My 412 these days..

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

One of the tougher parts of this build has definitely been installing the A/C system. The condenser is finally mounted in the spare tire section of the trunk. I just need to figure out how to seal around some of the spaces that expose the areas I had to cut to install the condenser.

It's unnerving looking into the trunk and seeing the street below. I'm open for suggestions. I was thinking of using Qpad sound deadeners for some of the gaps. I still need to be able to remove it, but it's highly unlikely that I will need to again. (fingers crossed).

Here are some of the pictures of the newly installed evaporator under the dash. This was really a challenge:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Hanging that thing was a real challenge, and I'm glad it's done. I'm going to try to source some type of piping or trim to cover over the small gap between the dash and the actual evaporator.

Also, I need to construct some type of trim piece that covers the bottom of the steering wheel and mates up nicely with the dash and evaporator. I like adding those fine touches.

Now, I need to bolt up the dryer and I'll have A/C just in time for the NJ winter. I'll probably charge it in the spring, this way I can focus on other projects to get this thing together.

The more I work on this car, the more I realize that you really need to be able to refurb/fabricate quality replacement parts. There is no way I could have afforded an entire A/C system for this car, but with the help of Gilmore Enterprises and a lot of patience and tin cutting, I think I have a worthy unit.

As to the electrical hook up, I have the evaporator/blower running on the primary battery and I've added a second battery to run the condenser fan and compressor clutch, along with the heated seats.
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

raygreenwood · Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2020 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Looks great!

Show us how the unit fits near the fuse block please.

The original dealer installed units on most that I have found....had to do away with the parcel tray under the fuse block.....and the end of the AC unit...was cut...and had a hinge....so that when you needed to get to the fuse block or to the clutch master cylinder...you removed a sheet metal screw and the end of the AC unit with the left hand vent swung down out of the way. Ray

NurseryWalt · Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:47 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Great looking interior! Now you can cool your top and heat your bottom at the same time Laughing

_________________
'66 Bug with collector plate and '73 412 project

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

Here's some more detail as to how the evaporator mounts:

Part number 46 is the L-bracket that I referenced earlier that holds the back part up.
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

raygreenwood · Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2020 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

The last 412 I had with a dealer installed under dash AC was the virtually identical evaporator housing but it had a cut where you see the yellow line in the picture below and a small hinge riveted where you see the two blue squares. The single screw on the left end kept it in place. When you need to get to the fuse box...you pull the screw (I had a wing nut screw) and the evaporator flips down on that end.

Also very useful for getting at the instruments and the clutch master cylinder.

Ray

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

How cool! Yes, this one definitely does not have that feature.
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

Here’s a rare moment when I’m following my T4 with the 78 T1!

https://youtu.be/T2lw09fBwAU
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

ubercrap · Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:02 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Looks like a nice drive. The Type 4s look really compact and narrow on the road by today's standards, don't they? Love it!
_________________
'74 412 wagon
(2) '74 412 2dr. sedan
'73 412 2dr. sedan

Pepperbilly · Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:39 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Video looks great! These cars were a nice tight perfect size. Like driving aircooled 911’s and 914’s. Not too large and just a great fit. You really feel one with the road. Always enjoyed that!
Bill

raygreenwood · Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:23 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Very nice!

Yes....compared to todays cars....type 4 is compact! The shock comes when people get inside one and see how much room it has. Ray

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

Lars S · Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:44 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Yes the 411/412 is quite roomy, especially interior height (must be record in its class!) and coupe length, good space and comfortable seating for 4 persons.
In my opinion it looks a bit narrow when seen straight from behind and with stock rims/tires.
This video proofs why one should NOT run the 412 with stock rims and stock suspension... Wink

https://vimeo.com/182331995

/Lars S
_________________
Porsche 914 -72, Bahia Red daily driver Smile

VW411 2-d -70, White, sold Sad

VW412 4-d, -73, Gold Metallic, daily driver
Suzuki T500, -69, Candy Gold, sold Sad

Suzuki K50, -77, Black, daily driver
BMW R69S -69, White, sold Sad

Husqvarna 118cc, -47, Black, Sold Sad

ubercrap · Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:14 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

raygreenwood · Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 6:33 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Lars said:

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

Reading all of the work by being done by Walt, Bob, Bill, Curtis and Abel (to name a few) has inspired me to get back to my 412 project. For a while, I've had a Sapphire XV stereo that came out of a T4 with no windshield. The radio was pretty much shot, so I didn't feel bad attempting to tear into it.

I removed the two covers and the radio looked rusted inside, but I took some electronic cleaner and a paintbrush and began to clean it up. What do I have to lose?

The one thing I noticed (and learned) is that the power wire was gone. Through some research, I found that the power wire was supposed to go through a small hole on the side of the radio.

Here is what it looked like after I started to clean it up:

As I was getting ready to solder on a new wire, I noticed that there was a green capacitor that the power line connects to. The leg was broken off on it, so I had another old Sapphire radio for parts, so I took a chance and transplanted it from the other radio to this one. When I put it in and put power to it, I saw an encouraging little spark. So I pressed on.

