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EmpiGT
Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2005
Posts: 2597
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 Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:55 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| mandraks wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
You will have to have a VIN to get this on the road, otherwise its a 2019 model and you have to pass safety and emissions for 2019
Not happening.
In my state, possession of a separate VIN plate is a crime. |
if a company does not produce more than 350 vehicles a year it is perfectly legal to build cars and sell them. this was decided a couple of years ago |
Is this per the law quoted earlier in the thread. What about the EPA approved engines in that law? I'm sure no aircooled vw motor is on that approved list. |
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gitchesum
Samba Member
Joined: November 10, 2003
Posts: 513
Location: North Cali
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| mandraks wrote: |
mahindra is in india and has an official license to build Jeeps for the india market |
Jeep-like.
_________________
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57 SC
61 rag w/356B brakes
61 356B
Honda XLR 250, 69 Z50, Yamaha 100 Enduro...and others.
GMC SLT 4x4 Dmax
Kubota L3710, not enuf attachments.
And various VW's that come and go... |
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Erik G
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13270
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| EmpiGT wrote: |
| mandraks wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
You will have to have a VIN to get this on the road, otherwise its a 2019 model and you have to pass safety and emissions for 2019
Not happening.
In my state, possession of a separate VIN plate is a crime. |
if a company does not produce more than 350 vehicles a year it is perfectly legal to build cars and sell them. this was decided a couple of years ago |
Is this per the law quoted earlier in the thread. What about the EPA approved engines in that law? I'm sure no aircooled vw motor is on that approved list. |
looks like at minimum it has to be obd2 compliant.
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58deluxerag
Samba Member
Joined: May 18, 2003
Posts: 1729
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:51 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| mandraks wrote: |
mahindra is in india and has an official license to build Jeeps for the india market |
They advertise them here in the states, saw commercials for them on Motortrend TV as well as Rush Limbaugh on the radio.
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'58 Binz
'58 Beetle Ragtop
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16863
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:29 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| gitchesum wrote: |
| Quote: |
(we are on the verge of the "model T syndrome" where what was worth 25-30k in the 80's can be had for 8-10k today. the guys who loved them are dead...same is happening here.
everyone who wants one has one...those who think they could have cashed out for big $$ lost and should have sold when the market was hot...anyway I would still build one vs pulling some gutted carcass out of the woods. I don't know...I put a different value on things. got my first bus when I was 11...a 15 window for 150.00. I was never in in for the $$....some people however think they can retire off of this stuff |
Yes the Model T syndrome did happen. But VW’s are a different ball game. Every 4 year old kid in the world knows what a VW is....this isn’t age related like the T was. |
sure...every 4 year old knows what it is...but if it doesn't have a touch screen, they aren't interested. they will never have the emotional connection, therefore they won't carry the torch
there aren't too many 11-15 year old screwing with stuff anymore. I grew up where I had no choice but to fix what was at my disposal.....therefore honing my skills...
we are the last of a breed that will get our hands dirty for this stuff judging by what's going on. furthermore....most won't be able to afford to own a second car, let alone some old vw...fuck....I'd say 1/2 or better here can barely afford what they own by seeing some posts....
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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j.pickens
Samba Member
Joined: December 03, 2002
Posts: 9789
Location: Exit 7, New Jersey
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| gitchesum wrote: |
| Quote: |
(we are on the verge of the "model T syndrome" where what was worth 25-30k in the 80's can be had for 8-10k today. the guys who loved them are dead...same is happening here.
everyone who wants one has one...those who think they could have cashed out for big $$ lost and should have sold when the market was hot...anyway I would still build one vs pulling some gutted carcass out of the woods. I don't know...I put a different value on things. got my first bus when I was 11...a 15 window for 150.00. I was never in in for the $$....some people however think they can retire off of this stuff |
Yes the Model T syndrome did happen. But VW’s are a different ball game. Every 4 year old kid in the world knows what a VW is....this isn’t age related like the T was. |
sure...every 4 year old knows what it is...but if it doesn't have a touch screen, they aren't interested. they will never have the emotional connection, therefore they won't carry the torch
there aren't too many 11-15 year old screwing with stuff anymore. I grew up where I had no choice but to fix what was at my disposal.....therefore honing my skills...
we are the last of a breed that will get our hands dirty for this stuff judging by what's going on. furthermore....most won't be able to afford to own a second car, let alone some old vw...fuck....I'd say 1/2 or better here can barely afford what they own by seeing some posts.... |
I wouldn't be quite so pessimistic.
