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pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge
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Franklinstower
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 12:38 pm    Post subject: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

I am in the finishing steps of the pop top refurbish and I bought all new SS hardware from Belmetric. I don't particularly like using a 100% Silicone sealants mainly due to the fact that nothing removes it. I have used a butyl tape before on my sail boat with mixed results. The butyl tape i have used might not have been true butyl. It didn't stretch out and eventually somewhat hardened over the years. I just pulled it out and it is not very pliable anymore after about 5 years.

Are there any updated go-to sealants for sealing the bolts? Like Dico flow seal, a better butyl tape, a non-silicone sealant, Maybe Silkaflex 221?

I am editing this to also address the skylight hinges - I suppose using a silicone sealant is more suitable on the skylight itself.

Thanks,
Paul
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Last edited by Franklinstower on Mon Jun 01, 2020 10:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants Reply with quote

I think sikkaflex 221 is a go to nowadays. purplepeopleeater (Mike Shaffer at VanLab) used it when installing the windows in my high-top (maybe also for sealing the high-top seam) and I recently researched it when installing solar panels and it consistently came up as a go-to sealant and adhesive for rv related roofing and sealing projects.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.

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Franklinstower
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 11:04 am    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

I am bumping this and added an edit to the title to discuss the skylight hinge and sealant.

I just received my new SS Hinges from GoWesty - I like the idea of the stainless because my old hinges actual rusted to the point the hinge would not open and thus I cracked the pop top at the hinge mount location from the frozen hinge.

So here is the new SS hinges - notice anything odd about the hinge?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


a mild steel hinge bolt. So basically you got a nice SS hinge with a steel hinge pin that is going to rust. No Bueno Go-Westy! Brick wall
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jlrftype7
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 10:15 am    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

Can't speak to GoWesty's intention, but Stainless on Stainless can Gall with movement/rotation as I'm sure you're aware of. Maybe they were trying to avoid that issue with the steel pin.
You could always e-mail them to be sure....
Can you easily cut the bolt out and add your own hardware if so inclined?
Or, a bronze bushing with a stainless pin or bolt to fit... although at THAT point you really are reinventing the wheel for that hinge assembly... Embarassed Embarassed
Anyway, what grade of Stainless is the Hinge, Series 304, 316?, just wondering
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'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- also long gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle, my wife's first car= yep. still long gone....
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Franklinstower
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 10:37 am    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

They don't mention the type of Stainless used, it is non-magnetic though.

As far as galling or rusting - I think the pin would rust way before the galling occurred because for galling, you usually need a tight fit of the dissimilar metals correct? the hinge pin is pretty loose in the stamped stainless hinge body.

quote from Go-Westy:
We are proud to offer our stainless steel replacement hinges for your skylight, made right here in the USA. Look ma, no rust! You will need two hinges per vehicle, and these are retailed individually. Cheers!
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PDXWesty
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:01 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

I used thin rubber washers to make the seal. Never leaked.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:08 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

I sealed the skylight fasteners and all the other pop top fasteners with "Dum Dum" and it worked fine - - no leaks at all.

I will add, however, that I was very careful to roll out a small amount of dumdum into a thin sausage form for each fastener, wrapped it around the base of the fastener, and made sure that there was no gap in the dumdum sausage before tightening each fastener. I tested with the garden hose and then real-world use.

These days, this product goes by many names and 3M calls their version "Strip Caulk":

https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/company-ca/all-3m...amp;rt=rud
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 1:22 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

Franklinstower wrote:
They don't mention the type of Stainless used, it is non-magnetic though.

