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How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!!
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jkidd152
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:18 am    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

My anecdotal story:
A couple years ago, an afternoon snow storm hit and the school buses were unable to get to the school in order to bring the kids home. I drove my van through an absolute mess of stuck or stranded vehicles to get to the school. It was fun ignoring typical traffic patterns, and the syncro never slipped. All the kids were waiting in the gym. I rescued my 2 and the neighbors kids.
It was the Great Syncro Rescue of 2016.

Anyway, the syncro with the VC is a great AWD vehicle but having decent tires and knowing how to drive in inclement weather are paramount.



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Did I mention I love my van? Laughing
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0to60in6min
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:45 am    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

is it correct to assume that you have 2 gas tanks?
and what tire brans/type are you using?

thanks
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jkidd152
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:58 am    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

0to60in6min wrote:
is it correct to assume that you have 2 gas tanks?
and what tire brans/type are you using?

thanks


No, it was a 2wd. I converted it to a syncro. Tires are General Grabbers 215/65/16s I think
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flomulgator
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:59 am    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Wildthings wrote:
Was driving my Snycro in wet snow conditions and pulled to a stop at an intersection. Couldn't get it to move when it was my turn to go. The snow and ice had built up around the fore-aft drive line and when I stopped it froze solid to the drive line and I had to crawl underneath and chip it away to get the van to move. Have also had snow and ice pull the plastic tubing for the throttle cable down and back causing a full throttle condition, which was not cool. Also once got a piece of rope wrapped around the drive line which like the slush, froze the driveline solidly in place.


Wildthings here with the Real Talk!
I've experienced most of these. I've had the most problems when ascending from warm lowlands, through a slushy road elevation zone, and up into the sub-freezing zone. In that situation I've had slush freeze to the throttle cable and more commonly to the shift linkage (I have an '87 without the tube). Never had the driveline freeze up though, that sounds unpleasant. The ultimate solution would be panels that attach to the undercarriage sealing off the mid-underbody like a modern car. I've been dreaming about that for years. In the meantime, I just bought GoWesty's "shift linkage protector"; it was designed to stop rock bashing but I think it may have real value in eliminating slush/ice buildup in this critical part of the underbody. Hope it works!
Just to be clear, most of the time driving in the snow is uneventful, just if you do it enough occasional problematic conditions will reveal these issues.
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Last edited by flomulgator on Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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raoul mitgong
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:00 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5et-agrs3Qo

Stock VC, unlocked diffs, Nokian WRC tires. Many times I've driven around cars on the highway like it was a slalom course. Tires make a big difference.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:03 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Mine has a stock VC, ZF Limited Slip, and Cooper Discoverer AT's that have been siped. It is, thus far, unstoppable in snow. Even the "Bomb Cyclone" thing last winter in Denver which featured a head wind that actually pushed my wiper arms down to grill level. I was the only vehicle on the road during the height of the storm and the van tracked really well.

With the little bit of give that slick/soft surfaces provide, the drive line is actually quieter and smoother. I love it.

It's probably worth noting that I don't drive like an a-hole and allow a lot of space for braking...

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:10 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Wildthings wrote:
The snow and ice had built up around the fore-aft drive line and when I stopped it froze solid to the drive line and I had to crawl underneath and chip it away to get the van to move.


I had a similar problem with my shift rod after a storm.

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"get metaphysical with it. if it's simply a means to get to and from places, it will let you down. if it becomes your zen, it can't fail you." -dabaron

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Syncro Jael
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Worth all the money you can spend! My son was working at Breckenridge Resort, sleeping in his van, and an overnight storm did this. They heard the plows go by and decided they better see what was going on. His girl friend, now wife, filmed him driving out from the camp spot.


Link

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Syncro Jael
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:14 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

[quote="joetiger"]
Wildthings wrote:
The snow and ice had built up around the fore-aft drive line and when I stopped it froze solid to the drive line and I had to crawl underneath and chip it away to get the van to move.