There is a huge movement towards STEM education right now. And YouTube is revealing a whole new group of people sharing mechanical techniques for design and repair.
Lots of young kids are embracing the concept of fixing their own shit. Look at the push for "Right to Repair" legislation.
All of this and more are out there. I know of several "kids" in their early twenties rocking rusty buses which they found for peanuts, and have learned to weld just so they can get them street legal.
There is something about these buses (and beetles) which attracts younger people. Not as many teenagers longing to own a '57 Chevy as much as a '57 bus.
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Founder and Chairman Emeritus, ECMSAS
BBX BBXII and BBXXI Long Distance Award Winner
| BeaterBarndoor wrote: |
i wish more people would actually drive their vws rather than just talking about what they have in the garage. |
| Red Fau Veh wrote: |
If you've seen one sunroof swivel seat kombi, you've seen them all!  |
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Busstom
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2014
Posts: 3841
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| I'd tend to agree...I saw a bunch of young people at the Sac BugOrama a couple weeks ago. And a few hours ago, I sold my '48 Chevy to a dude and his son who couldn't wait to get it home and start digging in. |
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gitchesum
Samba Member
Joined: November 10, 2003
Posts: 513
Location: North Cali
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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Yep... that’s what I’m seeing. We have gear heads in the family as young as 4.
They are all familiar with family members projects and jump in as long as they can hold their attention. If these young people can’t buy a bus, they’ll get a newer bug. Again, I see all age groups at meets.
_________________
Looking for SP Kadron manifolds...please !!
57 SC
61 rag w/356B brakes
61 356B
Honda XLR 250, 69 Z50, Yamaha 100 Enduro...and others.
GMC SLT 4x4 Dmax
Kubota L3710, not enuf attachments.
And various VW's that come and go... |
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Blue Baron
VW Aficionado
Joined: June 16, 2006
Posts: 24059
Location: Southeast USA
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:17 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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I also agree.
When we take our bus around, we have young people, both men and women, saying they want a bus, and our explaining the drawbacks doesn't phase them. Plus, there is no way production of these bodies, and the number of people building them, will ever produce enough of them to put a dent in the market. It's not like Hannover cranking them out by the thousands. If anything, they'll help offset the natural attrition rate that is still happening.
Bottom line, we dig VW buses. Not only does this keep the hobby alive, but it helps recycle buses that have reached the end of their life cycle. Plus it keeps people employed making all the bits and pieces needed to assemble one.
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20271
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:05 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| Lind wrote: |
| I don't care about their value, just how much the next one will cost me. |
Fucking gold, I tell ya.
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Drew Ogden
Samba Member
Joined: February 19, 2004
Posts: 329
Location: Elbow Cay, Bahamas
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:09 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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I am surprised that no one has mentioned the new electric VW bus coming out in relation to future values. There will be lots of publicity and general awareness of the bus because of this. The modern VW brand is still considered a "cool" brand in the marketplace with a die hard following. I don't think it will raise values, but I do think it will keep the "Model T" scenario from happening.
As pointed out earlier, the bus is still highway worthy, unlike the model T. More importantly, however, the bus has mid century modern styling. That is a very popular style and it isn't going anywhere anytime soon. No one is designing their house to look like the 1920's....but every flip on HGTV has 1950's elements in it...even down to the Herman Miller repro dining chairs.... |
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sub-hatchtim
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2006
Posts: 2610
Location: Phoenix AZ
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:06 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| gitchesum wrote: |
| Quote: |
(we are on the verge of the "model T syndrome" where what was worth 25-30k in the 80's can be had for 8-10k today. the guys who loved them are dead...same is happening here.
everyone who wants one has one...those who think they could have cashed out for big $$ lost and should have sold when the market was hot...anyway I would still build one vs pulling some gutted carcass out of the woods. I don't know...I put a different value on things. got my first bus when I was 11...a 15 window for 150.00. I was never in in for the $$....some people however think they can retire off of this stuff |
Yes the Model T syndrome did happen. But VW’s are a different ball game. Every 4 year old kid in the world knows what a VW is....this isn’t age related like the T was. |
sure...every 4 year old knows what it is...but if it doesn't have a touch screen, they aren't interested. they will never have the emotional connection, therefore they won't carry the torch
there aren't too many 11-15 year old screwing with stuff anymore. I grew up where I had no choice but to fix what was at my disposal.....therefore honing my skills...
we are the last of a breed that will get our hands dirty for this stuff judging by what's going on. furthermore....most won't be able to afford to own a second car, let alone some old vw...fuck....I'd say 1/2 or better here can barely afford what they own by seeing some posts.... |
Chill out Mr. Grumpy pants
This type of attitude is what killed the model t crowd and is bringing the demise to the street rod culture.
