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buseric
Samba Member
Joined: May 03, 2004
Posts: 1745
Location: In the woods, Ontario
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 Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:04 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 17029
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:30 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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Looks like it may be the same bus, but aren't those logos just a vinyl wrap?
Bus looks better without the logo and graphics IMHO. Still a weird mish-mash of parts and colors.
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Busstom 
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2014
Posts: 1640
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
And that's one of the main reasons, I believe, that people price their wares so high: for concern that scumbags like this will pull this kind of shit. |
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Busstom
Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2014
Posts: 1640
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:56 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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I guess he misjudged the market: now he "MUST SELL."
This is the one he dredged out of Colorado some months ago and posted these pics before he ever made it home to the Bay Area...notice he removed the pic with the name of the establishment that enabled me to trace it to Colorado. And the new ad date indicates that he let it drop out and reposted it later, else it would show some crazy time on the market.
And funny that it "kneeds" a front floor, but no pic of the mess that lies in wait. And how the rockers have rust, but he'd "just leave it."
$15K now $12? Can't recall what it was many pages back, don't care to search either.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2314691
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AS350driver
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2016
Posts: 756
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:14 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
Unfortunately, the split bus forum is infested with flippers and those that vociferously defend them, think they’re good for the hobby, etc.
I’m sure the flipper appreciates the spare parts he got by lying to you and convincing you he was buying it to “complete” it. |
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AS350driver
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2016
Posts: 756
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:23 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| Busstom wrote: |
| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
And that's one of the main reasons, I believe, that people price their wares so high: for concern that scumbags like this will pull this kind of shit. |
Very, very true. |
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obus
Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2001
Posts: 9031
Location: just off Garden State Parkway Exit 81
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 5:37 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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it is the reason i stopped selling parts on here and especially at shows. I'd rather my Family give it to my serious VW friends when i croak then sell it for a "bro deal" and see the guy flip it right away
_________________
| ScideHornet wrote: |
| Hey man, thats a green mango ....... |
----------------------------------------------------
http://instagram.com/vwbusbuc
----------------------------------------------------
**PARTS WANTED:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=527289
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2034690
---------------------------------------------
early July 1959 Mango Standard Bus aka Obus
June 1973 Pumpkin Orange Thing aka Othing |
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buseric
Samba Member
Joined: May 03, 2004
Posts: 1745
Location: In the woods, Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| AS350driver wrote: |
| Busstom wrote: |
| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
And that's one of the main reasons, I believe, that people price their wares so high: for concern that scumbags like this will pull this kind of shit. |
Very, very true. |
It was for sale for some time at $4.5 - 5k. I will be surprised if it sells anywhere near that. |
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 62557
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:30 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| Busstom wrote: |
I guess he misjudged the market: now he "MUST SELL."
This is the one he dredged out of Colorado some months ago and posted these pics before he ever made it home to the Bay Area...notice he removed the pic with the name of the establishment that enabled me to trace it to Colorado. And the new ad date indicates that he let it drop out and reposted it later, else it would show some crazy time on the market.
And funny that it "kneeds" a front floor, but no pic of the mess that lies in wait. And how the rockers have rust, but he'd "just leave it."
$15K now $12? Can't recall what it was many pages back, don't care to search either.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2314691
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It looks like it was $20K the first time
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 62557
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 8228
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:54 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| AS350driver wrote: |
| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
Unfortunately, the split bus forum is infested with flippers and those that vociferously defend them, think they’re good for the hobby, etc.
I’m sure the flipper appreciates the spare parts he got by lying to you and convincing you he was buying it to “complete” it. |
Again, we live in a market economy, capitalism, etc. deal with it. Flippers can be good, bad or otherwise. Lying to sellers or buyers is simply not cool.
Sometimes though, these things have a way of working out. If a flipper puts out $5k, and tries unsuccessfully to sell said bus for $10k, or whatever, they are still out the $5k while it is unsold. So they don't have that money to buy a nicer bus, and they are not competition for whomever is trying to buy a bus. Also, whomever buys (or recently bought) this bus at any price is not good at math. The bus is obviously a steaming pile-o-shit that can never economically compare to a nice bus.
