Replacing Air Conditioner Hoses

[DanHoug]

old thread but whatever....

i'm ripping out my AC on my 87 Westy. gonnna cut the hoses to get them out unless someone freaks out and wants them for big bucks. they are a PITA to get out whole.

i'm a big old, sweaty guy but there are valid reasons to remove AC:
- much less wt... maybe 100 lbs. all told
- much better engine access, no AC bracket, hoses, and compressor in the way.
- much better rad cooling without the condenser in front
- huge improvement in headroom over the lower bed. bang! D'Oh!
- engine doesn't have any HP to spare

the bottom line is the Westy with the fiberglass top and luggage rack really acts like a Land Rover with the Safari Top. they stay relatively cool and have great flow thru ventilation. screw resale, this is my van to do with what i want.... simplicity, light weight, headroom, better cooling.

-dan

[djkeev]

[vwjetboat]

A/C is not real hard.. it just cost a lot.. you can get a modern compressor and lines out of a junk yard and adapt to evap using modern dryer and expansion valves .. the issue is the condenser .. you need a modern larger tube condenser to handle the higher pressure of the 134.. but you can use most of the stuff from say a chevy suburban with or without rear air.. but one thing for sure modern Volkswagen compressors SUCK.. as in JUNK...
Just my 2 cent..

[Wellington]

I spent about 4 hours removing all my hoses, without cutting any. Worst part is taking down the cabinet, and side cabinet.
My Parker distributor did not have any AC hose, but I found another shop that caries Gates Polarseal AC hose. Drier from VW dealer, $22 Canadian...shockingly cheap.
All new fittings and hoses made up. New compressor expected soon. Reusing my previous parallel flow condenser. Rear Evaporator not available new for my rear, so I'll reuse it. For me the hardest part is getting the hoses through the grommets in the body. Soapy water helps.

[sciroccojim]

I just spent all day driving with my AC running and I can tell you that it's worth it.
_________________
1987 Westy Camper

[vwjetboat]

[DanHoug]

Dave- huge respect for the contributions you've made! thank you!

but two photos to show where hence i come...

first, i'm a wacko... sacrilege for modifying an old BMW airhead motorcycle. my bike, not a Garage Queen, makes me happy.

i'm a motorcyclist that wears a heavy leather coat, Aerostitch pants, leather boots, all when it is 90F out. people ask, "Aren't you hot?" and i say "Yes.". part of the experience. i love minimalism and being immersed in the moment. that said, my wife embodies Robert Service' poem "Cremation of Sam McGee"... she is never warm enough so AC to her is moot. secondly, i modified a VW Jetta to run of straight veg oil, ran it for 140K miles on straight fryer grease, and changed from 3 fan belts to one. the motor never ran smoother without the vibration of the AC comp and PS pump. simple. one belt. joy. i'm keeping the PS but not spinning the AC and loving full access to the engine.

secondly, this:

i love the high head room, great rear visibility, and all things simple. more than willing to put up with the window down, arm out the window and embracing the world. old enough to still think AC in my Honda Civic is miracle and i love it. but also old enough to remember that in the 60's very FEW cars had it and life went on, people traveled, vacations were enjoyed.

there's a great essay that attributes the decline of Western society to advent of air conditioning... a change from evenings where hot families spent time on their porch cooling off, waving to the people walking by for an evening stroll and talking across the way to their neighbors. i don't mind rolling down the window, sweating a little, and grinning stupidly at my co-drivers that also are hot.

resale value means little to me. the van owes me nothing. what i ask of it is another 100,000 miles without complication, with less vibration, less expense, better access, better cooling, and a sweaty back. YMMV.

-dan

[AndyBees]

A few weeks ago, I removed and replaced all the hoses in my 84 Tin-top. I got tired of failure after failure of the OE 33 year old hoses, fittings, etc.

I used coldhose.com for my source. Everything went well. I purchased the hoses with ends to mate to the Sanden SD7V16 that come on the ALH TDI engine. I used "peanut" adapters, 8AN if I remember correctly. I stayed with the existing condenser, evaporator and expansion valve. (I did "turn in" the adjustment on the expansion valve.) Five years ago, I removed the RCV from the compressor. So, it operates very similar to the OE compressor that come in the Vanagon.

I flushed the components with Mineral Spirits followed with Acetone! ... <<more involved than that simple statement.

Anyway, with R134a, the high-side pressure is 250 psi and low side is at 30 psi and 86f ambient with a box fan blowing on the front. On the road, in 85 to 95f ambient temps, the air out the vent ranges from about 45f to 56f as the compressor cycles. I do get a bit of outside air infiltration due to bad seals inside the air handler in the dash! It will hold it's own idling sitting in a parking lot with my dogs inside (doors locked).

