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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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 Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 6:27 am Post subject: House battery |
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Its been awhile since i had a second battery under my drivers seat, and im planing to install a solar panel this spring, and am looking for a better choice than the regular starting battery i had in there years ago. at least a deep cycle battery, or a AMG. There are plenty of battery on the web, but i thought i would reach out to my community of fellow Vanagon owners to see if you guys have a recommendation for a decent battery to fit under the drivers seat...
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72 bug
80 westfalia |
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dhaavers
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Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7756
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 8:01 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Thanks Dave!
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72 bug
80 westfalia |
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jimf909 
Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 7468
Location: WA/ID
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:35 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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And don't forget the future: LiFePo...
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8981408
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- Jim
| Abscate wrote: |
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:50 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Thanks Jim, but $575 for a battery is way more than im looking to spend. Just looking for something that fits in a deep cycle or a AMG. I see a lot of 50 ah batteries, is that too little? I see many Van conversions using 100 ah batteries.I see the Mighty Max that Dave linked is a 50 ah as well, is that a ok battery to start with? I know there many variables, at this point im looking to go with one 100 watt panel, and just running lights, sink charging outlets etc, possibly a inverter too..
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80 westfalia |
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westydriver
Samba Member
Joined: July 08, 2017
Posts: 54
Location: Eastside of Nebraska
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:03 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| calo1956 wrote: |
| Thanks Jim, but $575 for a battery is way more than im looking to spend. Just looking for something that fits in a deep cycle or a AMG. I see a lot of 50 ah batteries, is that too little? I see many Van conversions using 100 ah batteries.I see the Mighty Max that Dave linked is a 50 ah as well, is that a ok battery to start with? I know there many variables, at this point im looking to go with one 100 watt panel, and just running lights, sink charging outlets etc, possibly a inverter too.. |
That's all i did. Got a mighty max 50 to fit under seat and put a 100 Mighty max in the bottom kitchen cabinet. Running a 100w renogy panel. Still going strong after a year. |
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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:29 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Maybe give some thought to a different placement, rather than add to the Westy lean…giving up that spot under the driver's seat opens up a lot of options, size-wise.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9808
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:59 am Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| Paulbeard wrote: |
| Maybe give some thought to a different placement, rather than add to the Westy lean. |
X2 - I put the aux under the bench seat on the passenger side...
Just an inexpensive deep-cycle (trolling) battery from Wal*Mart - Group 24, 75 ah.
But then we didn't mind giving up the space - we tend to travel light even when we were on the road for a year. |
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:06 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Nice setup, but im still looking to go under the seat, i don't travel light,lol, and im already taking up a lot of the room under the sink cab with my relays , breakers and Blue Sea fuse panel, and still planing to put in my pro charger there, and then there's the inverter! So if i could get a 100 ah battery under the front seat, that would be ideal. No problem finding a starter battery, there got to be a deep cycle/AGM to fit in that space. We know the Mighty Max MG50 is going to fit, i would just like to at least like to double that. And as usual thanks to all for there reply's!
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SSWesty
Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2008
Posts: 732
Location: Bellevue
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:05 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Not 100 amps but pretty good size for under the seat. https://www.vmaxtanks.com/XTR34-75-12Volts-75AH-Deep-Cycle-XTREME-AGM-Battery_p_164.html It has potential and I thought I read that a member here was going to give one of them a shot.
A while back some of us tried using multiple small 22 amp batteries under the drivers seat. Some guys were able to get 4 of them in there however the batteries didn't seem to hold up well. You could investigate if there is anything new out there where maybe two batteries will fit in there and give you more amps than 75.
What you stated for your amp load seems pretty low. Lights, sink and charging can pretty much be handled but a starting battery for overnight trips. That is if you are talking about interior LED lights and charging a phone or tablet. Given that you can run a light load from healthy starting battery you can easily run the same load from a 50 amp battery or less. One of the variables to consider is how many days you will sit in one place without starting the engine. If you sit for a week yes a bigger battery and solar would make sense, if you just sit for a 2 nights then you are probably going overkill. Do you happen to know what your daily amp load is? Are you above 10 amps?
Here is what I run from a 40 amp battery:
-Propex heater
-Florescent interior light(soon to be LED)
-Pump for the sink
-Charging 2 smart phones as needed
-Charging 1 small chromebook as needed
-Charging 1 ipad as needed
-Charging a gopro as needed
-Charging a point and shoot camera as needed
-Charging a Goal Zero mini lantern
This is typically no problem for a couple nights without starting the engine. The heaviest draw is the Propex heater which varies on the outside temps and how long we are hanging out in the van.
Regardless of your amp load there is a lot of cool stuff you can do with your house battery system so the sky is kinda of the limit. Or maybe I should say your pocket book is the limit. |
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Thanks SSWesty, You are right i don't have a huge load at the moment, and yes all my lighting is LED. I would like to add a inverter as well, charging my laptop, and hopefully running my frig on 110, cause as we all know, it a non performer on 12 volts and im still working on getting it to run on the propane. Its encouraging that you can run your propex with your setup, i might be adding that as well down the line. Some may think its overkill, but i do hope to do longer trips, and i love the idea of harnessing the power of the sun, rather than having to rely on the marginal alternator as a means to charge. I always welcome ideas and opinions, and the 74 ah battery might just be all i need. Thanks for your reply, i appreciate your opinion!
