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1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread
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valvecovergasket
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2020 8:29 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

erste wrote:
valvecovergasket wrote:
since im talking to myself Laughing


not at all! just not much for anyone to bicker about (ahem.. I mean discuss technicalities in detail. no offense y'all). mundane topics will go pages and pages and pages while great threads can get few or no comments. I'm sure lots of lurkers are following along and are appreciating the build. please, keep posting! pretty sure I've followed more than a few of your projects on vortex and I'm looking forward to seeing how this one turns out.

Exhaust looks great.

Do you need to notch the engine cover? I know it's necessary on mTDI, but my AHU on the same engine carriers didn't need to be notched. Either way, you got the cover plate made and it looks perfect.

Another reason the cruise is nice is because of the DBW pedal angle, but you get used to it.


i think youre right, probably for lack of things to bicker about Razz

for the notch, one of the ridges in the lid was just barely resting on the alternator when ive been test fitting it all without the lid seal (though unsure how much of a difference that makes).
brickwerks sells that kit as either for the LDA on the other pumps, or for the alternator on the tdis (im guessing because the 120A alt is larger by enough to touch?).

i suspect a slightly smaller alternator would clear without issue. luckily its near the center of rotation of the engine so shouldnt see a ton of movement, but will be something i keep an eye on for sure!


ALIKA T3 wrote:
I just came across this thread, what a beautiful conversion, and attention to detail. I would love to weld like that.

I'm glad you used the Audi coolant flange between the injectors. I posted the part number a few times on the internet but it seems like non Europeans are still capping the nipple instead of replacing the coolant flange.

Everything is so clean, I would just mention you should buy the $15 each, Inconel turbo bolts from VW. The day you take them off, you will be glad you did Wink

Aloha and keep posting !


yeah! that coolant neck is another brickwerks bit. as weve been building both vans those guys have gotten far too much of our money Laughing

i figured there was a reason for the price on that hardware, i had no idea it was because they were inconel, wow!
will make a note of that if this has to come out...


vwwestyman wrote:
I agree, I am enjoying following along.

(But, I do recall thinking similar things in my build thread!)


appreciate it!


intake plumbing and awic is mounted now. pics to come soon.

i wasnt really happy with how the intercooler -> manifold plumbing ended up and am waiting for a silicone bellows to give that joint some more flex.
also with running the intake plumbing straight down out of the airbox there is a bit of silicone pretty close to the rear end of the exhaust manifold, so ive got some fiberglass heat reflective slip on stuff to tuck up in there and keep temps below the ~300F threshold those joints are rated to. and it might help with intake temps anyway!


question for the group, since im not all that familiar with vans, is how much i can expect the engine to rock with a poly trans mount and new engine mounts?
im expecting roughly +/- 1/2" based on what i saw with my old setup with fairly worn mounts all around. but maybe its even less?


the to do list somehow doesnt seem to be getting any shorter now that im slowly focusing attention toward the front end... need to sort out the full speed hut setup up front, and do some bench testing on the fuel level gauge since that seems to be a sticking point with some speed hut installs, and id like to avoid using aftermarket senders.
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?Waldo?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2020 11:08 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

As requested, here's some material for bickering over.

Stock exhaust uses three of the rubber isolators. The third is mounted on top of the driver's side aluminum mounting bracket. That top one prevents twisting force on the other two. Without it, they will fail very quickly, probably in less than 1000 miles. If both fail, your exhaust will be hanging by the flex connections and by the flange at the turbo. Yipes. IMO, the isolator on top of the driver's side bracket is the minimum requirement. Placing a similar one on the passenger side would be a good idea also. It would also be a good idea to have a fail safe mode so that if any/all of the isolators fail it might get noisy but nothing will get bent/broken.

The heat shields on the exhaust manifold would help both with turbo efficiency and reducing engine bay temps.

I've found that the aluminum fittings like what you used for the oil return line kinda suck. They are weak, can fail dumping your oil, and are usually small ID for an overly large external size. Simple barb fittings are simultaneously stronger, easier to work with, and more free-flowing which is what is most important in the oil return.
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valvecovergasket
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2020 11:18 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

i had wondered about the mounting point for the additional isolator, but in my travels on the web had perhaps either missed its install on other setups or hadnt managed to make it out in the pictures based on angle.

this seems to suggest there was a different install using only the two vertical isolators? so thats a bit odd
https://volkswagen.7zap.com/en/usa/vanagon/va/1983-4/2/251-35010/#20


easy enough to add in though!
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:55 pm    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

valvecovergasket wrote:
i had wondered about the mounting point for the additional isolator, but in my travels on the web had perhaps either missed its install on other setups or hadnt managed to make it out in the pictures based on angle.

this seems to suggest there was a different install using only the two vertical isolators? so thats a bit odd
https://volkswagen.7zap.com/en/usa/vanagon/va/1983-4/2/251-35010/#20


easy enough to add in though!