The more people are educated about the economics of owning a good bus, the less flippers will make selling bad buses. I think this topic might help in that regard. And it gives all a place to complain, which is our national hobby as far as I can tell.
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AS350driver
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2016
Posts: 756
Location: Tucson
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:00 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| Lind wrote: |
| AS350driver wrote: |
| buseric wrote: |
Speaking of mango whines. I sold this bus on Friday for $3700. That was a fair price. $10k is not. Any potential buyers should ask for a lot of pictures. Frame is rusty. I don't really care if he makes money but I threw in extra parts to help him complete it etc. and it's listed here again less than 48hrs later. It was so great 25 years ago when the community was cool and people helped each other out, because nothing was worth enough money to bother flipping. A big thanks to all my good friends on here who still live by that accord.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2321953 |
Unfortunately, the split bus forum is infested with flippers and those that vociferously defend them, think they’re good for the hobby, etc.
I’m sure the flipper appreciates the spare parts he got by lying to you and convincing you he was buying it to “complete” it. |
Again, we live in a market economy, capitalism, etc. deal with it. Flippers can be good, bad or otherwise. Lying to sellers or buyers is simply not cool.
Sometimes though, these things have a way of working out. If a flipper puts out $5k, and tries unsuccessfully to sell said bus for $10k, or whatever, they are still out the $5k while it is unsold. So they don't have that money to buy a nicer bus, and they are not competition for whomever is trying to buy a bus. Also, whomever buys (or recently bought) this bus at any price is not good at math. The bus is obviously a steaming pile-o-shit that can never economically compare to a nice bus.
The more people are educated about the economics of owning a good bus, the less flippers will make selling bad buses. I think this topic might help in that regard. And it gives all a place to complain, which is our national hobby as far as I can tell. |
Though a very complex way to analyze it, I can’t definitively say you’re wrong in anything you state. Much I agree with, ie educating people. I will say, however, that if the bus had genuinely landed in the hands of a legit end user for $3700, that really just wanted a bus to fix up, it would be another bus back on the road sooner. If that legit end user was at least a little handy mechanically, to at least to do brakes, fuel tank ....easy stuff, the bus could end up being economically viable for them, even with paying a shop to do the metal work. The bus in question needs serious metal work, but not all are *that* bad, but you get the idea.
Instead, a flipper got it, so to make his money for speculating on it, now the end user will ultimately have to pay more.... meanwhile the bus sits and continues to rot into oblivion until the flipper flips it. And the flippers typically glean off the original parts and flip those as well, to maximize their profit, making it even more difficult for the end user, the guy that just wants a bus, to get it back on the road.
Yes, it’s capitalism, and legal.... but still harmful. We can hope he sits on it forever and never makes a penny on it, but that would also mean the bus probably never gets back on the road.
Too bad it didn’t go to an honest enthusiast. Educating ....another variation..... if more people knew values of buses better, there wouldn’t be as many targets of opportunity for flippers , for example, the unwitting 75 year old lady that put my 65 subhatch up on craigslist for $1500. After she found out a bit more about current values, she literally had threats against her safety and security from some of the initial flippers that had called and thought they had some sort of claim on it. |
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djfordmanjack
Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 1314
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:55 pm Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| Quote: |
| they need reconditioning |
reconditioning? 
one has a broken flange and the other was cracked and brazed to hell. $5 scrap metal or maybe $50 for donor parts and levers.
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 8228
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:01 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| AS350driver wrote: |
Yes, it’s capitalism, and legal.... but still harmful. We can hope he sits on it forever and never makes a penny on it, but that would also mean the bus probably never gets back on the road.
Too bad it didn’t go to an honest enthusiast. Educating ....another variation..... if more people knew values of buses better, there wouldn’t be as many targets of opportunity for flippers , for example, the unwitting 75 year old lady that put my 65 subhatch up on craigslist for $1500. After she found out a bit more about current values, she literally had threats against her safety and security from some of the initial flippers that had called and thought they had some sort of claim on it. |
I get it that you outbid the flippers on your bus, but you could have also outbid some legit honest buyer who would have been happy to own it just like you, but didn't have the money to play the market price split bus game these days. Some sellers want it to go to the first person to contact them, some want it to go to the most money, some want it to go to the best home. For some their definition of the best home is the one that pays the most money. The better a deal is for one person, the worse it is for the other person. Welcome to capitalism and inefficient markets. There is no real moral high ground in this debate, we just have to deal with the fact that the market is the way it is, and we can do very little to change it. In the case of a person vastly underpricing a car on CL, they usually figure it out pretty quick because of the competition from flippers and consumers alike. In your case, it certainly seems that both your bus found the right owner, and you found the right bus. I am stoked that you found a good bus, and had the good sense to wait for the right one and make the right moves to get it. Notice how your bus is up and driving and having fun? that is what it is all about. (The fact that it is a special Westfalia with a rare and cool mix of option/year/color is icing on the cake.)