I took out the light bulb inside the radio and put in a new one. The bulb may not be a perfect replacement, but I had it handy from a VW bulb kit that I ordered. It fit the radio; it was a little shorter, but worked fine. The bulb was a pain to get to. To change it you need to:

1) Remove nuts that hold volume and tuning knobs to the body and push them in.

2) Remove the front metal plate.

3) Pry off two little pins that hold on the plastic plate with the frequency numbers printed on it along with the black background behind the orange tuning indicator. (you can leave that part on)

4) Gently take a needle nose plier and carefully unscrew the little bolt that holds on the bulb socket.

5) Clean out the socket with a small Dremel or something similar.

6) Test and replace the bulb as necessary.

There is another tiny bulb in this radio that illuminates 'Stereo'. For now, I'm going to assume that one is okay.

That's my unscientific way of doing it, but it worked.

Next, there was a broken resistor that needed replacement - I was really lucky that I found one with identical bands in my donor Sapphire, so I replaced that.

Once all that was done, I put it together, and here is what it looked like:

And no... I didn't use that old, taped up speaker! I just used it to see if I could get any sound out of the radio. Smile

Next, I decided to start wiring it up into the car:

I used an old VW fuse harness for the power supply and ran that to my second battery:

Once all the wiring was completed and run, I mounted it up. I think it came out pretty good:

I didn't want to cut into my door panels to put the speakers in, so for now, I have two speakers on the back seat until I decide what to do.

Unfortunately, the "S M" (stereo / mono) switch has a broken prong on the inside, so the switch is basically in-op until I figure out a way to fix it. For now, it's set to stereo as a default, and I just have to make sure no one touches it, or I'll have to open the radio to flip the switch back to stereo. (yes, it works, but only one way to mono).

Also, I'm missing the black slider bar that switches the radio from AM to FM. I still think it looks okay, though.

Other than that it sounds fantastic, tunes and holds the stations well... and looks nice in my dash.

Thanks for the encouragement.
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

ClassicCamper · Samba Member Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679

I took a little break with the 412 as I was driving last month and at a traffic light, the engine started sounding like a... well, it's tough to explain but it was like a panting dog; almost like a loud breathing sound. Odd.

Then the engine idle started bouncing around while stopped, particularly when sitting in "D". I recall I had this problem a while ago, so it's a matter of sorting through the 200+ pages of stickys. It only happens after the engine has warmed up. (about 15 minutes). A few days later, I checked the valves, timing, and the gap of the points. All looking good.

It sounds very similar to a thread I was reading by Jun246, however, the idle only starts fluctuating after the car has warmed up. Never when it's cold. So, I'm sure I'll figure it out. I replaced most everything at some juncture.

Fast forward to tonight... I drove the car around and the breathing sound has disappeared and the engine handles idle fairly well. Prior to that, the breathing sound was so loud, I was convinced there was a gaping hole in something. So, I'm quite surprised it disappeared. I searched far and wide and could not find a source where was coming from.

The idle now only bounces around when the air conditioner is on, and I'm pretty sure the idle adjustment is as high as it goes. I do have the A/C running on a separate battery under the passenger seat. I'm sure it has to do with the drag from the compressor.

It was nice to drive it around today. The outside temp was a sunny 88F with high humidity. The inside of the car was 75 degrees with the A/C on. It warms up a little bit when in traffic, but overall it is really comfortable. The under-dash blower really pushes a lot of air into the interior and I'm really satisfied with it. I just need to work on the evaporator drain tubes and should be in good shape.

Even with the fan on medium, it still pushes a lot of cool air into the cabin. It's not ice cold like a new car, but it certainly works and all the occupants are comfortable. You definitely need to open the windows until the air comes cold.

Drag in the engine is minimal when driving. With the sun and outside temp, the compressor didn't turn off. I turned it off manually with the temp switch to see if it tugs on the engine -- it doesn't. (except when idling, mentioned above)

Most likely, if I had a larger condenser, air would blow out ice cold. However, I'm only working with a small amount of space in the spare tire well and the condenser has a small fan on it. The condenser ducting is such that it serves as an air scoop when the car is in motion, which helps with the cold air inside. Gilmore engineered that one for me.

I'm really satisfied with the air conditioning and it was worth the extra effort. Hopefully, I'll sort out the hunting idle issue and find the source of that breathing sound. Ray's post in Jun246's thread is a helpful starting point.

---

I'll try to post some more pictures of the A/C system when I get a chance. I also turned the gas heater on briefly to keep it in good order Very Happy

Hopefully, everyone is doing well and I'll try to post some updated pics!

- Ron
_________________
1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert

Pepperbilly · Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2021 8:19 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days..

Ron,

Good to hear from you again! Been a long time... The radio looks great! It's always a fun challenge to get these old devices working again. The panting issue seems odd. Can't say I've run across that one before. , short of the idle compensator hunting.
My wagon is going into the body and paint shop next week. Things are moving along slowly but trying to do the right thing the first time. My 412 project slowed because I was busy making corrections on my '67 Westy. That happens because some things were not done correctly. I am finally happy with it. I am also still looking for front and rear bumper impact rubber for the wagon. Did you ever find any? Later

Bill


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