I had a similar problem with my shift rod after a storm.

I have had this happen until I was lucky to get a factory tube that surrounds the shifting rod. Never an issue since.
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Syncro Jael
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:16 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

But there are always adventures in the snow!

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joetiger Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:22 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Syncro Jael wrote:


I have had this happen until I was lucky to get a factory tube that surrounds the shifting rod. Never an issue since.


I searched for one for awhile with no luck, then my attention moved elsewhere...Maybe I'll take up the search again!
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"get metaphysical with it. if it's simply a means to get to and from places, it will let you down. if it becomes your zen, it can't fail you." -dabaron

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AllRad
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:22 pm    Post subject: ! Reply with quote

gears wrote:
In an uphill black ice situation (a few years ago), I was completely stuck (along with everyone else). My vacuum check valve was faulty. But the moment the 4WD did engage, the van lurched forward and around all the other stuck vehicles. The Syncro is worth every penny during winter months.


...that's what I'm talking about!

Unless your stuck in deep snow, I do not think engaging the locker would be a good thing. In any case, I never felt the need. My experience is with heavy/wet snow near Seattle and compact snow/ice at the passes. Granted I am not inundated by the stuff, and I see most of it on ski trips. But before you midwesterners scoff, remember this -- we have HILLS, and hordes of CALIFORNIANS, who routinely drive into the nearest ditch. Shocked

I feel like the Syncro does something special. I suspect it's the analog nature of how the VC feeds power to the wheels(?) Must be some kind of engineering accident. Maybe they knew what they were doing!
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jkidd152
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:46 pm    Post subject: Re: ! Reply with quote

AllRad wrote:

I feel like the Syncro does something special. I suspect it's the analog nature of how the VC feeds power to the wheels(?) Must be some kind of engineering accident. Maybe they knew what they were doing!


I have had a bunch of different AWD/4WD vehicles. I feel like the power to weight ratio of the Syncro is what sets it apart from the rest.
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0to60in6min
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:14 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

on my Syncro the shift rod is inside a tube about 5" diameter and 5ft long front to back.. I am not sure it's OEM or not... but I'd think it's easy to add.
no problem with accumulated and frozen solid snow.

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big swifty
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:02 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

I live in Vermont and I'm a firm believer is dedicated winter tires. I don't want to start a debate about studs vs non-studded but I REALLY like studs. I have owned a 4WD suburban, Audi Quattro's, a BMW 325ix and of course the Syncro. Studded snows for all of them. The Syncro and the BMW are by far, the best out of all of them. Of course speed kills in crappy conditions...you have to drive intelligently.
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4Gears4Tires
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:30 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

^ YES! The 325ix! I have two. They are absolute beasts in the snow with center and rear viscous LSDs. I have stopped on steep snow and ice covered hills, clutch dropped at redline, and scooted up the hill. Having 3 tires locked down with LSDs makes for a lot of fun driving in adverse conditions. Appropriate tires are a must of course.


Link


joetiger wrote:
Mine has a stock VC, ZF Limited Slip, and Cooper Discoverer AT's that have been siped. It is, thus far, unstoppable in snow.


That LSD is the ticket. I'd much rather have an LSD than a rear locker. Much more useful in 99.9% of driving situations.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:11 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Is that a Eurovan at 1:24?
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:52 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

4Gears4Tires wrote:

That LSD is the ticket. I'd much rather have an LSD than a rear locker. Much more useful in 99.9% of driving situations.


I disagree wholeheartedly, but then again I'm in a Syncro that is set up for off-road use, and actually go there often. An experienced driver having complete control over their traction devices is critical, but the layman, snow driver or seldom off-roader probably is better off with a limited slip.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 7:52 pm    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

Syncro in the snow are awesome. But remember it's all about the tires. In Quebec (where I am from), it is mandatory from Dec 1st to March 15th.


