| Author |
Message |
mcrum4421
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2018
Posts: 104
Location: Nashville, Tn.
|
 Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:30 am Post subject: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
 |
|
| I am only able to find power at 2-3 fuses in fuse panel. Specifically the last 2, #11 and #12. I get additional power at #7 with ignition key on. Where should I start ? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
sjbartnik
Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011
Posts: 5998
Location: Brooklyn
|
| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Start here:
(click to enlarge)
You can see from this diagram that only 2 fuses are powered directly by battery. Another 3 fuses are powered only when key is on.
The rest are basically for various other circuits (lights etc) and won't be powered unless those devices are turned on.
_________________
1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
honestcharlie56
Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2017
Posts: 87
Location: Houston, Tx
|
| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:23 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
what year bus do you have. We do have wiring diagrams on this site.
_________________
1982 Vanagon Westy
1974 Transporter
1971 Tin Top Westy |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HarryFD
Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2012
Posts: 751
Location: Portland, OR
|
| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Do you have the yellow fuse box that tends to disintegrate?
_________________
1970 Deluxe Sunroof Bay Brilliant Blue/Cloud White
1973.5 911 Targa
2009 MB C300 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50352
|
| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:55 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Six of the fuses are for the headlights and other lights IIRC so will have no power unless the headlights are on.
Are you having an electrical problem? If so can you describe it carefully? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mcrum4421
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2018
Posts: 104
Location: Nashville, Tn.
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 3:02 am Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
In my haste to get the engine back in after fuel tank replacement I have created an electrical nightmare. IMO.
Its a 1970 bay window which I purchased a couple months back. I thought I labeled all the wires prior to engine removal but apparently not. No power to coil. Fuses 7,9,11 and 12 are hot with ignition off. Fuses 1,2,3,4 7,9,11 and 12 are hot with ignition on and lights on.
The engine cranks but cant get it to start. The wire that "I thought" powered the coil is a small red wire (14 gauge possibly) coming through firewall on drivers side. According to diagram this wire is supposed to come from fuse #3 which has power with lights on.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51153
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:33 am Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
 All that red!
Start by replacing all those red fuses with white ones except for #8 and #12, the fuse box shown on the diagram posted above shows their locations (depicted mirror image on that diagram for some reason, #1 is on the right, #12 on left).
There are no red wires involved in the ignition system, and none connected to #3 that I can see, your PO has been messing with things. The coil is powered by a black wire connected to the bottom of fuse #10 (unfused side), that part of the fuse box is powered by the black wire coming from the ignition switch and connected under fuse #8. There's a good chance that black wire in the harness running to the back of the bus on the RH side got shorted out and burnt, the red wire may be some sort of bypass fix for it. click on the diagram below twice to see it bigly.
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50352
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:39 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Which direction are you counting your fuses?
Not all your headlight fuses will be hot at the same time, you will either have the two fuses for the low beams hot, or the two fuses for the high beams, not both. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Amskeptic
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2002
Posts: 8568
Location: All Across The Country
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 4:57 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| busdaddy wrote: |
All that red!
There are no red wires involved in the ignition system,
The coil is powered by a black wire connected to the bottom of fuse #10 |
As diagnostic helpers, busdaddy, we should also ask if he has an aftermarket electric fuel pump. Those things are frequently powered off the coil with cheesy red wire from the FLAPS.
Colin
_________________
www.itinerant-air-cooled.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51153
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:38 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| Amskeptic wrote: |
| busdaddy wrote: |
All that red!
There are no red wires involved in the ignition system,
The coil is powered by a black wire connected to the bottom of fuse #10 |
As diagnostic helpers, busdaddy, we should also ask if he has an aftermarket electric fuel pump. Those things are frequently powered off the coil with cheesy red wire from the FLAPS.
Colin |
Excellent point Colin, although cheesy red is a slight upgrade from the usual cheesy black, it must have been on sale that day.
And in case it does power a pump it's not a good idea to power it from the coil, a dedicated fuel pump control relay powered from the battery or starter terminal is a much safer option that will add years of life to your ignition switch as well.