I wanted to mention the exhaust mounts but then I was I can`t see why not as clearly , like you mentioned, the later model after 89 is indeed mounted off 2 rubber mounts. I have to say VW did revise that mount with a larger surface rubber mount with the same mounting dimensions for the holes and thickness. It`s a more square mount, long NLA.

Time will tell, these mounts are shit across the board these days anyway....
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valvecovergasket
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

oh thats another interesting tid bit. that online catalog didnt really provide context there

in any case, weve got some stainless strap, and another isolator, so we'll get that added this week.


ive switched gears for now to the front end wiring, almost have the new cluster wired - speed hut primary gauges, with egt, and a boost and oil temp combo gauge in the ashtray area.
ive been doing some bench testing of the speedhut fuel level - as it seems like folks tend to have issues with that, will post some results on that a little later this week also. hope to have a couple sensors verified, capture the filter value, and calibrate the gauge empty and full values with a decade box.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 7:36 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

couple more shots of the brickwerks lid notch

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and almost Smile finished pictures of the exhaust, plus early days of the intake mockup pre-heatshielding... wanted to include as many good shots of various angles of all this since i had a hard time finding something equivalent when we were planning this all out. hopefully this helps some future swapper!

once the intake is done i need to get the catchcan mounted and route the oil drain back into the back side of the block there.

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and some of the top end.
catch can will tuck in between the n75 and the airbox plumbing

the intake plumbing into the manifold is getting swapped out with a flexible bellows section as i wasnt really happy with how that straight bit of plumbing ended up.

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couple of van chassis bits that have been on my list forever...

drivers grab handle - impressed with the gowesty kit for this. went off without a hitch and super simple install with their drill guide

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and tencents fresh air intake flap. really excited to try this out.
impressed with the kit, as usual. easy install, but took me a minute to wrap my mind around how the rodent screen was supposed to fit haha

plus the push pull cable dropped right into where the old diesel cold advance cable lived. perfect!

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finally, a bit before the front end exploded into a wiring pile... including test fit of the tps bracket and pedal

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i hope to have the front end sorted by the end of the week but we'll see how progress goes with building the new cluster and gauge stack.
so far the wiring hasnt been bad but theres going to be some fiddly arts and crafts getting the gauges and warning lights all sorted.
and as mentioned earlier, i want to capture some bench testing of the speedhut fuel level to see about using the stock level sender without a lot of noise/slosh in the tank
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

I'll add my thoughts on the exhaust.

I'm still new to all this and learning so take it with a grain of salt.

I originally had a factory 1.6TD and now have done a AHU swap (well, actually two of them).

Every time I need to do any sort of timing adjustments or T belt changes I need to take the stock muffler off so I can get a tool on the crank bolt and rotate the crank. My suggestions is that you have a way to take off part of the exhaust without dismounting it from the turbo (those nuts are nuts and studs are going to get corroded) or make sure there is enough room between the crank pulley and muffler to get a tool in there to turn the crank.

Your swap is a lot more polished than mine.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 7:59 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

thats a good point! and something worth mentioning for the archives.

when we were placing the rear side to side piping + muffler, and mocking up the two hangers we did build, we had my largest 1/2" ratchet and an impact socket on the crank bolt to make sure there was room.
as built you can slide the whole combo in there with about a half inch or so to spare.



in terms of service, what will be a bit of a pain on this is air filter changes.

the RMW subaru airbox fits well and im really happy with how much easier its proven to be packaging/plumbing wise than a donaldson setup... it will require dropping the drivers side of the motor an inch or so to pull the box out far enough for the two halves to separate.

but thats a tradeoff im willing to live with given the frequency of that filter service and how relatively easy it is to lower the motor.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:12 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

The use of a V-band clamp just off the turbo and steel donut junctions makes removal of the entire exhaust a breeze, as in a five minute breeze. Since I do my own wrenching, I try to factor service access into my design process. I think my next exhaust design will be all V-banded junctions.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

for sure, with a vband you dont even need any other sort of sealing medium either so theres nothing to wear out/replace


this was my last big project, vband at the downpipe end. exhaust comes out in one easy piece.
and its easy to tell when youve got it lined up since it clicks into place and seals.

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we'll see if it gets to be annoying, can always add it later.... in fact i think i have an extra vband from that MG project that just might fit hah
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:24 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

to add some notes from speedhut bench testing last night.

folks have reported really noisy (ive seen it described as unreadable while driving?) speedhut fuel level readings using the factory van sensor.
i was curious to characterize that circuit a bit and understand what was going on.

to that end - powered up the speedhut on the bench and quickly found the manual cal for the fuel level to not be super intuitive, i suppose thats the drawback to using a single button and one LED to do a number of different things.

i have the old (probably original?) float we pulled out of the old tank for the van.
tried to characterize min/max on that and had a really hard time getting empty readings.
but it would consistently show full at ~35 ohms and the upper 10-20% of the travel was relatively repeatable. good enough... seems to match the numbers ive seen listed on here. for what its worth i had no fuel level gauge issues previously on the all-stock equipment.