Is there anyone here who would like to own that poor mango bus? Anyone thinking that they would like to do $10K+ in metal work, and still have a bus with rust in every body seam of the half of the body which they didn't replace? Seriously, if anyone is reading this and that is their idea of a good time and a good investment, please pipe up.
The honest, educated and wise enthusiast never even considers fixing a bus like that because they could own two nicer ones for the same money. This seller is looking for the uneducated, unwise buyer who has big dreams and lots of money to spend on what is actually a nightmare. While that buyer does exist occasionally, but usually someone has already separated that fool from his money.
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House
Minutia Militia
Joined: June 13, 2001
Posts: 1336
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:46 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| Lind wrote: |
| Is there anyone here who would like to own that poor mango bus? |
I would!
(For a few hundred bucks). There are some nice parts on there...
Seriously, I can't believe Eric got $3700 for it...  |
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 62557
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| House wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Is there anyone here who would like to own that poor mango bus? |
I would!
(For a few hundred bucks). There are some nice parts on there...
Seriously, I can't believe Eric got $3700 for it... |
I see some decent interior panels to steal for a nicer Mango Bus 
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How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19038
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:01 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| AS350driver wrote: |
Instead, a flipper got it, so to make his money for speculating on it, now the end user will ultimately have to pay more.... meanwhile the bus sits and continues to rot into oblivion until the flipper flips it. And the flippers typically glean off the original parts and flip those as well, to maximize their profit, making it even more difficult for the end user, the guy that just wants a bus, to get it back on the road.
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The bus we are talking about looks to be a parts bus. The best education one can get in this hobby other than value of buses and parts is to know who the full time flippers are before getting into a transaction with them. When I see those guys coming I adjust my asking price accordingly.
We all flip stuff at one point or another.
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| HamburgerBrad wrote: |
I slept on crofty's tent once. I passed out drunk from two bottles of Everett's brother's wine. |
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Dibaltic
Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2007
Posts: 366
Location: Chambersburg, Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:04 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| YellowSplittie wrote: |
| Dustin B wrote: |
I'm pretty sure he comes up with all his prices from Barret Jackson. I looked at all his adds and he also has a 60's rag top beetle barn find for $20k. Funny thing is I stumped across him on Facebook selling a set of Bice bumpers for $400. He got a bunch of messages including a couple offers for twice the price and now there listed here for $2500. |
He's also been running illegal raffles for these cars over on Facebook. https://www.facebook.com/staytunedclassics |
I like how he has them for sale here on thesamba while he is raffling them on Instagram and Facebook |
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 11268
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:57 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| Busstom wrote: |
I guess he misjudged the market: now he "MUST SELL."
This is the one he dredged out of Colorado some months ago and posted these pics before he ever made it home to the Bay Area...notice he removed the pic with the name of the establishment that enabled me to trace it to Colorado. And the new ad date indicates that he let it drop out and reposted it later, else it would show some crazy time on the market.
And funny that it "kneeds" a front floor, but no pic of the mess that lies in wait. And how the rockers have rust, but he'd "just leave it."
$15K now $12? Can't recall what it was many pages back, don't care to search either.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2314691
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It looks like it was $20K the first time |
Bus is not even a roller. It has a good look, though.
I do like that headliner:
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 7399
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:29 am Post subject: Re: Official whine about Buses and parts for sale |
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I'm convinced that low priced rusty, clapped out POS buses are far easier to sell than medium to high priced buses because your are selling an affordable dream. Once the reality sets in, I think those vehicles get kicked down the road like a can for years until they see find their true level which is either a cut rate project price or a parts bus.
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1956 Ghia
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