes |
|
|
Guess I've just been unlucky with brakes. In over 25 years of playing with vw's, i've yet to see a bug with stock brakes be able to lock up the brakes and skid the tires. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|