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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:34 pm Post subject: Think i fried my bug |
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Ok so..... Im a vw newb and have recently bought a 1972 w/1600cc engine and old coupe front nose kit. Thing has ran fine untill i made a stupid mistake. While showing my brother we were looking @main wireboard under front trunk. Then it happened like this" hey an un plugged wire. Hmm better plug it in anywhere it fits. Well when i went to start it an hour later it sparked and smoke was rushing in the cab thru the vent next to gauge cluster. All i know now is there NO POWER TO NOTHING and only 2 wires have burned up/melted themselves apart near the junction mother board ,whatever its called. Anywho HELP ME PLEASE this little bug is my daily driver/rat-project and i know nothing about bugs or electrical( beside bada$$ stereo systems-so i understand fuseable links,inline fuses and the sort) i need to figure this out myself cause. Great litle car till i was a moron and i need to fix it quick.do i just replace wire that burned or should i check fuseable link areas? Did i fry my battery? Im lost and not sure where to go from here |
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calvinater Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2014 Posts: 3327 Location: 802 The Pointless Forrest
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:43 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Unplug that wire and fix the melted ones. _________________ "Albatross"! |
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hanksjim1 Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2014 Posts: 87 Location: PNW, USA
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Post a picture of the damage so the experts can weigh in...
at a minimum:
#1 - burnt wires will need to be repaired and routed properly.
#2 - fuses need to be proper size and replaced if blown.
More repairs may be necessary.
You can download the owners manual to see fuse box listings here (assuming yours is still stock) :
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/72bug.php |
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andk5591 Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2005 Posts: 16757 Location: State College, PA
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:56 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Go NOW and buy How you keep your VW alive by John Muir. This is not a new car and things are NOT plug and play. Totally different from what you are used to. You need to educate yourself on what you have so you have a clue of what you are doing or sell the car and buy a Honda.
What is nice for you is that being a 72, the fuse panel is relatively easy to get to. And once you CAREFULLY remove and vent ducting (if needed) the switches, etc are fairly easy to get to. You do have wires running under the steering column to the turn signal switch and ignition switch. I don't remember off the top of my head what style you have on a 72.
Something else that is helpful to know for any future posts is whether its a Super or Standard. If your spare tire sits upright in the very front, its a standard. If the spare lays flat, then its a Super.
Now as mentioned - yeah figure out what wires are melted and replace them with at LEAST as heavy a gauge wire as you are replacing.
What sucks is that your wiring harness runs along the drivers rocker to under the rear seat and then back to the engine compartment.
Something else that would be helpful is a decent pic of the wires you smoked and the wire you had connected. _________________ D-Dubya Manx clone - 63 Short pan,1914.
Rosie 65 bug - My mostly stock daily driver.
Woodie 69 VW woodie (Hot VWs 7/12).
"John's car" 64 VW woodie - The first ever
Maxine 61 Cal-look bug - Cindy's daily driver.
Max - 73 standard Beetle hearse project - For sale
66 bug project - Real patina & Suby conversion
There's more, but not keeping them... |
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67rustavenger Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2015 Posts: 9753 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:59 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Your new. Welcome to the samba.
That said. Plugging a loose wire just anywhere is an IDIOT move. Sorry to be harsh. But man, come on!
Look at the wiring diagram above and figure out which 2 wires you have burned up.
Make sure to replace them with the correct gauge wire.
Also before there's any more damage done. Disconnect the battery while fixing the damage.
Good Luck. _________________ I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!
There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Sorry guys ive tried to upload pics and keeps telling me file too large. Ill keep tinkering |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:30 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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72krautrod13 wrote: |
Sorry guys ive tried to upload pics and keeps telling me file too large. Ill keep tinkering |
where are u in Arkansas _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:32 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Mid-state. hot spring county |
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Dark Earth Samba Member
Joined: December 22, 2015 Posts: 1054
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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72krautrod13 wrote: |
Sorry guys ive tried to upload pics and keeps telling me file too large. Ill keep tinkering |
The pic must be no larger than 1600 x 1600 and must be a jpeg. I resize my pics in Microsoft paint to 1600 x 900. _________________ My Build: '69 Baja - Dark Earth Version
~I'm almost done. I just lack finishing up.~ |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:57 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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72krautrod13 wrote: |
Mid-state. hot spring county |
Sorry too far
if closer to NW Ark I would have fixed it for you in 15 minutes _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:58 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Think i figured out pic problem. Pretty much best pics of meltdown aftermath i could get
And a pic of the car
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:03 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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sb001 wrote: |
72krautrod13 wrote: |
Mid-state. hot spring county |
Sorry too far
if closer to NW Ark I would have fixed it for you in 15 minutes |
That's fine would you be available for a little back and fourth forum coaching me on fix? Im great at following point by point directions,if you feel you could fix it with ease then maybe i could fix with your knowledge and direction |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:17 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Whixh wire was the unplugged one and where did you plug it back in?
