What dual carb setup is recommended for a 2.0 ltr Type IV on an Air cooled '83 Vanagon Westfalia |
Weber 34 ICT |
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44% |
[ 4 ] |
Weber 40 IDF |
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44% |
[ 4 ] |
Weber 44 IDF |
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11% |
[ 1 ] |
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Total Votes : 9 |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 4:57 am Post subject: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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I've searched on The Samba and did a little googling and haven't been able to find what REALLY should be on my 2.0 ltr Type IV engine. I recently rebuilt it and increased my compression ratio to 8.2:1. I'm running Weber 34 ICTs on it now and was told by a local shop that the EMPI 40 HPMXs were just as good as the Webers but I'm not convinced yet that that's the case. I don't want to get in to a discussion on EMPI vs Weber but I wanted to know
a) What carb setup is recommended for these 2.0 ltr Type IV engines in a '83 Vanagon Westfalia? Should I just stick with my Weber 34 ICTs?
b) What seems to work best for jetting them (I know everyone's setup is different. I just wanted opinions that would get me close. JETTING IS EXPENSIVE)
Thanks in advance! I've read a lot of different threads on it already. Here are two of them:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/archive/index.php/o-t--t-363096--.html
https://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=84254 _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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markswagen Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018 Posts: 1030 Location: san diego
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 6:46 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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What's wrong with the fuel injection system, it'll be far better long term.
I have a customer right now, with issues with his injection system, he's contemplating switching to twin carbs, I think it's a bad idea. _________________ markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 6:53 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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markswagen,
The van had carbs on it when i bought it. I haven't been able to source the fuel injection system for it but would definitely entertain the idea of it if you knew where i could get a FI setup. _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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markswagen Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018 Posts: 1030 Location: san diego
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:00 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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There's a guy in LA I think, his name is Stuart, he bought a complete engine from a customer of mine, to replace his,that he had blown,he had the parts for sale, he's on here regularly, I cannot remember his username.
I might be able to find a complete set up, that would be a few weeks away, as we have a camping trip planned and some other stuff.
If you can't find, holler, and I will see what I can find. _________________ markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:09 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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markswagen wrote: |
There's a guy in LA I think, his name is Stuart, he bought a complete engine from a customer of mine, to replace his,that he had blown,he had the parts for sale, he's on here regularly, I cannot remember his username.
I might be able to find a complete set up, that would be a few weeks away, as we have a camping trip planned and some other stuff.
If you can't find, holler, and I will see what I can find. |
Awesome! I searched the classifieds on here but didn't find anything other than a guy named Chris that was selling a FI system that said it may have been for a 411.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2210216
I am going to reach out to my local shops to see if they can source the parts as well. Please keep your ear to the ground because I have been trying to faniggle with these carbs for a while to get them right and am beginning to think i need a bigger venturi (i.e. different carbs) or FI. _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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NobyDoby Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2012 Posts: 101 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:37 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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What about Dellorto's 40 DRLA? _________________ 1980 Aircooled Type 4 CU 2.0L T3 Westfalia:
Flowed AMC 39x33mm heads with Porsche swivel adjusters and CR 8.0:1
94mm Mahle dished P/C's & 71mm Stroke
Original VW CU Bus Hydro Cam w/Febi Hydro Followers
Dual Dellorto's DRLA 40 - 32 Venturi's
SyncLink Throttle System
MSS Central Airfilter
123Ignition Tune & NGK BP6ET
Vintage Speed Dual Side Super Flow Type 4 Exhaust |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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NobyDoby wrote: |
What about Dellorto's 40 DRLA? |
I am ok with whatever setup is actually recommended. I know Weber has a good reputation. I just need a consensus answer on which way to go. I have really enjoyed learning about jetting carburetors but they can certainly be a pain. I'm looking at a FI system right now from
http://lowbugget.com/fitechkits.html
Vanagain suggested i look at the linked setup kit #6. It's expensive but if FI would run better than the carbs I would entertain the idea of getting them. Its almost as much as a complete engine though. _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17124 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:32 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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I clicked on that link. The kits pictured are for upright engines. Not what you have at all. I can tell you that a standalone engine management system has some growing pains.
There is an old myth that bigger is better. An engine is only a pump. In stock config, it can only pass so much air. More CFM won't help and could hurt. You need to look at what rpm range you will be mostly operating in.
Dual carbs with quality linkage, can be set to run and shouldn't require a lot of fiddling once setup. Not many people left that can tune dual carbs though. _________________ ☮️ |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:39 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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MarkWard wrote: |
I clicked on that link. The kits pictured are for upright engines. Not what you have at all. I can tell you that a standalone engine management system has some growing pains.
There is an old myth that bigger is better. An engine is only a pump. In stock config, it can only pass so much air. More CFM won't help and could hurt. You need to look at what rpm range you will be mostly operating in.