ive seen numbers around 285 ohm reported on here for the empty reading.
i measured the new sensor in the van, with a completely dry fuel system and sure enough - 285.

next step was to do the min/max manual calibration on the speedhut with a decade box, for repeatable readings and to make step changes easier.
also, i wanted to characterize the speedhut's internal filter for the level reading.

averaging several min -> max, and max -> min step changes, i came up with numbers of right around 2 minutes for a full sweep.
i cant see any way from the bench testing, that the speedhut would move around much while underway given that heavy of a filter on the reading. the decade box made it easy to make large instantaneous jumps between level readings, and theres really no situation that causes the needle to jump. even unplugging and plugging in the sensor. the filter is always active on the reading.
the only situation i could see causing problems is a miscalibration of the range somehow.

anyway we'll see how it works once its all together.
and of course, pics to come...
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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2020 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

catching the pictures up to the last post - bench testing and cal on the gauges

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adding that last strap to the exhaust - you guys werent kidding that really really firms the whole thing up. it barely moves now just about hanging off of it!

we were debating adding =more gusseting, but damn that thing turned out to be beefy with the single strap

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terrible pic of the awic pump and front-rear lines. the back half of the system is plumbed now. we're probably going to copy zincro's prius setup up front, but still need to get that done next week.

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new axles and 944s. still need to get packed but the annoying heat and press part is done Smile

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and the final undershots of the whole thing.
catch can drain line was the last bit, was waiting on an AN-metric fitting to pop into the back of the block, so i shouldnt ever have to drain the provent. it has a one way backpressure valve inline as well. big blue silicone line is the catchcan vent.
i used a little provent 100 as it was much easier to package and the 200 sure looks overkill to me.

wrapped the turbo plumbing and n75 hoses in some of that slip on heat shielding, looks a bit of a mess in pictures as it all blends together visually... but oughta do the trick.

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we hemmed and hawed about whether to make a proper dip stip setup for the license plate hatch, seemed easier to get this done once and save all those future minutes not unloading the back Smile

its the top portion of the original b4 tdi dipstick, welded to a diesel van lower bit. and the metal original tdi tube sliced in half with some heavy duty trans cooler hose between and a little bracket to hold it all together.
will mark/verify the full level after we get it topped off.

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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2020 9:36 pm    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

Great idea to put the Provent to the block!

I still haven`t done mine since I still have turbo issues, I`ll get inspired by your set up Cool
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PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 7:07 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

thanks!
ive normally just capped and drained cans occasionally, but with access under the lid here being a bit more awkward than on the typical car, i figured id give this a shot.

also curious to see how the provent 100 holds up, by the numbers it seems like it should work fine ... i suppose folks put in the 200 just because theyre easier to get, but there was no hope of fitting one of those back there
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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

clearing the last bits off the to do list now... fingers crossed for a start up and maybe a drive test this weekend.

pressure tested the cooling system, all seems well.
we had a mishap with the back of head seal but easy fix. holds 15psi without a problem now

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couple shots of the awic system. we bled that, or started bleeding it anyway. its tough without a reservoir, so will need to monitor for bubbles. but so far good enough for a drive test i think...

i had hoped to tuck everything and keep it looking factory but after seeing the zincro build this seemed like an easier method. its a shame none of the more commonly available aftermarket cores really fit, and there isnt much room to shuffle the main radiator back a bit.

also forgot to get a picture of the fill cap, but its mounted just beside the passenger headlight - highest point in the system.

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and my last major project is still figuring out how to mount the new main gauges, and building out the new center stack lights. im using my old cluster trim to practice on before i hack up the cleaner one i bought.

originally was going to copy kourt's setup with them mounted in place of the original gauges without their bezels, but after playing around with them a bit i want to try mount them using the bezel and mounting screw they come with.
since the factory cluster surround tapers pretty hard, it will require building a new face near the front.
messing around with cardboard to see how itd look. something like this seems workable though...

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finally a finished shot of the cluster of hoses on top of the engine, with the catchcan mounting

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hope the next update is a startup video later this week Smile
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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 11:17 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

Looks great. What kind of catch can is that?
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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 11:21 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

thanks!

its a provent 100, theyre a little harder to get but i think its more right-sized for these little things. and packaging the more common 200 was a no-go
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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 11:25 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

IIRC Karl Mullendore used a Mann ProVent plumbed to return oil to the sump but without a check valve in the return line. The result was diesel runaway and a new engine ruined. I haven't scoured your thread for details on the install but something to bear in mind. You could inquire with Karl for details.
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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 11:29 am    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

good looking out!
yes, indeed theres a check valve in the return line, thats plumbed back into the old turbo drain fitting in the back of the block

its the higher-up covered line in this shot

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PostPosted: Mon May 11, 2020 12:47 pm    Post subject: Re: 1Z TDI Westy - Build Thread Reply with quote

I used a Mann unit from an old Mercedes, and it's also plumbed to old turbo drain, but then again my engine is at 15 degrees, so perhaps not as much of an issue.
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