Help Needed

[Smoothdaddy707]

Hi there,
I'm a college student with a '76 VW Beetle I got from my grandpa. I have had very little experience with cars prior to this point, but I have enjoyed working on this fun little car however I am having some issues. So, I decided to join this site to see if I could get any 'expert' help.


So here's the situation:

I bought this 76 Beetle from my grandfather who lived in washington and it had not driven for several years (we assume it had been about 10 years or so). ALSO, an important fact about the car to keep in mind is that the original fuel injected engine had been converted to a carbureted engine. I currently live in colorado and towed the car out here at the end of June to where I attend college and have been working on it since.

In about a month I had replaced the starter, starter bushing, ignition coil, spark plugs, plug wires, and valve cover gaskets and she fired right up! I then adjusted the ignition timing and drove the car around periodically for about a month until one day I decided to drive it a short 15 minutes to work and it began to run really rough in idle. I managed to get it back home, but have not been able to get it to ignite since.

I tried a few things to get the engine running such as:
- switching to bosch plugs from NGK's
- performance EMPI 409 Spiro Pro Race Wires from Duralast wires
- New 34 pict 3 Carburetor
- Electric distributor
Unfortunately, I did not realize that the electric distributor is not compatible with fuel injected engines so it fried that distributor. So, I tried putting my old distributor with the vacuum advance back on, which was working before but unfortunately none of this has been able to get it running. When I attempt to start it, the engine will turn, but it will not ignite and it smells of gasoline. I thought maybe it was the fuel pressure regulator or a leak in the fuel line, but I checked the hardline and the Softline and they are both fine as well as the fuel pressure regulator is still getting gas into the carb.

With my afore mentioned limited knowledge which I have only acquired since having this car, my thoughts were the following:
- The spark plugs are not compatible (maybe wrong gap size?)
- Plug wires aren't compatible
- Carburetor isn't tuned properly
- The electric distributor fried the ignition coil (although I tested the plug from the ignition coil to the distributor and I still got a spark)
- I had to re-wire the connection from the ignition coil to the carburetor because the one on it broke and maybe the gauge wire I used was wrong/would affect that

Any help at all in diagnosing the issue would be very heplful. And if pictures or any additional would make it easier, let me know. Thanks!

[67rustavenger]

To me it sounds like you have a grasp on the very basics.
That said. Are you certain that you have the firing order correct? When you change distributors. The firing order can be different from one to another.

I fired a new engine just yesterday and found that I had the firing order incorrect. Straightened that out and the engine fired right up.

Set the crank pulley to TDC(Top dead center). Remove the right valve cover and check the #1 cylinder valves. If you have the engine at TDC for the #1 cylinder. The valve rockers will be loose and wiggly. If one is stiff. Rotate the crank pulley 360° to TDC again and recheck the rockers.

That verified. Look at where the rotor is pointing. forget the notch in the distributor body. It just confuses folks. Where the rotor is pointing is TDC for the #1 cylinder if you have done the above described procedure correctly. Place the #1 spark plug wire there and proceed counter clockwise around the distributor cap 1-4-3-2.

Do this and report back on your success.

Good Luck.

Oh and welcome to the samba.
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[Starbucket]

When you turn the key on do you hear a "click? from the carb solenoid the replacement wire you hooked it to? Has to click! Sounds like the carb has crap in it (they are from China now with no quality control). Pictures help.

[Deebs]

[Pruneman99]

What side of the coil did you hook up to the idle cut off and the choke?

[Cusser]

[67rustavenger]

[Wayne S. Johnson]

Reverse rotation, 1234. I think I can remember that?
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[gt1953]

The smell and odor of gas means it is getting part of the equation of what you call ignite. So you have fuel and air but the spark is what is missing, or may be present but at the wrong time. So check for spark next.
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[Starbucket]

Set rotor on #1 and remove valve cover and see if you can wiggle #1 rockers, if not you are 180 deg off.

[David_nc_72std]

If possible, please post a picture of the engine, particularly the distributor and ignition coil area, maybe someone can spot something wrong.

Not quite sure how the electronic distributor was incompatible with a FI engine, at least in a way that would burn up the ignition module. More likely you wired it wrong, or it was defective.

As was mentioned, verify the position of the rotor when the #1 cylinder is at TDC on the compression stroke, that can be different on different types/brands of distributors.

Also verify that when you replaced the wire from the ignition coil to the carburetor, that it goes to the same terminal on the ignition coil as the power feed from the ignition switch and the fused wire to the backup light (terminal #15). Unless you have a tachometer, terminal #1 on the ignition coil should have only the wire to the distributor.

The initial problem of running rough at idle sounds more like either a vacuum leak or debris in the carburetor, ignition wouldn't be my first though if it works fine above idle.

[Volks Wagen]

....and there's also the possibility of the condensor being shite.

Try eliminate something. You got spark from the coil to the distrib centre wire. Check to see if the spark is also present at the plugs. If that's OK, then you have spark and by the smell of gas, probably gas too. Now u need timing and compression.
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[Smoothdaddy707]

First off,
Thank you all so much for your help! So I finally had some time to check most of what you all have suggested as well as added some pictures to hopefully help you help me out.

So, I had the firing order right to begin with and even went through to double and triple check that. I also tried pulling out all of the spark plugs to see if they had spark and this is where I had an issue. None of the plugs are getting a spark. I even tried reverting back to the old spark plugs I had (which still worked when I took them out), as well as going back to the old distributor cap (which also worked when I switched them out), and changing out the points on the distributor. Neither of these possible solutions were getting a spark to the plugs.

I didn't have a chance to check the valves, but it was running fine before and I had checked all of this before I first started it. The only difference I have noticed is I am no longer able to try to adjust the timing by using a test light connected to the connection from the coil to the distributor it will not light up no matter what anymore. Any thoughts on that?

Again, thank you all for the help![/img]

[Deebs]

http://www.speedyjim.net/htm/eng_strt.htm

This is a great guide to solve what you are describing. If you don't have a compression tester that is fine. Just be sure to verify you feel a "tight" spot twice per revolution of the crank.

No spark and no test light from the coil points to an electrical problem (possibly a loose connection).

Tell us what you find!