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ben_dubai Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2016 Posts: 19 Location: Dubai
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Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:36 pm Post subject: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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Hello Baywindow people,
Ok I am getting lost. I bought a 1972 Baywindow Bus (US/Canada Version as far as I know) 2 years back. I good a good deal on it but I knew it needs some work. No I am doing a full restoration and struggle with several things. Please help me if you have the answers
1. VIN number
The Vin is 2222057854. I checked several VIN sites also here on Samba but is seems there is no Bus with 2222 starting. Any idea?
2. Engine number
The number is U5064710. What I could fine out is that its a US/Canada M239 Fuel Injection. Is this the original engine to this Bus.
3. Engine bay
Here is my biggest problem. As mentioned the Bus will be restored and it seems like some wannabe mechanic somehow put that engine in the Bus. I post some pictures here and always put my question below.
3.1 Engine Cover Sheet towards Bus body
In the Picture below you see the blue marked area. This sheet is self made and just wrong. Also you can see a massive gap between engine and the sheet. I looked the internet up and down and found the following item (please check link). Is this the part I need?
https://eu.vwheritage.com/211119598-engine-tinware-kit-front-rear-1600cc-vw-spare
3.2. Engine mounts
Ok looking underneath the Bus I found these ridiculous engine mounts (see red arrow). I mean there is no way VW made it like this??? Please can anybody advise or send me a pic of how it should look like.
I am really looking forward towards you support and hope you can enlighten me with some info on this Bus.
Thanks Ben
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:00 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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it appears your bus originally had a 1972 type 4 motor in it. The mounts do look home made but probably work fine. You will never restore that bus to original without replacing the motor with an original one but you can make it look nice and enjoy it with that engine.
222 is a beginning prefix for a 1972 bus (7 or 9 passenger).
From type 2.com:
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The Chassis number (1970-1979)
Busses of model years 1970 until 1979 have a chassis number that consists of 10 digits.
The first two of them are not displayed on the option plate, but you can find them on your registration papers and in the back near the engine. These two numbers indicate the model:
21 Van (no windows in cargo compartment)
22 Microbus
23 Kombi (windows in cargo compartment)
24 Microbus Deluxe
26 Pick-up
27 Ambulance
The third digit (the first on the options plate) stands for the model year. For example "7" stands for 1977. The model year runs from August of the previous year until July in the actual year. So Model year 1977 started in August 1976 and ended in July 1977.
The fourth digit (the second on the options plate) is a "2" on all busses. I have no idea why.
The number that remains is a serial number. |
_________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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TomWesty Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2007 Posts: 3482 Location: Wyoming,USA
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Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:10 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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That motor mount setup looks like it should work okay. The tinware from vwheritage looks correct to me, but I would get a second opinion from a European bus owner as well. _________________ If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music! |
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ben_dubai Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2016 Posts: 19 Location: Dubai
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Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:12 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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Hello SKKent,
Thanks for you reply. So you mean there is no original sheet metal I could buy in order to fit that engine properly in? So basically I need to custom make the sheet to close the gap to engine etc?
But I thought also the 1972 came with a 1600 engine for a while or is my engine just a different 1600 not fitting the Bus? |
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alman72 Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2014 Posts: 2573 Location: MICHIGAN
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Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:01 am Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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ben_dubai wrote: |
Hello SKKent,
Thanks for you reply. So you mean there is no original sheet metal I could buy in order to fit that engine properly in? So basically I need to custom make the sheet to close the gap to engine etc?
But I thought also the 1972 came with a 1600 engine for a while or is my engine just a different 1600 not fitting the Bus? |
euro spec did, US spec did not. not sure if the engine bays were EXACTLY the same or not. |
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kreemoweet Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2008 Posts: 3897 Location: Seattle, WA
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16954 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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Read this thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=483408&highlight=installing+type _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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ben_dubai Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2016 Posts: 19 Location: Dubai
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Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:45 am Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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Thank you so much everybody. This was soooooo helpful and all my open questions are answered. Its really great to have your support and knowledge. Will post a pic once finished
Regards
Ben |
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bus guy Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2002 Posts: 785 Location: Southsea, UK South Coast
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Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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In Europe we got the upright engine through 79. That tinware is the stuff you need - fortunately it is now being reproduced, as it used to be unobtainable. Your bus has the 68-71 rear support bar - the 72-79 Euro has a different bar and mounts that bolt to the frame - I probably have some mount brackets and bar somewhere but shipping would be steep from the UK. If you need any advice about parts etc feel free to DM me. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50334
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Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:17 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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I think your engine mounts are going to give problems. A second bolt through the frame rail lower down would help stabilize the mount, but the mount is still going to be flimsy and subject to bending and/or fatigue failure. |
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TomWesty Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2007 Posts: 3482 Location: Wyoming,USA
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Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:04 pm Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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Wildthings wrote: |
I think your engine mounts are going to give problems. A second bolt through the frame rail lower down would help stabilize the mount, but the mount is still going to be flimsy and subject to bending and/or fatigue failure. |
It’s also possible you could have issues in the vertical axis with the tin lining up since the mounts are not stock. _________________ If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music! |
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bus guy Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2002 Posts: 785 Location: Southsea, UK South Coast
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Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:33 am Post subject: Re: 1972 with 1600 cc engine. I need some specialists!!! |
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bus guy wrote: |
In Europe we got the upright engine through 79. That tinware is the stuff you need - fortunately it is now being reproduced, as it used to be unobtainable. Your bus has the 68-71 rear support bar - the 72-79 Euro has a different bar and mounts that bolt to the frame - I probably have some mount brackets and bar somewhere but shipping would be steep from the UK. If you need any advice about parts etc feel free to DM me. |
Here are the above mount brackets and support bar - as fitted to my ‘72 Swedish Single Cab - supplied new with the upright type 1 1600 engine. The rubber mounts are still available new.
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