A University of Michigan 2016 study entitled "Ten Surprising Findings About Winter Tires: It Is Not Just About Snow" helped break down what winter tires really do. The ten findings?


-The main benefit of winter tires is improved tire adhesion, braking and cornering performance — not acceleration, though it helps there, too.

-Winter tires provide improved traction on roads below 7°C (45°F) even when snow and ice are not present.

-Stopping distances for winter tires on packed snow are approximately 35 per cent shorter than for all-season tires; and 50 per cent shorter than for summer tires.

-Winter tire improvements in stopping distance also extend to improvements in cornering capability.

-Tires designated as “mud” and “snow” tires do not necessarily perform well on packed snow and ice. Tires without the 3PMSF symbol were found to require 40 per cent longer stopping distances than similar tires with the symbol.

-Tires with aggressive treads will not necessarily perform well in slippery winter conditions unless they have the 3PMSF symbol.

-In Canada, during the winter period from December to February, there is a reported 49-per-cent increase in insurance claims. Much of this elevated risk is attributable to slippery road conditions in winter. Winter tires reduce crash frequency during winter months.

-A two-wheel-drive vehicle with winter tires will outperform a four-wheel-drive vehicle with all-season tires in braking and cornering. The perception that four-wheel-drive vehicles do not require winter tires in cold climates is false.

-Crash-avoidance technologies such as electronic stability control depend on tire adhesion to function. Winter tires are becoming increasingly important rather than less important as vehicle technology matures.

-It is imperative winter tires be fitted to all four wheels and not just the driven wheels of a two-wheel-drive vehicle.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:28 am    Post subject: Re: How are Syncros in the snow?!? Tell me your stories!! Reply with quote

SyncroChrick wrote:
Syncro in the snow are awesome. But remember it's all about the tires. In Quebec (where I am from), it is mandatory from Dec 1st to March 15th.


A University of Michigan 2016 study entitled "Ten Surprising Findings About Winter Tires: It Is Not Just About Snow" helped break down what winter tires really do. The ten findings?


-The main benefit of winter tires is improved tire adhesion, braking and cornering performance — not acceleration, though it helps there, too.

-Winter tires provide improved traction on roads below 7°C (45°F) even when snow and ice are not present.

-Stopping distances for winter tires on packed snow are approximately 35 per cent shorter than for all-season tires; and 50 per cent shorter than for summer tires.

-Winter tire improvements in stopping distance also extend to improvements in cornering capability.

-Tires designated as “mud” and “snow” tires do not necessarily perform well on packed snow and ice. Tires without the 3PMSF symbol were found to require 40 per cent longer stopping distances than similar tires with the symbol.

-Tires with aggressive treads will not necessarily perform well in slippery winter conditions unless they have the 3PMSF symbol.

-In Canada, during the winter period from December to February, there is a reported 49-per-cent increase in insurance claims. Much of this elevated risk is attributable to slippery road conditions in winter. Winter tires reduce crash frequency during winter months.

-A two-wheel-drive vehicle with winter tires will outperform a four-wheel-drive vehicle with all-season tires in braking and cornering. The perception that four-wheel-drive vehicles do not require winter tires in cold climates is false.

-Crash-avoidance technologies such as electronic stability control depend on tire adhesion to function. Winter tires are becoming increasingly important rather than less important as vehicle technology matures.

-It is imperative winter tires be fitted to all four wheels and not just the driven wheels of a two-wheel-drive vehicle.

Well said, and from my years of experience with Winter Driving and AWD, 2 wheel and 4 Wheel drive vehicles, VERY accurate.
I hate spending the money on a 2nd set of tires as much as the next person for one of our vehicles until I'm driving in conditions that are not great for all season tires but are easy for my Winter Tires. Then I forget about the extra cost of tires and rims and enjoy my safe progress in my vehicles while Winter Driving. Razz Very Happy Very Happy
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