Fix that Poptop push bar!

[kguarnotta]

would love to hear feedback on the ball bearing solution from a customer...

I like the washer solution, but that ball bearing one sounds very like german over engineering...I like it.
_________________
-Kevin
Lincoln, MA

'86 Triple Knob Syncro w/EJ22
'78 Westy
'69 Single Cab
'65 Kombi - EZ-Camper

[koubiak]

So I got my packet. The packaging was perfect and the hardware looks nice quality.

I did not start earlier on this because I got busy with a coolant leak that is now fixed that took me quite some times.

Me and a friend (bless his soul) started the project and hit two glitches.

Small return of experience so far.
1) Lift the poptop a little before trying to remove the caps/rivets that holds the mechanism. You will have a better access. At the end that was not too hard.
2) Removing the pin on the un-dammaged side was easy but on the other side that was a pain the but because it was not straight anymore. A little grease goes a long way.
3) The spring mechanism is not as scary as I thought. If you are careful and do one at a time it is fine.
4) Note that not all pushbar are serviceable. Mine was bore all the way living a couple of mm left. I am lucky it did not break on me early to create more catastrophic problem. We had to break it because we could not get it out. We use a painter knife to make the cut and it broke clean off.
5) Cutting the hole for the bearing. Relatively easy with a hacksaw.
6) Getting the metal piece nice and snug is hard. I need to get a better way to grind some of the welding.

I need some help to source a pushbar. A quick google search as not lead to a good result yet. Any idea of someone who has one in the USofA ?

You can see how misaligned the whole mechanism is...

I have a water infiltration that need some attending. Is syslicon a solution here. or do i need to some reinforcement?

It does not want to come out.

Clean break

The other part ...

Dremel is good but not powerful enough to make the cut

[koubiak]

So far I found this reseller in Germany https://www.werk-4.com/vw-t3-westfalia/querstange-t3/#cc-m-product-10189995352 at this point I should have gotten a fully new mechanism from them... I would have been simpler.



Bus depot as one but only for T2 I think https://www.busdepot.com/231070715 ... I will keep on searching

[Sodo]

[Vanagon Nut]

So here's some images showing wear after a fair amount of use over the last 10 years or so.

I knew the copper "everyman" fix was not a great idea, and it shows, but aside from me ending up making one cable a bit longer than the other, I think my cable design has held up quite well. No fraying that I can see. Not sure why a strut arm is bent. Not sure I'll straighten it either; tent is a German "tight fit" type. I plan to weld in pipe in lieu of copper so hopefully any dimensional changes won't cause the tent to tear or seams to start pulling too hard.

Enjoy the carnage and good times.

Neil.

Driver side? Wear is obvious. The copper piece, as anticipated, spun in hole. I put slugs of bolt in each end of push bar so it would've taken years of use for wear to actually become an issue.

passenger side? It held up quite well. Epoxy was still holding copper in place.

Looking again, maybe the copper was rotating at both joints
< shrugs >

No fraying. Drilled those by hand!

As I posted before, these were swaged on by marine shop

no fraying, holding up great. IIRC, I used a proper swage tool at marine shop to install the crimped piece.

These holes in each arm appear ovalled to my eye. Theory: lateral play and or tendency for one arm to get pushed forward sooner than the other, allowed push bar to hog them oval.

driver side bar is bent. I'm right handed so I don't think I did that. LOL.

_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA

1988 West DIY 50º ABA

VE7TBN

[koubiak]

OK. I am in touch with Buslab in berkeley to find a replacement.

The bar is steel. What the return on https://www.gowesty.com/product/paint-prep-/24424/interior-paint- color match for that?

[Vanagon Nut]

So I got it done.

I used the "iron pipe" method to bolster the upper arm where it rides on push bar. There was appreciable play between the bar and new pipe bits so I ran a few beads of weld along each end of the push bar to take up the play. This worked, until I tried to install the push bar through the hole shown below. Oops.

So that was a WOT.

By the time the top is pushed up, any small amount of play between push bar and bearing surface is pretty moot.

Since my then new "tight fit German" tent was installed after the first push bar repair, it didn't feel like this second repair added stress to the tent. i.e. it didn't raise the top any more. I have to wonder how that would've worked if I'd installed that new tent to a pop top with a really worn push bar, then repaired the bar.

As a warning to any other amateur weldors like me, AFAIK, the push bar material is plated possibly with zinc. Smoke from that stuff is harmful to breath so when welding, don't huff it in.

As an alternative to the big washer method, I found it took little time with a file to enlarge ID of m18 washers. I'd thought to weld a pair to each side of push bar bearing surface.

Neil.

[Andymon]

Cut off both ends of ours and inserted a steel rod and then redrilled the hole. then, tack welded in a set of needle bearings that fit into the hold. Smooth now.