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Amskeptic
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2002
Posts: 8568
Location: All Across The Country
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:44 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| busdaddy wrote: |
And in case it does power a pump it's not a good idea to power it from the coil, a dedicated fuel pump control relay powered from the battery or starter terminal is a much safer option that will add years of life to your ignition switch as well. |
Like this (though I need to do a diagram for early bay buses with generators):
(5806)
https://itinerant-air-cooled.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=11380#p199444
_________________
www.itinerant-air-cooled.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mcrum4421
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2018
Posts: 104
Location: Nashville, Tn.
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Thanks for the feedback. No electric fuel pump on this engine. ordered more fuses and will replace first chance I get.
I was reading fuse block from left to right like diagram showed so that threw me off.
With ignition switch on I should have power at bottom (unfused side) of #10 fuse. If I do and "if" that's the wire powering the coil I have a short somewhere between there and the coil. Right ? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51153
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:15 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
8, 9 & 10 should all be live with the key on, see that heavy black bar running along under them?, that depicts a brass link on the fuse box that connects all 3, it's powered by the black wire from the ignition switch.
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50352
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| mcrum4421 wrote: |
| I have a short somewhere between there and the coil. Right ? |
A "short" is when two wires touch that are not suppose to touch, it can be two hot wires or a hot wire and a ground.
An "open" is when there is a break in a wire or a bad connection that prevent current from flowing normally.
You have an open or miswired circuit. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TomWesty
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2007
Posts: 3482
Location: Wyoming,USA
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:57 am Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| Wildthings wrote: |
| mcrum4421 wrote: |
| I have a short somewhere between there and the coil. Right ? |
A "short" is when two wires touch that are not suppose to touch, it can be two hot wires or a hot wire and a ground.
An "open" is when there is a break in a wire or a bad connection that prevent current from flowing normally.
You have an open or miswired circuit. |
Thanks for pointing that out Wildthings. I like to tell people: Shorts cause smoke, open circuits don’t.
As soon as I saw the red wire coming through the firewall, I knew there was trouble.
_________________
If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mcrum4421
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2018
Posts: 104
Location: Nashville, Tn.
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:14 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Thank you so much for the help.
I have neither short or an open. what I now have is power from switch to #15 on coil. Red wire coming from front on drivers side is a mystery for right now. I found black wire from switch and connected it to #15 on coil. However when I turn engine over I get no spark at distributor cap from coil wire. Dim test light at #1 while cranking. I've tested coil and got numbers that show it to be good. I'm wondering if I've jeopardized the Compu-Fire module in the distributor when I was fishing for wire placement.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51153
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:23 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
Well... they do have that reputation of being mysterious and unreliable (wow, I sound like a redneck mechanic discussing FI ), but really, those modules elevate mysterious issues to a whole new level, there's no way to test them (unlike FI).
#15 on the coil gets the black wire that has power when the key is on, the black wire on the mystery module goes on #1 and the red wire goes on #15. Yes I know black on red is odd, but it's the way crap flows downhill when you mix German, American and Chinese.
Good luck, I like points myself 
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jeff Geisen
Samba Chaplain
Joined: December 21, 2004
Posts: 1883
Location: N.W. Georgia
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 9:13 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
To check a module or points you only need a test light. Ground to battery and probe negative side of coil while turning engine with starter. Blinking light means distributor is doing its job. No flash points or module bad.
_________________
I Corinthians 4: 1 thru 5
‘63 ragtop - ‘68 single cab |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
airschooled
Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012
Posts: 12728
Location: on a bike ride somewhere
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 9:39 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
mcrum, do you have the black magnetic disc installed in your distributor when trying to start? I don't see it in your distributor picture…
Robbie
_________________
Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mcrum4421
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2018
Posts: 104
Location: Nashville, Tn.
|
| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:07 pm Post subject: Re: No power to most of my fuse box 1970 bus |
|
|
| Yes asiab3 I did install the magnetic disc but I feel that I probably destroyed the module in my haste to connect everything back up after the install of the engine. Is it ok go back to a points system with this 009 distributor ? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