Dual carbs with quality linkage, can be set to run and shouldn't require a lot of fiddling once setup. Not many people left that can tune dual carbs though. |
The link should have taken you to the kits that are for Type IV motors. The one in the picture in this link is a 1600 cc engine. Kit #6 is for Type IVs.
http://lowbugget.com/2b.html
I agree that bigger isn't always better. haha. But I guess I'll get back to what the original post is about. I've been told that 34 ICTs aren't really optimal for the 2.0 ltr engines but 40 IDFs are the way to go. Any thoughts on that? It looks like two people have voted at the poll at the top for the 34 ICTs. _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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NobyDoby Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2012 Posts: 101 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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In short: smaller (34 ICT’s) will give bit more torque at lower rpm’s but will restrain the horses at higher rpm’s. Bigger (40 IDF’s or DRLA’s) might give a bit less torque at bottom rpm but give a few more horses. Going bigger might not give more horses but will definitely result in less torque. 40’s with not to big venturi’s might give the best result.
All depends on the kind of venagon the engine is mounted in and/or what kind of engine character you want.
In my case it is in a heavy westy and I want a engine with a lot of torque over broad range starting at low rpm. Also wanted a decent fuel economy. _________________ 1980 Aircooled Type 4 CU 2.0L T3 Westfalia:
Flowed AMC 39x33mm heads with Porsche swivel adjusters and CR 8.0:1
94mm Mahle dished P/C's & 71mm Stroke
Original VW CU Bus Hydro Cam w/Febi Hydro Followers
Dual Dellorto's DRLA 40 - 32 Venturi's
SyncLink Throttle System
MSS Central Airfilter
123Ignition Tune & NGK BP6ET
Vintage Speed Dual Side Super Flow Type 4 Exhaust |
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Back to top |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:27 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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NobyDoby wrote: |
In short: smaller (34 ICT’s) will give bit more torque at lower rpm’s but will restrain the horses at higher rpm’s. Bigger (40 IDF’s or DRLA’s) might give a bit less torque at bottom rpm but give a few more horses. Going bigger might not give more horses but will definitely result in less torque. 40’s with not to big venturi’s might give the best result.
All depends on the kind of venagon the engine is mounted in and/or what kind of engine character you want.
In my case it is in a heavy westy and I want a engine with a lot of torque over broad range starting at low rpm. Also wanted a decent fuel economy. |
It sounds like my setup is very similar to yours. Thanks for the explanation though. Mine is a Westy as well so its really heavy. Sounds like my 34's may give the best torque. I'm not interested in going fast per say. I just want to get up a d@mn hill!! haha _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17124 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:34 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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I sent you a PM _________________ ☮️ |
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NobyDoby Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2012 Posts: 101 Location: The Netherlands
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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My setup gets my Westy up the d@mn hill.
It has a very flat curve with 125Nm at 1500 rpm, 145Nm between 2500 and 3500 (almost flat) and the falling back to 125 Nm at 4500Nm.
Average fuel economy last 5000km: 19 mpg (8,3 km/l). _________________ 1980 Aircooled Type 4 CU 2.0L T3 Westfalia:
Flowed AMC 39x33mm heads with Porsche swivel adjusters and CR 8.0:1
94mm Mahle dished P/C's & 71mm Stroke
Original VW CU Bus Hydro Cam w/Febi Hydro Followers
Dual Dellorto's DRLA 40 - 32 Venturi's
SyncLink Throttle System
MSS Central Airfilter
123Ignition Tune & NGK BP6ET
Vintage Speed Dual Side Super Flow Type 4 Exhaust |
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Back to top |
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whip618 Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 761 Location: Albuquerque
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Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 2:37 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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I ran Dellorto'S on type IV'S for years, I think the Dellorto 40 DRLA would be the best choice for carbs, the FI would of course be the best option.
Phil _________________ Life is simple....either you're qualified or you're not.
USSVI.......Pride Runs Deep
USSVI Life member and Holland Club member
Samba Member No. 3307 |
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JerryvanDaniel Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2018 Posts: 30 Location: Huntsville, AL
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Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:07 am Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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Update on my current carb setup. I hadn’t heard much about what Venturi people had in their carbs but I pulled mine yesterday and the markings said “50” and then underneath the 50 was a “4 deg” marking. I’m assuming the 50 was in mm but I’m not sure what the 4 deg actually is in respect to. My jets right now are as follows:
Idle: 65
Main: 140
Air corrector jet: 160
F6 emulsion tube
Float needle: 175
Venturi:50 4degree
I think I’ve decided to stay with the 34 ICTs for now but may eventually switch to a pair of 40 or 44 IDFs
Thoughts on that Venturi? That sounds rather large. My spark plugs right now have a build up of gray on them which I believe would indicate running on the leaner side. _________________ ****************************************
1983 VW Vanagon Westfalia Aircooled 2.0 ltr
Jerry's always singing the Blues |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17124 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Dual Carb Setup? Weber 40 IDFs or 44 IDFs |
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I think you need to measure the throttle plate diameter and the inside dia of the venturie to know. 1 inch = 25.4 mm. _________________ ☮️ |
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