Get hold of the US car history from abroad

[BenneGu]

Hi all,

I own a VW Type 1 which was exported as new to the US from Germany. It was re-exported to Sweden in 2010 where it is now. I would like to find out it's history in US (previous owners, in which state(s) it's been registered, maybe any inspection history...). I have the VIN number. The car also has a aluminum sign from Department of Transportation California where a "replacement VIN number" has been added to the door main frame. I guess it means a salvage upper body has been mounted on the old chassis?

The number is the same as the VIN number under the back seat.

I searched sites like DMV but they require US social security number or similar. How can I get hold of the car history from abroad ( non US citizen)?

Any tips are more than welcomed! Thanks in advance!

[EverettB]

I don't know if the CA DMV gives out previous owner information due to privacy laws here but you could try emailing them directly instead.
Other people may know more...

The replacement VIN number usually means the car was stolen or wrecked ("salvaged title") or otherwise lost it's original VIN tag somehow so they assigned a new number.
For instance, I used to own a VW GTI where it was stolen and the VIN tag was removed. It had the replacement tags.

I can't recall ever seeing one where it matched a real VIN under the back seat though.

It does not necessarily mean the body and pan are not the original matching parts, although that is always possible with any old VW.
It's definitely less likely to be a replacement pan if it's an original and long-term California car.
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[BenneGu]

Thanks Everett!

The VIN on the tunnel is verified as the originsl of a type1 which was in fact exported to the US. So I,m pretty sure the VIN, which is identical to the "replacement VIN" added at the door, is the originl one for the pan.

I however just recently discovered the car was sold as a limo (stated by VW own records) but it is now a cab. As it looks very original, my theory is that the old pan was matched with the body of a wrecked cab (maybe rusty pan?), to build a cab, also adding the beams below the pan.

It was perhaps mandatory to have a matching VIN on the body too, to get it registered/inspected as a cab. I have a copy of a "VIN assignment" paper by CA DMW where the original VIN is stated. It is from 2007.

Does this make any sense to you? I would love to find out if this is true or not. I really like the car, it is in mint condition and until now nobody had the slightest suspision it once was a limo... even after visiting several VW veteran meetings. Maybe I will try to call them as you suggests.

[KTPhil]

The word "limousine" in American English means a lengthened luxury car, hardly applicable to a stock Bug. In other languages, it just means an enclosed car with at least two rows of seats, though typically with 4 doors.

I wonder if a translation issues really is the source of the term "limo" for your Bug.

Or is this actually a stretched car? You mentioned "adding the beams below the pan." Can you post up a photo? (top and bottom sides)

I have an old Motor Trend article from 1970 with a $35K Bug that was a true limousine, custom built but using original VW body and interior parts so it looks "factory" even though it isn't. I'll try to find it tonight and post a photo or two.

[hitest]

limousine = simply a passenger car. If I recall, it was written on one of my past BCs- from VW back in the 90s for a '60 convertible I had.
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[EverettB]

[KTPhil]

Here goes (click to open picture, then click again to enlarge).
A new Bug's original price in 1970 was listed as $1839. The limousine is about 20x that!

[KTPhil]

[BenneGu]

Hi again,

Many thanks for the input. We have some translation issues, from German to Swedish to English...very sorry.

Acc to VW own records the car was exported as body LIM as limousine, which is in fact just a normal hard top / sedan type 1, even if the word suggests something else. I have double checked it again.

It was at some point converted to a cabriolet (the term used inb German/Wwedish) or as you say convertible.

The plate you copies in is exactly the same design as I have. The word "replacement" perhaps indicates that it replaces a lost or missing plate, and that it is not enough with the VIN number under the seat. At least in Sweden you need 2 plates like this to pass inspection.

What I'm curious about is when it was converted and maybe why (accident, stolen....). The only thing I know for sure is that the car arrived as a Sedan to the US in 1973, a new VIN plate was added in 2007 and it was exported to Sweden in 2010 or 2011 and arrived as a convertible.

Are there any online or e-mail based services where some info can be obtained? Thanks again!

[KTPhil]

Thanks for clarifying!

I suspect the California DMV will be of little help. They are so overworked & unmotivated that you won't get anywhere.

We can only guess why it was converted. Body swaps often follow accidents, and by 2007 there weren't many VW wrecking yards left to go shopping for a matching sedan body. It may have offered an excuse to make a convertible, which the owner may have fancied.

[BenneGu]

Thanks to you all, I really appreciate it. Trying to find the way through authorities is hard enough in your own country, so trying to get help from DMV from Sweden is then probably a bit too unlikely. Are there any commercial services where you can get this info, for a fee?

I now managed to read the name of the owner at the time the replacement VIN was applied from, thanks to an old DMV receipt from that time. Seams like he is still listed on the same street address! Can't get hold of phone number from here, do you know how to do that for a CA citizen (I have full name and a street address?).

Getting back to the car, I have noticed that the body carries no sign whatsoever of the original color, just 2 other colors plus the one recently added in Sweden . Again a sign of the body being replaced?

