vanagons: (86 up) -vs- (85 down)

[ad9me3]

I have an opportunity to purchase an 85 Westy in great mechanical condition, but so many say do not get any year other than an 86 and above. CAN SOMEONE (pre-86 vanagon owners) ARGUE AGAINST THIS???

First, I do not care about speed (I love to drive slow and view life passing by).

Second, I do not want to purchase a vehicle that is going to be in the shop all the time (are pre 86 vanagons defective or something???) - I am not a mechanic.

I want something totally fun to drive on my (20 mile) commute and to take my kids camping.

Are there members out there owning a pre 86 westy that recommend them???

I actually met a couple of diesel westy owners in Santa Cruz who stated the most reliable and economical vanagons are the air-cooled
Thanks Everyone

[pocvw]

Ok, now this is strictly my opinion....I am an aircooled guy, and I love my '80 Westy! I believe that aircooled motors, when kept in good working order, are just as reliable as watercooleds (probably more reliable than an original vanagon watercooled motor). However, someday, I would LOVE to own a syncro, and those are watercooled; however, it will not have the original watercooled motor in it - I will put a crate motor (brand new motor) in it.

Aircooled motors don't last as long (probably could get up to 150,00 miles on them) before they become troublesome and would need a rebuild. The advantage of watercooled motors is that you can get those things brand new, whereas an aircooled motor can only be rebuilt, and you can't get those new. My '80 westy has about 1,000 miles on her rebuild and she is running beautifully (check out the pics in my gallery).

Well, good luck on your decision. Vanagons rule!!
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1980 VW Westfalia

[weinerwagen]

I can't argue with my 2.1, it got 23 mpg yesterday even with the AC on 1/2 the trip. I have a 1.9 that only gets 17...go figure!

fuel went like this

1st leg: 86 miles, took 3.7 gallons.
2nd leg: 250 took 10.9 (AC ran most of the way)

ran 60-65 on mostly level ground, two small dog leg hills
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[levi]

I've got an 85 and an 86.......not a damn thing wrong with that 85, cept for bein slow. For 4 years I lived out of that 85 driving all over this country playing poker tournaments, and it only only had one problem (a minor one), the fuel pump (that was 100$ and 30 minutes). There are things that are known to be bad though.....like the 3-4 hub fracture (in the tranny). Apparently every pre 86 has this problem, though at 160,000 I haven't hit it yet. You can read more about it at gowesty. Also the suspension isn't as good as the 86. BUT....the headlights on the 85 are better than 86 up.

[FrankieD]

My 81 (aircooled) Country Homes has been a dream for the year that I’ve owned her. Sadly, I have too sell her because I have way too many toys and lots of legal bills since my ex-wife has turned too drugs and my kids are begging to come live with me…. Too damn bad life isn’t so simple…. Have to get the darn lawyers involved…..
Anyway, about my Vanagaon, I love her dearly and she is a blast to drive. Slow as heck to get going but, once you get her wound up…look out. I have run her down the interstate 70+ and going with the flow of traffic with no problems.
My opinion is, any vehicle of age. (20+ years) can be a dream or a nightmare. A lot depends on how previous owners maintained them and what you expect from them. If you find what your looking for and it’s well taken care of, then <85 or >85 should make a big difference.
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[alnvilma]

I have an 84 w/ a slightly suspect rebuild but I'm happy with the power and the economy; 17 in town and over 20 on the road. It is a hardtop. Maybe the full Westys are heavier AND geared lower/thirstier? Plenty of power w/ 1.9 after living with an air cooled. Quiet too! No big secrets to the Waterboxers.

[mr_vanagon]

My '89 has been in my family since new and for the first 10 years we did nothing to it for repairs. After that it required a lot of love and attention (couple of new heads, just rebuilt the front end and a thousand other little things). I like to keep in mind that any museum piece that gets 18 MPG and can keep up with 70mph traffic while carrying me and 6 of my buds and our gear is a good thing. If you want cheap to run and nothing to fix, buy a $9k KIA. If you want to have fun on the weekends and something you don't mind fixing now and again, you can't beat a Vanagon. Buy what you like but remember that an old car (of any kind) is an old car. Have fun and take extra cash for parts. I also recomend a pair of air horns behind the front bumper. Nothing's more fun than semi like noise from my vanagon.