It looks like a lot more than 2 wires melted! _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:31 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Honestly was complete idiot move. No ideas what wire was for. But. It was a female end in the middle of the one wire like an acc. Or something. Plugged that into what im sure was a ground/male end bolted to body right behind speedo....and it was a blue wire nothing happened till i tried to turn engine over.. Im figuring it was a hot wire and grounding it was assinine to say the least. That wire got red-hot melted on to another wire,and a whole different wire coming out of the white rectanglular wire plug cluster melted itself in two. By the time i got. Trunk lid open it seemed the worst had allready happened .all i did was grab wire i plugged in and ripped it off of where i put it. Then silence. No power to anything. When before the wipers worked even with Key off. Problems of buying a project not knowing what chaos previous builder had created lol |
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Phat73 Samba Member
Joined: July 05, 2018 Posts: 95 Location: Victoria BC
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:49 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Hey welcome to Samba. Some pretty hard ladies on here. Nice lookin little hot rod ya got there. Hope it all works out for ya.
If you can't fix it with a hammer you probably have an electrical problem.
Keep us informed. _________________ I succeed because I fail. |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:22 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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Your wiring at the fuse box looks off a bit as well, makes it harder to diagnose.
Do you have a multimeter or voltmeter to test for power flow? _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:24 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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No but can probly get a biker bro to bring one by w/some wire and such |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:05 pm Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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I need to be sure which thick red wire is the one bringing in constant power to the fuse box, that's why we need the voltmeter.
I've labeled the fuses here 1-5, that should come into play for power to the ignition, and then out to the coil.
There SHOULD be a thick red wire plugged into #4 fuse labeled here, that would be constant 12 volt battery power coming in to your fuse box to power a few things that should receive power without the key on, like emergency flashers, parking lights, dome light etc. Then there should be a metal bridge between that fuse and #5 fuse, to send power straight over to #5 fuse without actually going through a fuse (all this stays on the UNFUSED side of the fuse box.) Then there should be another thick red wire coming off #5 fuse, going to your ignition switch to supply power there. It looks like your #5 fuse wire is completely toasted (is that the other part of it next to the red wire with white stripe?) But I'm not even sure that's the correct wire- it looks too thin--which is why I say your wiring looks messed up at the fuse box.
From the ignition switch, threre should be a thinner solid black wire coming back into #2 fuse that supplies power when the key is in the ON or RUN position. Then from there another metal brdge over to #1 fuse, where another solid black wire comes off the unfused side (so doesn't go through a fuse) and goes to your coil in the engine bay.
Remember ALL this power flow stays on the UNFUSED side of the fuse block, so it really shouldn't matter whether you have any blown or missing fuses- technically you should be able to pull every fuse in the box and the car should still start if wired correctly.
So... let's look at the picture above-- you have a thick red wire going into #1 fuse that should not be there. I'm not sure where this wire is coming from/ going to. And I don't see a black wire coming off #1 fuse, which there should be for your coil wire. #2 fuse appears to have the correct black power wire (from switched ignition) coming in, but that yellow/ black wire coming off #2 should be coming off #3 along with the other yellow/ black wire (this is KEY ON ignition power for your headlights.) #4 fuse-- can't even guess. This is where the thick red wire should be coming in from your battery, but as you can see whatever melted wire that is seems WAY too thin to be correct. And then, #5 fuse should be another thick red wire going out your ignition, but whatever wire is on there is toast.
Is that thick red/ white wire attached to fuse #3? My guess (and I DO mean "GUESS"!) is that the red/ white wire is your battery power coming in to the fuse box, that should be attached to fuse #4... but this is why you need a voltmeter to confirm. The thick red wire attached to #1 fuse could be your output wire to the ignition switch that should be attached to fuse #5, but I am not sure (and if it is, then there would have to be some sort of jumper wire between the red/ white wire and and that wire, to supply it battery power.) And then I have no idea which wire is your wire to the coil, unless it's that melted one coming off
See, it gets awfully complicated to try to diagnose just by looking at photos. If I were actually there, I culd figure it out and fix it pretty fast. Anyway I hope maybe this can help some. _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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72krautrod13 Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2018 Posts: 15 Location: AR
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Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 3:56 am Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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sb001 wrote: |
I need to be sure which thick red wire is the one bringing in constant power to the fuse box, that's why we need the voltmeter.