Gerrr I'm old and don't like young people, young people are lazy, I'm going to group all young people into a single category, I'm not going to pass the torch because my generation was the best
P.S. get off my lawn
Now to go drink a case of Geritol
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58 Dove blue singlecab
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Riff Raff
Shivering Sambian
Joined: October 25, 2004
Posts: 3096
Location: Alberta
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:06 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| sub-hatchtim wrote: |
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| gitchesum wrote: |
| Quote: |
(we are on the verge of the "model T syndrome" where what was worth 25-30k in the 80's can be had for 8-10k today. the guys who loved them are dead...same is happening here.
everyone who wants one has one...those who think they could have cashed out for big $$ lost and should have sold when the market was hot...anyway I would still build one vs pulling some gutted carcass out of the woods. I don't know...I put a different value on things. got my first bus when I was 11...a 15 window for 150.00. I was never in in for the $$....some people however think they can retire off of this stuff |
Yes the Model T syndrome did happen. But VW’s are a different ball game. Every 4 year old kid in the world knows what a VW is....this isn’t age related like the T was. |
sure...every 4 year old knows what it is...but if it doesn't have a touch screen, they aren't interested. they will never have the emotional connection, therefore they won't carry the torch
there aren't too many 11-15 year old screwing with stuff anymore. I grew up where I had no choice but to fix what was at my disposal.....therefore honing my skills...
we are the last of a breed that will get our hands dirty for this stuff judging by what's going on. furthermore....most won't be able to afford to own a second car, let alone some old vw...fuck....I'd say 1/2 or better here can barely afford what they own by seeing some posts.... |
Chill out Mr. Grumpy pants
This type of attitude is what killed the model t crowd and is bringing the demise to the street rod culture.
Gerrr I'm old and don't like young people, young people are lazy, I'm going to group all young people into a single category, I'm not going to pass the torch because my generation was the best
P.S. get off my lawn
Now to go drink a case of Geritol |
I think that skills@eurocars post is simply his observation, not necessarily pessimistic, just reality as he sees it unfolding.
Same with Douglas D, just with different potential outcomes.
One cannot dismiss the observation that there are fewer kids interested in getting their hands dirty to keep a car running. The simple fact that one needs a degree in electrical engineering just to pop the hood on modern cars is killing the DIY scene.
Yes, split buses are a modern cultural icon, but in order for them to survive the present generation of bus owners, they have to be affordable to the next generation of potential bus owners.
That is not currently happening.
I see a parallel with split buses and 356's. There is much consternation and hand wringing going on amongst the old white men who make up the ownership of 356's as to how to get younger people interested in them so their hobby will not die.
The only real way to do that (I think) is to make them affordable to a younger demographic.
In order for that to happen, there has to be a market correction.
For that to happen, they must fall out of favour with pop culture.
Then, they have to make a resurgence.
That certainly happened once with split buses, but will it happen again?
One thing that all vintage air cooled vehicles have going for them is that they lend themselves well to electric conversion, which is undoubtedly the wave of the future.
Adapt or perish. Some may be mortified by the thought of converting their A/C VW to electric, but it might just be the adaptation that saves them all from the recycler over the next hundred years.
Perhaps the new bus bodies will find a niche there?
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vwuberalles
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2003
Posts: 1357
Location: Richmond, VA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:10 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| Braukuche wrote: |
| It's exactly what they do with those fiberglass speedsters and as far as I know those are legal in most states. |
Are you talking about those Beetle-based kit cars? Are they registered as a Porsche Speedster, or does the title call it whatever year Beetle they got the donor pan from?
_________________
1973 Superbeetle: 1st car, owned since age 12. Update thread --> https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9919140#9919140
1967 Kombi: Owned since age 17, Dad's retirement project.
1966 Beetle: My new project. (SOLD) Build thread--> https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=678040 |
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vwuberalles
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2003
Posts: 1357
Location: Richmond, VA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:20 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| Riff Raff wrote: |
One thing that all vintage air cooled vehicles have going for them is that they lend themselves well to electric conversion, which is undoubtedly the wave of the future.
Adapt or perish. Some may be mortified by the thought of converting their A/C VW to electric, but it might just be the adaptation that saves them all from the recycler over the next hundred years.