That explains why it looks so "convertible original", it is, kind of. The home-made convertibles (basically Sedan with cut roof) I have seen are very different. I guess it is possible to add the beams to the pan too.It sure looks original to me but I'm no VW expert yet. 2 photos of the car are attached. Any further suggestions on how to track the history or the owner and the car are very much welcomed! Thanks!

[EverettB]

[Mos6502]

If you have their name, and know which city they are in, try finding them on facebook. I found the second owner of a car I bought from an estate sale this way.

[KTPhil]

Would you care to post just the City name?

There might be a Samba member nearby. You could then offer to have the Samba member and the prior owner meet, perhaps at the local DMV. Neutral territory. Sort of James Bond-ish but it would protect the privacy of that prior owner and let him decide if/where/when to meet to talk. Privacy is paramount to many here in California (and elsewhere), and so a process that leaves the prior owner in control is best.

[vwracerdave]

There is no method in the USA where private citizens can track the history of any car. The DMV has privacy laws and do not allow fore access to private information. If the car changed ownership 2-3 times no records are kept of past owners. If your original VW was in an accident and the body was changer or repaired that there are no official records kept here in the USA.

Your only hope as to what it was from the factory would be to get a birth cirtificate from VW.
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[Erik G]

The most likely story is the car had a rusty pan, so the owner replaced the pan with a hard top pan. It happened all the time, and there is no difference in hard top or convertible pans. the added rails are part of the body. He wanted his numbers to match should he get pulled over by an officer, so he went to the DMV and they added that tag

You will not get any owner history from the CA DMV. Sorry. Too many weirdos stalking celebrities

[BenneGu]

Update!

I managed to track down the last US owner, and sent him a letter. He was friendly enough to reply, but had little info to contribute with, he only owned the car for a few months, and had no records of previous owner. Dead end.

I also contacted DNV by regular mail, and they replied by e-mail, surprisingly fast too! They tell me there is a form INF70 I need to fill in. The problem is I have to attach a fee with a US check. I ask for some alternative as a non US citizen cannot send US checks, but there is to my surprise no option (like card, cash, bank transfer). This is a link to the form https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/?1dmy&urile=wcm:path:/dmv_content_en/dmv/forms/inf/inf70

Questions to this fantastic forum:

1. Any idea how I can do this payment from Sweden? Maybe someone can be the middleman for me?

2. Based on the replies above, some say I won't get any info from DNV, other say I will. Before trying to send the form, I need to understand if there is any point doing so. I'm not interested in private details of owners. I like to figure out when/why my car was re-built from a Sedan to a Convertible. In Europe, that would mean some mandatory paper work and a safety inspection, which would trigger a report with the authorities (like DNV). How would it work in the US / California? When I read the form I get the impression it will only give me ownership history, maybe vehicle status is not saved in the US? Can someone with better US English "authority"language skills please read it for me...?

Thanks in advance! Love this forum!

[16CVs]

There is NO way that someone converted a sedan into a convertible. The changes are major.
Body supports underneath, Roll down windows in the quarter panels, unframed doors with exposed glass, different vent window. Lack of grill at the rear below top. If you look inside you find extra supports in the foot wells.
Someone may have swapped a pan or VIN, but no way did anyone put that much work into a sedan to make it a convertible.
I'd be happy to middleman this for you. Unlike in Sweden, peoples public address's and phone numbers are under lock and key.
I don't understand why people blur their Lic numbers when there is nothing you can do with the info.
Ii know in Sweden, you just fill out a form and you can get any info you want.

Stacy
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[VW1948]

Hi,
Nice looking car.

If the chassi is a "real" convertible chassi then the VIN should start with 15, if not then the chassi is from a sedan. The chassi from a sedan will fit a convertible body without any changes.

I would say that most likely so have your car had a body replacement.

[BenneGu]

Hi all, returning to this thread again, with one additional question for this exceptionally useful forum!

By now all "facts" point towards that my convertible body once-upon-a-time had a different chassis. A rainy day the chassis was considered beyond repair and a sedan chassis was found and fitted with the beams. The VIN of that chassis is what I now have both on both the chassis as well as on the "replacement VIN plate" that was fitted to the body in 2007 (at door post).

I bought a VW certificate and know the chassis was build in Germany in July 73 and shipped to the US, and it probably has the original engine too. But I know more or less nothing about the body (which is the soul of a convertible!)

Question: Would a Karmann convertible body (1973 or newer) have the original VIN number on any other location than in the small slot on the dash, just at the lower end of the front window? I have the slot for the number but it is empty (or erased ).

If I had the number, I could trace both the chassis and the body. From the curved front window we can tell the Karmann body is -73 or newer. Yes I know that some parts (front fenders, plate below rear bumper, front bumper) is -75 or newer but these where fitted recently in Sweden, so of no help.

Will be happy to provide more details if anyone know what to look for...I would love to hear about a hidden VIN somewhere.....added by Karmann on the body itself. Or maybe some body detail unique to a certain year.

The car is what it is, just love it, but knowing its history would be a great bonus! Theories or facts, anyone?
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