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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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 Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:34 am Post subject: Westy insulation |
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I just pulled the sagging passenger side from my 67 westy. It had already been broken on one corner long ago. But up above it was a very nicely cut and shaped piece of fiberglass insulation that seemed to have been made the perfect thickness, too. Almost looks like Westy made it that way. Could it be? Or was it just the work of a handy PO?
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nlorntson
Crazy VW Lady
Joined: March 13, 2004
Posts: 3783
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:18 am Post subject: Re: The Double Cab / Crew Cab thread |
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| cdennisg wrote: |
| I just pulled the sagging passenger side from my 67 westy. It had already been broken on one corner long ago. But up above it was a very nicely cut and shaped piece of fiberglass insulation that seemed to have been made the perfect thickness, too. Almost looks like Westy made it that way. Could it be? Or was it just the work of a handy PO? |
Was your Westy originally a Kombi or Panel before it was sent off to Wesfalia? If Kombi, does it have the gray commercial panels in front roof and doors, and the wood everywhere else?
We didn't have any insulation in our 63 DC but a PO had recovered two of the panels in the roof so I guess it could have been removed. |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 12:06 pm Post subject: Re: The Double Cab / Crew Cab thread |
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| nlorntson wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| I just pulled the sagging passenger side from my 67 westy. It had already been broken on one corner long ago. But up above it was a very nicely cut and shaped piece of fiberglass insulation that seemed to have been made the perfect thickness, too. Almost looks like Westy made it that way. Could it be? Or was it just the work of a handy PO? |
Was your Westy originally a Kombi or Panel before it was sent off to Wesfalia? If Kombi, does it have the gray commercial panels in front roof and doors, and the wood everywhere else?
We didn't have any insulation in our 63 DC but a PO had recovered two of the panels in the roof so I guess it could have been removed. |
Velvet green kombi converted at Westfalia. Gray hardboard front panels and birch ply rear interior.
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BarryL 
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14271
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:48 pm Post subject: Re: The Double Cab / Crew Cab thread |
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| cdennisg wrote: |
| Could it be? |
'67 Westy, here, has the Westfalia factory yellow fiberglass as you describe. |
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12401
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 8:48 pm Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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Yes, the SO 42 came with yellow Fibreglas insulation.
It is even in the parts list.
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:01 pm Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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| Clara wrote: |
Yes, the SO 42 came with yellow Fibreglas insulation.
It is even in the parts list. |
FYI, this post was split off from a somewhat unrelated thread about hardboard headliners and what might be lurking beneath when removed. Good to know the fiberglass was the real deal. Now I won't shitcan it.
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jpeters
Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2005
Posts: 1025
Location: Woodsfield, Ohio
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2020 4:35 am Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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I see all of these people posting about there fears of putting fiber insulation in a bus because of moisture issues, but it was clear that Westy did it originally.
Is there any reason not to use the newer pink home fiberglass insulation?
For clarification, I'm thinking above headliner and driver side long wall panel. I won't be putting it in any doors.
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'73 Westy (dual stock carbs, SVDA w/ compufire)
'68 Westy http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=484180
'65 Westy SO-42 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435614
'65 Bug
'63 Bug
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:43 am Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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Westy didn't expect these vehicles to last more than a decade so they used what was available, whether they knew there may be issues or not.
Don't use loose fiberglass insulation in any area where moisture or condensation may occur. That goes for cars, vans, houses, whatever.
Also, given the limited space for fiberglass insul to fit between panels, you are getting barely any real insulating value from its use. If you compress it tightly into those spaces, you make it worthless, as it needs air space between the fibers to do its job.
Using sheet style insulation is best for vehicle applications. It just works better.
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12401
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:58 am Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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| jpeters wrote: |
I see all of these people posting about there fears of putting fiber insulation in a bus because of moisture issues, but it was clear that Westy did it originally.
Is there any reason not to use the newer pink home fiberglass insulation?
For clarification, I'm thinking above headliner and driver side long wall panel. I won't be putting it in any doors. |
The insulation Westfalia used was not very thick.
Is 1" or 3/4" thick fiberglass insulation sold now?
As said, compressing the insulation reduces the R value. Also, you actually want a airspace between the insulation and panel or roof, to allow air to flow and moisture to escape.
You do not want the insulation to touch both roof and interior panel.
Let it breathe.
VW installed some sort of horsehair type insulation above the headliner in my 61 bus.
I had an OTW camper that the interior panels had been removed from, using it as a shed. One winter day I touched the soft foam insulation still glued to the inside of the roof; it was dripping wet. It was holding moisture against the metal. This was stored outside, in Oly, WA, in a moist climate. I doubt it would have been dripping in a dry climate. But will it always be dry in your bus? Will you breath out moisture in there?
I use the shiny bubble wrap insulation, and allow some space so air can flow.
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aa390392
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2007
Posts: 3602
Location: So.Cal
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2020 11:55 am Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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Interesting info on insulation installation. All makes sense.
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24764
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2020 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: Westy insulation |
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| jpeters wrote: |
I see all of these people posting about there fears of putting fiber insulation in a bus because of moisture issues, but it was clear that Westy did it originally.
Is there any reason not to use the newer pink home fiberglass insulation?
For clarification, I'm thinking above headliner and driver side long wall panel. I won't be putting it in any doors. |
Westie did use some fiberglass insulation, BUT it has much more loose airy construction than any household insulation. Airy as in it should air out a lot easier, so if water/condensation got into it, it would dry out a lot faster. The 1967 SO-42 we had back around 1990 had it and you could almost look all the way thru it!
Had indoor/outdoor felt carpet with very thin foam rubber backing installed all over the inside of the roof behind the front seats in our 1960 walk thru panel camper conversion. Overall thickness was just shy of 1/4". One night got into the bed and barely brushed the roof with my head, and one of the carpet squares (about 6" x 6" each) fell loose and an avalanche of rust poured out. Pulled out all the carpet that night and cleaned off the loose rust. Spent the next several years slowly getting out all the rust and finally using a cold galvanizing primer and paint over that.
Years and years ago posted about the above and a gal down in San Diego checked her bus. She had only put the foam rubber over the engine compartment to quiet the interior engine noise down a dew months before. She found that the foam rubber wet and had caused rust to start.... How warm and dry is San Diego??? Just has to be cool enough outside that your breath condensates inside your bus and collects in any insulation that will hold it there. The more you heat the interior of your bus and the colder it gets outside the more condensation you get.
We also have a 1963 that is a panel camper conversion. The roof was insulated with about 1" thick foam rubber by the camper conversion company. Now need to replace lots of rusted thru roof metal for several inches above the rain gutter.... Rest of the roof does not look bad. Think maybe it lived in a drier climate, and got to dry out more than here, or the insulation sagged down just enough not to touch in the upper area. Still the water collected ran downhill and sat against the sheet metal. Want to come on over and get to experience the fun of fixing that?
Dealt with C-130 aircraft in the USAF. They do use insulation blankets, BUT they are made in such a way not to touch the outer COLD outer skin of the aircraft. This allows for air flow between outer metal and insulation to let water to dry out.
Fun to pull back that insulation unsnapping some of the snaps that holds it there, when flying at around 30,000 feet, then slip in a 2 liter bottle of Mountain Dew. Pull bottle back out 10-15 minutes later to give it a shake and you have slushies! Yum!
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jpeters
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Location: Woodsfield, Ohio
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