Perhaps the new bus bodies will find a niche there? |
I think you're on to something there. Remember back in the late 90s when VW was floundering and about to pull out of the US market altogether? It was the hype over Concept One and the eventual New Beetle that ultimately saved them. Then once the New Beetle went on sale in 1998 suddenly there was a huge surge of interest in aircooled bugs. Suddenly they were a lot more cool and relevant, thus desirable. New Beetle owners then wanted to get classic bug to park next to it in the garage. I wouldn't be surprised if we see something similar happen now that VW is officially coming out with a new bus. Only now electric conversions are becoming more common, and before long affordable retrofit kits will start popping up. Expect to see more and more electric VW conversions in coming years. There's also the whole #vanlife thing going on that'll add more fuel to the fire. There is going to be a growing market for a new "vintage" rolling chassis.
_________________
1973 Superbeetle: 1st car, owned since age 12. Update thread --> https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9919140#9919140
1967 Kombi: Owned since age 17, Dad's retirement project.
1966 Beetle: My new project. (SOLD) Build thread--> https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=678040 |
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 22641
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:22 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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When we old white fat guys want your Splits again, we will pass legislation to slap a TUV inspection on them, add a $10,000 a year reg fee on them, drain all the whiny Millennial inherited 401ks and stocks, then buy them at a pittance
Greatest and vets of Viet Nam and previous wars will be exempt from the fees, because those are the rules, we just made up.
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 10999
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:35 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| vwuberalles wrote: |
| Braukuche wrote: |
| It's exactly what they do with those fiberglass speedsters and as far as I know those are legal in most states. |
Are you talking about those Beetle-based kit cars? Are they registered as a Porsche Speedster, or does the title call it whatever year Beetle they got the donor pan from? |
They are registered as beetles in California. Registration goes with the pan, the state doesn't care what's on top of it.
There is a lot of discussion amongst the geriatric set of Porsche owners about the future of these cars, but it's much ado about nothing. There has been a correction but mostly because so many hack so called restorers where buying shitty cars, doing fast shitty work on them and then trying to fast flip them for big money. The uneducated people with big money simply have gotten wise to the ruse and have become more selective. Nice cars still go for nice money, turds less so.
There is also a growing number of bus guys getting into early Porsches who still have color in their hair. I know of two bus guys locally who have done it happening upon good Deals.
_________________
Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 10999
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:43 am Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| vwuberalles wrote: |
| Braukuche wrote: |
| It's exactly what they do with those fiberglass speedsters and as far as I know those are legal in most states. |
Are you talking about those Beetle-based kit cars? Are they registered as a Porsche Speedster, or does the title call it whatever year Beetle they got the donor pan from? |
They are registered as beetles in California. Registration goes with the pan, the state doesn't care what's on top of it.
There is a lot of discussion amongst the geriatric set of Porsche owners about the future of these cars, but it's much ado about nothing. There has been a correction but mostly because so many hack so called restorers where buying shitty cars, doing fast shitty work on them and then trying to fast flip them for big money. The uneducated people with big money simply have gotten wise to the ruse and have become more selective. Nice cars still go for nice money, turds less so.
There is also a growing number of bus guys getting into early Porsches who still have color in their hair. I know of two bus guys locally who have done it happening upon good Deals.
_________________
Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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MrPolak
Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2004
Posts: 1337
Location: AG ,atnaltA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| vwuberalles wrote: |
| So how would this be registered? I mean, they make brand new "1969" Camaro complete shell reproductions so there must be a way. And does the title on those say 69, or is it registered as whatever year some dude orders it and puts it together in his garage? |
Apparently sold and registered as a replica based on info here for 65 Mustang repops: https://revologycars.com/faq/
I don't think this will hit Gerson hard. 1) Gerson panels are used in official restorations by VW 2) REPUTATION 3) they're funky green, and 4):
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Bruce Amacker
Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2007
Posts: 1786
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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| Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:02 pm Post subject: Re: New production Split-Bus body seen at MAM Funfest this weekend |
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| Braukuche wrote: |
Are you talking about those Beetle-based kit cars? Are they registered as a Porsche Speedster, or does the title call it whatever year Beetle they got the donor pan from?
They are registered as beetles in California. Registration goes with the pan, the state doesn't care what's on top of it.. |
Maybe that's how Cal handles it, but not all states including Ohio. If you change the body you better get an inspection and re-title the car. Some cops will let you slide with a dune buggy/kit car and a Beetle title/plate but some will tow you away. It's your luck who pulls you over. If it's a kit car, it's NOT a Beetle.
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'66 Deluxe Bus
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Build threads:
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