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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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 Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 5:59 pm Post subject: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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So, before I get a few sticks of TNT I thought I should see what all you guru's have to say.
68 Ghia:
I just finished wiring the horn system and pretty confident it's wired correctly. When I do a test by touching the green wire to the location in the yellow arrow is pointing, the horn sometimes works but mostly just sounds like there's a bad connection and all I hear is a click like a bad connection.
Could a bad horn relay cause this or the green wire not having a good connection on the steering column?
Any thoughts? or would it be better to wiring the horn system w/out a relay and if so how do I do that?
Thank you,
Lee |
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bnam
Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2006
Posts: 2936
Location: El Dorado Hills CA/ Bangalore, India
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| Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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With ignition in the on position:
What is the voltage u see at the horn positive? (Measure from positive to good ground point nearby
What is the resistance between the negative connector at the horn and the end of green wire at the steering wheel
With ignition off, and horn disconnected, what is the resistance between positive and negative terminal?
_________________
1971 1302LS Convertible (RHD) owned since '74
Click to view image
1965 Karmann Ghia Coupe - under restoration
1966 Fiat 1500 Cabrio (with 1600 Twin cam)
1952 Citroen TA 11BL |
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sputnick60
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Joined: July 22, 2007
Posts: 3916
Location: In Molinya Orbit
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:15 am Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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Nicholas,
Nice picture to help those of us who are challenged like me !!!  I have a few things to go check now, hopefully will make magic by the end of this weekend
Thanks again!!
Lee
Last edited by Mrfun2fly on Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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xzener
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2006
Posts: 1777
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 8:57 am Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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I also have a 68 I recently restored. Had issues with the horn as well. New powder coated beam, painted steering box, new wiring harness. The steering box had no contact to ground. I jumpered a wire from the steering box to ground. Here is a picture of the wire (don't mind the overspray, hadn't cleaned it up yet). Also had issues with an aftermarket horn button in a Grant steering wheel. After resolving the connection issues, my horns work great. Good luck.
_________________
My 70 beetle was totaled Now to build the Ghia I always wanted. Rest in peace Ruby, I will miss you. Hello <insert Ghia name here>! |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:23 am Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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| xzener wrote: |
I also have a 68 I recently restored. Had issues with the horn as well. New powder coated beam, painted steering box, new wiring harness. The steering box had no contact to ground. I jumpered a wire from the steering box to ground. Here is a picture of the wire (don't mind the overspray, hadn't cleaned it up yet). Also had issues with an aftermarket horn button in a Grant steering wheel. After resolving the connection issues, my horns work great. Good luck.
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Glad yours is working well bud! Gues it can't hurt to do something like this anyway. And I also have a spare relay I can try. |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:24 am Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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| bnam wrote: |
With ignition in the on position:
What is the voltage u see at the horn positive? (Measure from positive to good ground point nearby
What is the resistance between the negative connector at the horn and the end of green wire at the steering wheel
With ignition off, and horn disconnected, what is the resistance between positive and negative terminal? |
I will also try this and see what numbers I get . What kind of numbers should I be seeing? |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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Bingo!
Swapped out the original VW German relay and replaced it w one I bought a year ago on accident and schaaazam! Beep beep!
Thank you all for the sweet education, definitely adding that to my toolbox arsenal:)
Thanks again!
Lee |
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xzener
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2006
Posts: 1777
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| Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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Relays are nice, but tend to fail. I just had one on my air ride setup go bad. A little bit of mechanical agitation is all it needed (smacked it on the counter top). Works like new. 😆
_________________
My 70 beetle was totaled Now to build the Ghia I always wanted. Rest in peace Ruby, I will miss you. Hello <insert Ghia name here>! |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 8:49 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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| xzener wrote: |
| I also have a 68 I recently restored. Had issues with the horn as well. New powder coated beam, painted steering box, new wiring harness. The steering box had no contact to ground. I jumpered a wire from the steering box to ground. Here is a picture of the wire (don't mind the overspray, hadn't cleaned it up yet). Also had issues with an aftermarket horn button in a Grant steering wheel. After resolving the connection issues, my horns |
Ugh...I'm back to my horn project. Yes the relay was bad and replaced the relay.
Questions:
On the 68 after wired correctly is the steering shaft hot?
If I touch the steering shaft with the center wire coming up from the shaft as seen in my picture above, should the horn honk?
Reason I ask is, when I touch the shaft with the center wire, nothing happens but when I touch the horn bearing under the turn lever with the center wire, the horn honks.
Fyi, the center shaft seems to move, thinking the horn bearing may need replacing so wondering if this could be the issue.
Thank you!
Lee |
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xzener
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2006
Posts: 1777
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| Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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No! The shaft is not hot... It completes the ground. The relay is just waiting to be energized and power the horns.
Yes, touching the wire completes the circuit causing the horns to beep. Lemme look through all my pictures, I might have some of the steering column. I did have to replace my bushing, twice... The first ones solder failed and the wire fell off.
_________________
My 70 beetle was totaled Now to build the Ghia I always wanted. Rest in peace Ruby, I will miss you. Hello <insert Ghia name here>! |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:00 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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| xzener wrote: |
No! The shaft is not hot... It completes the ground. The relay is just waiting to be energized and power the horns.
Yes, touching the wire completes the circuit causing the horns to beep. Lemme look through all my pictures, I might have some of the steering column. I did have to replace my bushing, twice... The first ones solder failed and the wire fell off. |
Thank you,
I'm not electric minded but tell me where to plug things in and I can follow instructions lol
Right now I can touch the steering shaft with the wire and nothing happens. The shaft has lots of play making me think there's no connection from the horn bearing to the shaft?? Wonder if I need to replace wirh the following part or.parts
https://airheadparts.com/vw-part/steering-column-bearing-111-998-559/
https://airheadparts.com/vw-part/steering-shaft-contact-thrust-ring-111-953-535-d/ |
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xzener
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2006
Posts: 1777
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| Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:36 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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Just went through all my pictures... Nothing except the one I already shown above. My beam was powder coated, and I blasted and painted my steering box. There was no connection to ground through all the paint, hence the wire jumper. You won't be able to tell which bushing you'll need until you tear yours apart... Mine was an early 68, has the donut shaped one with the wire dangling. A pain in the ass to install for me. You will more than likely need a new bushing.
Have a look at this thread... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=566567&highlight=horn+wiring
Good luck.
_________________
My 70 beetle was totaled Now to build the Ghia I always wanted. Rest in peace Ruby, I will miss you. Hello <insert Ghia name here>! |
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Mrfun2fly
Samba Member
Joined: November 29, 2015
Posts: 548
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:45 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Wiring Help :( |
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| xzener wrote: |
Just went through all my pictures... Nothing except the one I already shown above. My beam was powder coated, and I blasted and painted my steering box. There was no connection to ground through all the paint, hence the wire jumper. You won't be able to tell which bushing you'll need until you tear yours apart... Mine was an early 68, has the donut shaped one with the wire dangling. A pain in the ass to install for me. You will more than likely need a new bushing.
Have a look at this thread... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=566567&highlight=horn+wiring
Good luck. |
Well, the steering bearing doesn't cost much and since I need to take it apart might as well replace it.
Ugh...these horn systems are so goofy and have been giving me issues for years. I'm constantly learning but dang it, one of these days gonna get some TNT and really fix it! 
Thanks bud!
Lee |
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