[/img]
_________________
"Blanch" '85 Westy
"Too many freaks and not enough circuses".

[Vanagon Nut]

[Kombi///M3]

[Ahwahnee]

[koubiak]

I got the bar (that I painted brown) and finished installing it today. It feels a lot more robust than before. Super happy to have fixed that one!

[Nuthin2It]

Not having a welder, I came up with another fix for this problem. I do have a good assortment of woodworking tools and have always wanted to work with Delrin, so decided to see if that would work. Will Delrin last as well as the werk-4.com ball bearings repair? Of course not. The werk-4.com solution should last forever. But in reality neither me nor my van will last forever.

The Delrin I used is 3/8" thick, so it has a much larger surface contact area than the original steel cross piece that the lift bar rotates against. In addition, I got Delrin with PTFE filler ($$$), so there should be considerably less friction and wear than unlubricated steel against steel. Hopefully this will give a useful extended life to the lift bar. I hope someone more familiar with the properties of Delrin will comment on the use of this material.

One end of my lift bar had a ridge on the inside under the wear groove. It was just about to perforate and accelerate the rate of wear considerably.

I got a 6" X 6" X 3/8" sheet of PTFE filled Delrin from McMaster-Carr. Before cutting it, I made a wood template of the inside of the crossbar joint. Note the brown Sharpie marks on the cross bar. That's the only section that the cross bar rubs against, thus the only section where you really need something for the bar to push against. Maybe someone can come up with an idea for using this in their own repair.

Using a top bearing flush trim router bit, I cut the rough cut Delrin insert to final shape.

I mounted the Delrin in the joint and bolted it in with garage door bolts. Then I drilled a hole in the center slightly smaller than the cross bar hole using a Forstner bit.

I used the same flush trim router bit to cut the center hole to final size. I thought about how to cut the hole in the Delrin slightly smaller than the hole in the joint cross piece to reduce steel again steel wear, but realized I already have a conveniently placed groove in the cross bar to eliminate contact!

Here's the finished job. If you look carefully, you'll see that the Delrin is not flush with the edge of the joint all the way around. That's not my poor workmanship. The cross bar was welded in cock-eyed. It's hard to believe that a German worker could walk away from such a sloppy job, but they did.

It's a real pleasure to open the top now. Nice and smooth.
_________________
1985 Westfalia 15 degree EA288 Boxeer

[Jake de Villiers]

I like that solution, Nuthin'! It just so happens that I have some Delrin on hand here...

What did you use for lubrication?
_________________
'84 Vanagon GL 1.9 WBX
'86 Westy Weekender Poptop/2.5 Subaru/5 Speed Posi/Audi Front Brakes/16 x 7 Mercedes Wheels - answers to 'Dixie'
@jakedevilliersmusic1
http://sites.google.com/site/subyjake/mydixiedarlin%27
www.crescentbeachguitar.com
www.thebassspa.com

[ragnarhairybreeks]

Hey jake,

He used ptfe Delrin, no need for lube.
Even un modified Delrin wouldn't need lube, the Teflon additive though is a great idea.

Nice work.

Alistair
_________________
'86 7 passenger syncro, converted to westy pop top, project still in progress
'82 westy, diesel converted to gas in '94, now gone...
https://shufti.blog/
Old address still works...
http://shufti.wordpress.com

[dhaavers]

Yup, this gets ALL my votes today...

- Dave
_________________
86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS>

[Jake de Villiers]

[ragnarhairybreeks]

Hi jake,

I machine Delrin almost every week, and mostly for fixture type things. When I have made bearing type things what I noticed with Delrin is that it is great once moving but has an initial stiction.

But in this application that’s a moot point. I don’t think any lube needed, tri flow lube would be fine but I’d say not needed.

Alistair
_________________
'86 7 passenger syncro, converted to westy pop top, project still in progress
'82 westy, diesel converted to gas in '94, now gone...
https://shufti.blog/
Old address still works...
http://shufti.wordpress.com

[Jake de Villiers]

Thanks, Alistair - its that initial reluctance I was thinking about.
_________________
'84 Vanagon GL 1.9 WBX
'86 Westy Weekender Poptop/2.5 Subaru/5 Speed Posi/Audi Front Brakes/16 x 7 Mercedes Wheels - answers to 'Dixie'
@jakedevilliersmusic1
http://sites.google.com/site/subyjake/mydixiedarlin%27
www.crescentbeachguitar.com
www.thebassspa.com

[Franklinstower]

I inspected my push bar, and there was no wear yet, however, while it was off, I added uhmw to both sides to increase the surface area and limit the chances of future failure.

_________________
'89 Westy - EJ25/22 Frank 4.44 5mt
'75 Miami Blue Sunroof FI Standard Bug