As far as galling or rusting - I think the pin would rust way before the galling occurred because for galling, you usually need a tight fit of the dissimilar metals correct? the hinge pin is pretty loose in the stamped stainless hinge body.

quote from Go-Westy:
We are proud to offer our stainless steel replacement hinges for your skylight, made right here in the USA. Look ma, no rust! You will need two hinges per vehicle, and these are retailed individually. Cheers!
I'm talking about Stainless Steel rubbing on Stainless Steel. Some Series are worse for it than others. Not Steel or non steel running on Stainless. Since the Hinge is Non-Magnetic, it's probably a 300 series type of some kind.
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'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- also long gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle, my wife's first car= yep. still long gone....
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto
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dgbeatty
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:16 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

I ordered a set of these at one point and sent them back. IMHO the quality was very poor. The shape was only a close approximation of the original hinges. The pivots were much looser than the 30 year old Westfalia hinges. In the end I powder coated a set, slightly enlarged the bore in the smaller section and reassembled using a tee shaped bushing on each end and a nice stainless button head bolt and nylow nut.
No more rattle!
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Timwhy
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:46 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

Making a small snake of this stuff wrapped around a bolt will seal water from entering thru.:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-Bender-1-lb-Pl...lsrc=aw.ds
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vanagonjr
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:15 am    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

Timwhy wrote:
Making a small snake of this stuff wrapped around a bolt will seal water from entering thru.:


I uses this per Tim's suggestion and finally I am no longer fighting with leaks. As mentioned by Howesight, I was super careful with the application.

In case that is a dead link some day it is
1 lb. Plug Duct Seal Compound by Gardner Bender. And enough to do 50 Westies is $2.98!
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:33 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

dgbeatty wrote:
I ordered a set of these at one point and sent them back. IMHO the quality was very poor. The shape was only a close approximation of the original hinges. The pivots were much looser than the 30 year old Westfalia hinges. In the end I powder coated a set, slightly enlarged the bore in the smaller section and reassembled using a tee shaped bushing on each end and a nice stainless button head bolt and nylow nut.
No more rattle!
nice!- any pictures?
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'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- also long gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle, my wife's first car= yep. still long gone....
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto
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kourt
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

This thread reminds me of all the reasons I stopped replacing my Westy skylight.

When I bought my Westy in 2013 the skylight was a baked, cracked mess.

I replaced all the hardware and the skylight itself. Totally fresh and nice. I used rubber gaskets to seal the thru-fasteners.

About a year later, after a few beach trips, the lens struts were rusted and the skylight rattled a lot. I replaced it all again. Totally fresh and nice.

About a year after that I replaced it all again because it was rusty and rattling again. Totally fresh and nice.

By the the fourth time of replacement I decided the skylight design was junk and did this:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8796997#8796997

Now I have a powered fan up there with a standardized RV skylight that doesn't rattle and is made of modern, non corrosive materials. No rattles and no rust.

kourt
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jlrftype7
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:00 pm    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

kourt wrote:
This thread reminds me of all the reasons I stopped replacing my Westy skylight.

When I bought my Westy in 2013 the skylight was a baked, cracked mess.

I replaced all the hardware and the skylight itself. Totally fresh and nice. I used rubber gaskets to seal the thru-fasteners.

About a year later, after a few beach trips, the lens struts were rusted and the skylight rattled a lot. I replaced it all again. Totally fresh and nice.

About a year after that I replaced it all again because it was rusty and rattling again. Totally fresh and nice.

By the the fourth time of replacement I decided the skylight design was junk and did this:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8796997#8796997

Now I have a powered fan up there with a standardized RV skylight that doesn't rattle and is made of modern, non corrosive materials. No rattles and no rust.

kourt
I had forgotten all the trouble you went to , BUT, it sure seems worth it. I'd go the distance for that too if I had a Westy, just for the Roof Venting of Hot Air, let alone cooking heat and odors.... Applause Applause Applause
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'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- also long gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle, my wife's first car= yep. still long gone....
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto
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kourt
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:08 am    Post subject: Re: pop top bolt sealants and skylight hinge Reply with quote

It really paid off this weekend at the beach. I had planned to make some biscuits and gravy on the outside grill, but then it started to rain. We had to shutter ourselves inside the van, and it was about 80 degrees outside. I started to cook and opened the MaxxFan, turned the fan on, and watched the heat and smell of food get carried up and out of the van while we sat in relative comfort in the van.

I totally get the purists who want to keep the stock look, but man that old skylight sucked, and this powered vent skylight rocks.

kourt
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