It works really good. I'm satisfied!
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[vwjetboat]

[AndyBees]

What I do when I head out in the Van is set the temp knob to maximum cold. When the van gets comfortable, I back the temp knob off until the compressor kicks-out. I have a green LED mounted in the dash to observe compressor function. Anyway, from there it will cycle just like when it was charged with R-12. The temp range coming out of the vents is about ten degrees, down and up as I explained in the other post.

If I leave the temp knob turned to Max the compressor will not cycle!

Yes, it does need shroud attention. I looked at possibilities but have not done anything yet! The OE fan seems to work fairly well.
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[coqcitywesty]

Okay - to build on this thread and with a 3 week summer trip through some desert country looming, I am undertaking a full rebuild if the AC system on my 91 Westy. This will include all new hoses, new compressor, high efficiency condenser, receiver/dryer and expansion valve. While the final hookups and charging will be done professionally, I am undertaking the removal/rebuilding of the hoses, which has left me with some questions as follows, and yes, I have scoured previous threads, the Bentley, and other info sources. I am loath to remove the closet as I have a bunch of wiring/lighting running though it so....

1. I am assuming that I can drop the top evaporator cabinet without removing the side curtain rails/vents? Please confirm.

2. (biggie - 2 parter) Can I remove the hoses that run though the closet to the evaporator without removing the actual closet? It appears that if I partially drop the evaporator housing/cabinet, I can reach the fittings to undo them but note that there are a number of metal T-fittings fittings behind/within the closet that may impact my ability to pull then through - is this correct? Therefore;

3. Is it ‘better’ or necessary to cut the original hoses to remove them or can they all be worked though the various ‘orifices’ though/under the vehicle?

4. If I decide to be brave and re-connect some of the new hoses and fittings to the new parts (receiver/dryer and/or the evaporator) should I be using any type of sealant or tape on the fittings?

Any/all insights tips/tricks are welcomed expecting that I will have additional queries as I move forward. Many thx in advance.
_________________
1991 Westfalia EJ251, 1972 Volvo 1800 ES

[dobryan]

[djkeev]

The Orings do get lubed with your compressor oil before assembly.

Dave
_________________
Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[coqcitywesty]

Thx for the insights. I pulled the lower hoses to the condensor this afternoon and will look to drop the evaporator and pull the upper hoses later this week. The lowers both came out in one piece, but the larger one from the compressor to the front was a tad tricky as my compressor has the single bolt, push-in fittings and the round seating ‘washer’ was too large to fit through one of the front ‘orifices’.

Follow up question as to compressors - GW sell the Sanden #4434 as the drop in replacement. Would this be ‘modded’ in any way to work with a 2.1 or should I expect that if I found a 4434 elsewhere, that this would be identical to the GW offering OR is there another/better compressor offering that would replace my current, single bolt model? Again, thx for the insights.
_________________
1991 Westfalia EJ251, 1972 Volvo 1800 ES

[djkeev]

You need to decide what you want, a real branded Sanden or a knockoff?

I chose to use the real deal, knockoffs always give me pause and concern.

Dave
_________________
Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[coqcitywesty]

Thx Dave - yes, I want the real thing as I share your philosophy. I am planning only on doing the AC rebuild ‘once, well’ such that I am not revisiting parts in a years time. In reading a number of forums, owners appear to be using a number of models of Sanden compressors as replacements - not sure as to the difference between a 500 series and a 700 series in terms of bolt-in fitment which is what I am seeking.

Also to answer my previous query,yes I have to remove the spice rack curtain shelf in order to access a couple of screws to remove the evaporator housing.
_________________
1991 Westfalia EJ251, 1972 Volvo 1800 ES

[djkeev]

The 500 series is a five piston compressor,
The 700 is a sven piston compressor.

Your 91 should use the larger seven piston unit. My old 86 used the smaller one.

Sanden changed their numbering system to further complicate choices.
They also come pre-oiled for R-12 or R-134a which is lart of the multiple numbers you see. There are also various pulley/clutch options as well.

In all honestly, the rear cover off your 91 should fit onto any new seven piston Sanden compressor. There is a vast selection of rear cover designs that different units use. Same compressor, just different hose mounting styles and locations.


Dave
_________________
Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[dart330]

I purchased the new Sanden compressor from Van Cafe, had to use the rear cover from my old 1990 compressor as I was re-using the original hose fittings. Pretty easy swap and neat to see the guts of the compressor.

Been a couple years and no issues so far.

[weekenderraf]

Manufacture of Aeroquip GH 134 hoses is now Discontinued - Replaced by GH001:
https://hosewarehouse.com/gh134-8-eaton-aeroquip-s...e-gh134-08

Eaton GH001 EverCool A/C Hose: https://hosewarehouse.com/gh001-8-eaton-aeroquip-e...p-gh001-08