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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:58 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Brian - whom were you running from when parked, her father? or Husband? _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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JimmyJagged Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2016 Posts: 88 Location: San Juan Capistrano, CA
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Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:15 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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It appears I was way off thinking it was in the clutch system. I was thinking metal-on-metal sound. Sound has been clarified to be from air/wind.
My next guess was going to be alternator belt, but that has already been identified as not the problem. Also, I would think that Robbie would have indicated it was the fan, or in the fan housing, when others brought it up. So I think that's not it.
Perhaps a rubber cap came off of a manifold nipple or a tear in the manifold boot?
It is not a squirrel.
It is not a cat.
It is not the clutch.
It is not the cap.
It is not the belt.
Nor a SGKent nascar jack.
I'm currently stumped. I'll take my bus out this evening for a cruise to see if I can think of anything. But I would prefer to join Big Emma for a beer and scuba diving in Cozumel _________________ Current:
1971 Tin Top Weekender Bus
1973 Squareback
1985 Pop Top Weekender Vanagon (my 19yo son's first car. father/son project)
1985 Pop Top Weekender Vanagon w/ 2.5 Subaru
Past:
1976 Rabbit diesel (my first car). RIP. totaled by drunk driver (not me!)
1973 Pop Top Westfalia Weekender Bus. RIP. Blown engine due to 25yo ignorant of VW maintenance (me).
1986 Vanagon Transporter. RIP. totaled by drunk driver (not me!)
1987 Vanagon Syncro. I never should have sold. |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Quote: |
Nor a SGKent nascar jack. |
damn. That looked so good too. I could almost see Robbie dragging that jack.
Maybe he left his nitrile gloves and they are wrapped around the pulley
_________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12722 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:05 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Alright folks, thanks for being patient. Some of you are on the right track, and many good questions were asked this week.
The game was sort-of-solved on Thursday, but I wanted to take time and thank everyone for excellent suggestions and diagnostically relevant questions.
The most diagnostically efficient flow chart when dealing with noises on a Type 1 engine:
Step 0: Go back and check your work. What was the LAST thing you did to the car?*
Step 1: Hold clutch pedal down for a few seconds, engine in neutral.
Step 2: Rev engine and listen for change in noise relating to RPM. Do this clutch in and out.
Step 3: Cut engine in neutral and coast when it is safe to do so (power brake buses will need extra effort to stop after the first pedal press.) Noise gone?
Step 4: Remove belt and run engine briefly, revving it up and listening for noise.
Here we would stop, as the noise would be gone. If, in future VW exploits, the noise continues, reinstall belt and…
Step 5: Remove oil cap and use hose or stick your head in the engine bay and listen for noise in crank case. You'll hear a lot of clicking from solid lifters, and maybe some cam gear rattle if your assembly was lazy.
Step 6: Check engine end-play.
*Remember the oil change? The one on a windy day where this blew into the engine compartment and got sucked into the fan causing a whirring sound?
So far we've covered fuel system, electrical system, and engine, so next week will be another section of Bentley.
Robbie
--
I want to reiterate that these threads are not intended to be answered by expert mechanics. I am happy to spend a few hours each week creating scenarios and responding to people who really want to learn and participate, but it's a tremendous waste of everyone's time when someone experienced chimes in with the answer halfway through a round of diagnostic questions. _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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babysnakes Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2008 Posts: 7107
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:13 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Funny shit right there. A couple of years ago I had a whirring sound. Took a day or two to figure it out. Pulled the engine and a Post-it-note was stuck in the fan. Must have got sucked through one of the vents while on the highway. Don't know how else it could have got in there. |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12722 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:20 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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babysnakes wrote: |
Funny shit right there. A couple of years ago I had a whirring sound. Took a day or two to figure it out. Pulled the engine and a Post-it-note was stuck in the fan. Must have got sucked through one of the vents while on the highway. Don't know how else it could have got in there. |
Yeah, this one happened to me last month, and I think if I was a new owner, I would been scared to death! Bummer you had to pull the engine!
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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JimmyJagged Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2016 Posts: 88 Location: San Juan Capistrano, CA
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:25 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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I never, ever would have thought of that.
I learned 2 things:
Oddities can be sucked into the fan housing and a six step diagnostic flow chart.
Looking forward to the next episode. _________________ Current:
1971 Tin Top Weekender Bus
1973 Squareback
1985 Pop Top Weekender Vanagon (my 19yo son's first car. father/son project)
1985 Pop Top Weekender Vanagon w/ 2.5 Subaru
Past:
1976 Rabbit diesel (my first car). RIP. totaled by drunk driver (not me!)
1973 Pop Top Westfalia Weekender Bus. RIP. Blown engine due to 25yo ignorant of VW maintenance (me).
1986 Vanagon Transporter. RIP. totaled by drunk driver (not me!)
1987 Vanagon Syncro. I never should have sold. |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12722 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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JimmyJagged wrote: |
Oddities can be sucked into the fan housing |
Yes! This is a tricky subject, because you can't see it on a Type 1, and even reaching back there is tricky. On a Type 4, if you run the factory fan guard, you would never have caught the object, and it would block cooling flow and roast your engine, and you would never know without a CHT gauge. For this reason, I never ran the fan guard on my '76 bus. _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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babysnakes Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2008 Posts: 7107
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Quote: |
and you would never know without a CHT gauge |
I run a CHT gauge, that was a vital clue to the issue. Temps were running higher than normal. Once fixed temps were back to normal. BTW, it's a '72 with a 1600 upright conversion. Oh more vitals, it's Kansas Beige and Pastel White to help with the diagnostics. |
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22727 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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asiab3 wrote: |
Alright folks, thanks for being patient. Some of you are on the right track, and many good questions were asked this week.