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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:41 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Wiser heads than mine have opined that a good starter battery with a jump pack might be all you need for light loads and short stays between charges.
Think hard on the need for an inverter as there lots of 12v options for most things you need, even laptop power supplies.
If you are running your fridge on 110, you are not needing battery power at all, are you? You can just use the existing 110 outlets, no?
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 3:02 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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I should clarify Paul, where i camp, there is no power. And do i need all this "stuff"? Nope, but its my baby, and i like to spoil her!
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SSWesty
Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2008
Posts: 732
Location: Bellevue
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 3:39 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| calo1956 wrote: |
| hopefully running my frig on 110 |
Like running on 12v the frig would draw a fairly high amp load if you run it on AC through an inverter hooked up to the house battery. I don't have the numbers off the top of my head but it's more draw than a 100 amp battery can support. If you are in a climate with mild temps getting the frig running on propane is the way to go. If you are only running the frig and not using the stove the frig will last about 2 weeks on the propane tank. On longer trips we usually refill on propane weekly. The weekly timing works well because after a week out in the wild we like to restock on fresh produce, get water and do laundry. In addition to the frig we are also consuming propane for the propex and cooking.
If you truly do have a light amp load be sure to add some protection into your system for overcharging. If you only draw your battery down 4 amps overnight then are adding 5 amps per hour back into it with a 100 watt solar panel during the day you can overcharge the battery. Most solar panel controllers will take care of this situation but be careful with a $10 ebay controller. |
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:04 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Thanks SSWesty, I tend to agree with you, The fridge works awesome on propane, and i have spent many a week long camping with the family doing just that. Maybe im trying to take a simple rig, and complicate it. Really im fine with just a simple solar setup, just to keep my house battery topped off, maybe use the inverter just to charge what needs to be charged, then switch it off. So far the 45 ah hr battery is the only one fitting, and maybe thats all i need. with 11 x 7 x 7 of space under the seat, there isn't a lot of options. Im going to start with just a simple house battery set up, then add the 100 watt flexible panel with a good quality MPPT charge controller, which will handle and matin the batteries as well as a Blue Sea automatic charging relay. 39 years and still ticking! Thanks for your time and knowledge!
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jimf909
Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 7468
Location: WA/ID
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| calo1956 wrote: |
| Thanks SSWesty, You are right i don't have a huge load at the moment, and yes all my lighting is LED. I would like to add a inverter as well, charging my laptop, and hopefully running my frig on 110, cause as we all know, it a non performer on 12 volts and im still working on getting it to run on the propane. Its encouraging that you can run your propex with your setup, i might be adding that as well down the line. Some may think its overkill, but i do hope to do longer trips, and i love the idea of harnessing the power of the sun, rather than having to rely on the marginal alternator as a means to charge. I always welcome ideas and opinions, and the 74 ah battery might just be all i need. Thanks for your reply, i appreciate your opinion! |
I was going to say that a 50 ah battery under the driver’s seat will work great w/o solar for stock loads (I ran that setup for 15 years). Adding the fridge into the mix immediately changes the response. The Dometic running on 12 volts or 120 through an inverter (less efficient) will drain a 50 ah battery quickly. You’ll either want to get it running on propane or install more battery and solar. I’ve got 150 ah of house battery and 75 -175 watts of solar running a Truckfridge, propex, lights, chargers, etc.
_________________
- Jim
| Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
|
Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:12 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| calo1956 wrote: |
| I should clarify Paul, where i camp, there is no power. And do i need all this "stuff"? Nope, but its my baby, and i like to spoil her! |
yeah, I don't know about running a Dometic fridge on a battery through an inverter.
I don't think I questioned any of your "stuff," just that there are 12V equivalents that might be worth considering, for laptops, for battery charging (AA/AAA), etc.
_________________
Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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calo1956
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2011
Posts: 700
Location: long Island new york
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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Sound like a sweet setup Jim! Ill take one step at a time, get the Battery, and see how that goes. Ill probably add the solar, 100 watt on the roof, and if i want more, ill get another 100 panel and leave it on a long wire so i can move it around. But im going to start with the basic house battery, just wish there was a 100 ah battery to fit under the drivers seat.
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davevickery
Samba Member
Joined: July 16, 2005
Posts: 2887
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:17 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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| calo1956 wrote: |
| Sound like a sweet setup Jim! Ill take one step at a time, get the Battery, and see how that goes. Ill probably add the solar, 100 watt on the roof, and if i want more, ill get another 100 panel and leave it on a long wire so i can move it around. But im going to start with the basic house battery, just wish there was a 100 ah battery to fit under the drivers seat. |
You could see if the VMAX 75 Ah AGM fits on its side and let us know.
https://www.vmaxtanks.com/XTR34-75-12Volts-75AH-Deep-Cycle-XTREME-AGM-Battery_p_164.html |
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fxr
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Joined: December 07, 2014
Posts: 2325
Location: Bay area CA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: House battery |
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The fridge fed via an inverter will completely drain a 50Ah battery in less than 20 minutes, if that. Most easily available inverters are horrendously inefficient. Don't even think of it. Even feeding it 12V won't last much more than an hour - a high draw like that makes the advertised Ah capacity drop like a stone. You'd be lucky to get more than 10 Ah out of it before the voltage dropped below 12V with a draw of 8A or so.
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