[buspor63]

They each have their quirks. 1.9 to 2.1 was a 10(?)HP gain. Both are still a DIY vehicle. Repair shops charge $50/hr regardless. Buy the best body/camping kit you can find. Mechanicals are bolt on/bolt off.

[mightyart]

All depends on your budget. My aircooled is as dependable as a Kia, plus when it breaks I don't need five South Koreans and a slide rule to fix it.
It did take plenty of time, effort and money to go over and change out all the 24 year old worn parts. I'm still changing parts, only a few small things to go and everything will work. I agree with what was said above, most vehicals are wonderful in the first ten years of there lives. But time and friction can be a bitch, and Neal Young was correct "Rust never Sleeps"
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[levi]

bout 2 weeks ago had the ignition switch go out, and I was in santa barbara..
a long ways from my tools in Tucson. So... had a v.w. shop here take care of it. 60 bucks and hour and when he put it back together he'd let the mechanism slide down so that the turn signals wouldn't cancel. "it can't be fixed!"......but I'll try and it might take awhile (at 60 an hour). Bastards. Had to go out and buy some tools for the 10 minute adjustment. ........ain't right

[skimballc]

[mjamgb]

Up to 83.5 was air-cooled type IV engine. 83.5 through 85 was 1.9l wasserboxer, 86 and up was 2.1l wasserboxer.

They all work well, none have "fatal flaws" and all are at least 15 years old!

Expect to have to replace "normal" wear items and understand that the engines may be near end of life no matter which type you get.

Mike!

[seanj]

i've always heard that if you want watercooled go for 86 and newer otherwise the only worthwhile vanagons are aircooled. also if you get an aircooled vanagon stick with a non-westy because they are lighter. my 82 vanagon is only about 130lbs heavier than my roomates late bay westy,not sure about weight differance of westy vanagon but i've heard it's the extra weight of the westy that kills them. as far as an aircooled with a rebuilt engine,as long as it was done by a reputable shop with quality parts it should last many years. also if you don't know too much about cars an aircooled vw is the best thing to learn on even all the f.i. stuff is pretty simple and straight forward. go get yourself a bently and any other manual you can find along with some patience and don't be affraid to post any and all issues on the samba for some quik "how to" advice. this is by far the best and most helpfull forum i've ever used.

[mjamgb]

Well...

My first car was a '70 bay westy. It lived through four bone stock engines and one I built (hah!). Slow, yes, but would have lived much longer if we could only keep the speed down (whaddya mean you can't go 75 all day?).

Now (along with several other cars) I have an '84 GL that makes the ol' Westy seem like a pig. Quiet(er), powerful(er) and all around more comfortable(r).

Dunno what the problems are.

Mike!

[Wolfie]

85 Pros: 1.9 isn't prone to launching rods through the block. Parts are cheaper. Engine bay doesn't look like an engineers nightmare.
Cons: HP, interior/trim isn't as fancy. Less "snob" factor.

86 Pros: More HP. More choices of trim levels, wheels, etc. Seems to be more of them out there.
Cons: Pricey parts especially engine control stuff. 2.1 cooling plumbing is a nightmare. Querky "dynamic oil pressure" warning system.

[[email protected]]

I've had my 85 westy for about a month and a half. been one problem after another. The motor is rebuilt and is good (1.9L). It is everything else I'm having to fix.

my friend has a 90. here is my 2 cents:

big difference so far is cooling system. The 2.1s seem to have better radiator setup. 1.9L is adequate, just harder to service. changing the thermostat is a nightmare.

The headlights are better on the 85.

besides that, pretty much the same. have the same westy equipment. and I like the black holey wheels with the VW hubcaps. classic VW

[[email protected]]

just wanted to clarify last message. all of the problems I'm having is from lack of maintenance. she has been fighting me, but I will win.

I love driving her. very smooth ride. no problem with power on flats, hills is another issue. Going to put a tiico motor in when this motor goes. And a real 5spd tranny before that. My current tranny is original and has over 190k miles. 3rd/4th still holding.

great for camping. I bought it, because no rust! and no accidents. good interior. still need to fix all of the appliances though!