The game was sort-of-solved on Thursday, but I wanted to take time and thank everyone for excellent suggestions and diagnostically relevant questions.
The most diagnostically efficient flow chart when dealing with noises on a Type 1 engine:
Step 0: Go back and check your work. What was the LAST thing you did to the car?*
Step 1: Hold clutch pedal down for a few seconds, engine in neutral.
Step 2: Rev engine and listen for change in noise relating to RPM. Do this clutch in and out.
Step 3: Cut engine in neutral and coast when it is safe to do so (power brake buses will need extra effort to stop after the first pedal press.) Noise gone?
Step 4: Remove belt and run engine briefly, revving it up and listening for noise.
Here we would stop, as the noise would be gone. If, in future VW exploits, the noise continues, reinstall belt and…
Step 5: Remove oil cap and use hose or stick your head in the engine bay and listen for noise in crank case. You'll hear a lot of clicking from solid lifters, and maybe some cam gear rattle if your assembly was lazy.
Step 6: Check engine end-play.
*Remember the oil change? The one on a windy day where this blew into the engine compartment and got sucked into the fan causing a whirring sound?
So far we've covered fuel system, electrical system, and engine, so next week will be another section of Bentley.
Robbie
--
I want to reiterate that these threads are not intended to be answered by expert mechanics. I am happy to spend a few hours each week creating scenarios and responding to people who really want to learn and participate, but it's a tremendous waste of everyone's time when someone experienced chimes in with the answer halfway through a round of diagnostic questions. |
That'll teach ya to make sure you never leave the paper towel you wiped the dipstick with to check oil level in the engine bay. _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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78BusGA Samba Member
Joined: February 01, 2017 Posts: 315 Location: Buford, Georgia
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Having pulled the engine a dozen times on my '72 Superbeetle, and replacing the alternator 3 times, I had early thoughts about the fan shroud and fan though I wanted to see what everyone was going to pull out of their hats first. I wanted to hold off in case the differing systems in the type 1 bus case had a slightly different options for investigation than the standard dual port late beetle construction. _________________ Few will understand the passion and majesty, among the nuts and grease.
Tom H.
My '74 Super 1303 thread - https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764902&start=60
My '78 Kombi Bus thread - https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=769385&highlight=
'72 Superbeetle (retired), '78 Bus Kombi 2.0FI, '74 1303 Superbeetle |
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Amskeptic Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2002 Posts: 8568 Location: All Across The Country
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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asiab3 wrote: |
On a Type 4, if you run the factory fan guard, you would never have caught the object, and it would block cooling flow and roast your engine, and you would never know without a CHT gauge. For this reason, I never ran the fan guard on my '76 bus. |
??
You want the fan guard. It is easier to pluck the paper towel/plastic bag off the guard than pick it out of the fan blades or extricate the shredded remains from the flap linkage.
Guard? Yes, at all times.
Colin _________________ www.itinerant-air-cooled.com |
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Koeppler Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011 Posts: 481 Location: Aging gracefully
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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What did we miss? What happened to Air-Schooled Games 4, 5, 6? |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12722 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Koeppler wrote: |
What did we miss? What happened to Air-Schooled Games 4, 5, 6? |
I’m on tour... no games while we work 60 hour weeks and drive 650 miles every day off!
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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richparker Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011 Posts: 6982 Location: Durango, CO
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 6:31 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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asiab3 wrote: |
I’m on tour... no games while we work 60 hour weeks and drive 650 miles every day off!
Robbie |
Comedy!!!
Who are you following on tour, Manfred or Colin???? _________________ __________
’71 Westy build
Adventure thread
’65 Deluxe Build
’63 Deluxe Build |
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Wasted youth Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2012 Posts: 5134 Location: California's Hot and Smoggy Central Valley
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Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:02 pm Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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This shit is real. From August of 2017:
Wasted youth wrote: |
Wildthings wrote: |
...The one advantage I have heard for the ring is that it is much harder for the intake to be completely block by a piece of paper or plastic. Hopefully this is something I will never get to test. |
When I was 13 my older brother thought it would be super convenient to keep a stack of bi-fold paper towels in the engine compartment of our '69 bus.
That was not a good idea after all. |
But he knew within a few minutes of hearing it. There is nothing subtle about a stack of bi-fold towels engaging the fan in a Type 1. |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22668 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:50 am Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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Friggin Millennials - they get another job and they quit the last one..
When I was your age, I had six jobs.
Im going to go watch Matlock... _________________ .ssS! |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12722 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:06 am Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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richparker wrote: |
asiab3 wrote: |
I’m on tour... no games while we work 60 hour weeks and drive 650 miles every day off!
Robbie |
Who are you following on tour, Manfred or Colin???? |
Top Dead Center. They’re a Grateful Dead cover band that does valve adjustments every morning.
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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TomWesty Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2007 Posts: 3482 Location: Wyoming,USA
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:16 am Post subject: Re: The Air-Schooled Games - 3 - newbies only! |
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asiab3 wrote: |
richparker wrote: |
asiab3 wrote: |
I’m on tour... no games while we work 60 hour weeks and drive 650 miles every day off!
Robbie |
Who are you following on tour, Manfred or Colin???? |
Top Dead Center. They’re a Grateful Dead cover band that does valve adjustments every morning.
Robbie |
I know you’re making that up. A Grateful Dead cover band would never remember to do valve adjustments..... _________________ If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music! |
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