I've labeled the fuses here 1-5, that should come into play for power to the ignition, and then out to the coil.
There SHOULD be a thick red wire plugged into #4 fuse labeled here, that would be constant 12 volt battery power coming in to your fuse box to power a few things that should receive power without the key on, like emergency flashers, parking lights, dome light etc. Then there should be a metal bridge between that fuse and #5 fuse, to send power straight over to #5 fuse without actually going through a fuse (all this stays on the UNFUSED side of the fuse box.) Then there should be another thick red wire coming off #5 fuse, going to your ignition switch to supply power there. It looks like your #5 fuse wire is completely toasted (is that the other part of it next to the red wire with white stripe?) But I'm not even sure that's the correct wire- it looks too thin--which is why I say your wiring looks messed up at the fuse box.
From the ignition switch, threre should be a thinner solid black wire coming back into #2 fuse that supplies power when the key is in the ON or RUN position. Then from there another metal brdge over to #1 fuse, where another solid black wire comes off the unfused side (so doesn't go through a fuse) and goes to your coil in the engine bay.
Remember ALL this power flow stays on the UNFUSED side of the fuse block, so it really shouldn't matter whether you have any blown or missing fuses- technically you should be able to pull every fuse in the box and the car should still start if wired correctly.
So... let's look at the picture above-- you have a thick red wire going into #1 fuse that should not be there. I'm not sure where this wire is coming from/ going to. And I don't see a black wire coming off #1 fuse, which there should be for your coil wire. #2 fuse appears to have the correct black power wire (from switched ignition) coming in, but that yellow/ black wire coming off #2 should be coming off #3 along with the other yellow/ black wire (this is KEY ON ignition power for your headlights.) #4 fuse-- can't even guess. This is where the thick red wire should be coming in from your battery, but as you can see whatever melted wire that is seems WAY too thin to be correct. And then, #5 fuse should be another thick red wire going out your ignition, but whatever wire is on there is toast.
Is that thick red/ white wire attached to fuse #3? My guess (and I DO mean "GUESS"!) is that the red/ white wire is your battery power coming in to the fuse box, that should be attached to fuse #4... but this is why you need a voltmeter to confirm. The thick red wire attached to #1 fuse could be your output wire to the ignition switch that should be attached to fuse #5, but I am not sure (and if it is, then there would have to be some sort of jumper wire between the red/ white wire and and that wire, to supply it battery power.) And then I have no idea which wire is your wire to the coil, unless it's that melted one coming off
See, it gets awfully complicated to try to diagnose just by looking at photos. If I were actually there, I culd figure it out and fix it pretty fast. Anyway I hope maybe this can help some. |
This should help and confirms my thought abkut thin blue wire being a "hot"wire the red n white wire looking like going to #3 ill have to look when i get home from work but i think it just goes under fuse box. I'll keep you posted on what i figure out. Thank you forbyour explanation. It appears i might not have destroyed bug just caused a stupid reaction from a stupud mive. Thanks again ill post what prigress i make this evening |
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sb001 Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 10406 Location: NW Arkansas
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Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:36 am Post subject: Re: Think i fried my bug |
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72krautrod13 wrote: |
This should help and confirms my thought abkut thin blue wire being a "hot"wire the red n white wire looking like going to #3 ill have to look when i get home from work but i think it just goes under fuse box. I'll keep you posted on what i figure out. Thank you forbyour explanation. It appears i might not have destroyed bug just caused a stupid reaction from a stupud mive. Thanks again ill post what prigress i make this evening |
Just to help out a bit further-
there is no factory blue "hot" wire, VW wire color codes were as follows:
Solid red or red/ white (30 terminals): Constant 12 volts from battery (receives power all the time)
Red/ black (50 terminal) wire: starter wire from ignition switch (receives power when key is in START position)
Solid black (15 terminal): Switched ignition power (receives power when key is in START or RUN position)
Brown (31 terminal): GROUND wire (ALL VWs used solid brown as ground)
Look at the wiring diagram 67rustavenger posted above, it is very easy to follow as it is laid out in the same shape as the car, should help you figure out what goes where and possibly which wire you connected up wrong. _________________ I'm the humblest guy on this board.
1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor |
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